Struggling financially and getting frustrated?

[GreyGhost]

Builders purchase contracts are completely, 100% one sided. If buyers on mass refused to sign then those contracts wouldn't exist.
I also wonder how many potential buyers actually have their lawyer look at those purchase agreements and fully explain them.
My guess, most don't.
Hey why spend $400 -$500 to understand and protect yourself from the biggest purchase of your life.

Because you're wasting your $500? The lawyer will want to make edits to protect you or they will tell you not to sign. The builder will say sign it as originally written or get out of the way and the next person in line will sign it.

If you want to try to make money on pre-construction housing, you accept the crap contract and hope for a gold-plated return. Alternatively you buy existing housing stock and have a more meaningful negotiation but more often than not achieve a lower rate of return over a short period.

 

[GreyGhost]

I'm not sure I would ever buy a "new build", unless custom free standing home. The quality is cheap, the fixtures are often terrible and you dont know what will get built in front of you. So many condos by the lake lost the view, Burl, Oakville, Miss, Toronto all got cooked on this one.

But for so many, buying new is the only way into the market, and they line up 300 people deep.

They're not dumb. Each site is sold and built from the north to the south. Selling lake views across five buildings nets them a ton of coin. There are a few buildings that will maintain they're view, but they are the exception.

If I were to move again, I would probably build it myself. I am just so disappointed in tearing out almost everything that can be torn out and doing it again properly. It would have cost 10% more the first time, instead we are at 150% because we are throwing out a lot of time and material to replace with proper selections.

 

[nobbie48]

They're not dumb. Each site is sold and built from the north to the south. Selling lake views across five buildings nets them a ton of coin. There are a few buildings that will maintain they're view, but they are the exception.

If I were to move again, I would probably build it myself. I am just so disappointed in tearing out almost everything that can be torn out and doing it again properly. It would have cost 10% more the first time, instead we are at 150% because we are throwing out a lot of time and material to replace with proper selections.

Buddy living on the GTA fringe hired the best contractor in town to do a massive addition. Hole is dug and a call comes from the helipile guy that he's on his way. Then they discover the elevations are wrong and the back hoe is gone. Fortunately it was resolve by pick and shovel.

Then it rained and one side wall collapsed.

Then he is advised that there will be a step or two from the new and old sections due to drainage issues. It's already fully framed and no one is going to pay for the teardown and rebuild. The forgiveness vs permission bit. Suck it up.

It isn't always the builder. I was talking to one of the owners of a major development firm and he commented that they get people wanting delete options on mega homes so they can afford them. Delete option the wide baseboards and trims to put in 2" crap in rooms with 10 foot ceilings. Delete decent flooring and cupboards to bring the numbers down. Fix those later.

Don't get me started on shabby chic. Lumber trim painted a snazzy colour. Make-up on a pig.

 

[nobbie48]

I know several friends who bought new builds at presale who made out like bandits, walking away a few years later with hundreds of thousands in their pockets.

There's also stories of it going the other way. I can't seem to find the story with a quick google search, but there was a presale neighbourhood somewhere out this way that ended up losing significant value between what people bought in at and what the houses ended up going on the market for when they were actually completed. IIRC some of the new homeowners (some of whom hadn't even taken possession yet) tried to get out of their deals (and others tried to sue IIRC) and were all told to suck it - you signed on the dotted line at X price, now you own it.

A couple of decades back a colleague had a decent house but wanted to move up, going for a presale. The market was hot so he bought and was going to wait six months to let his old place appreciate some more. The market crashed but the ink was dry on the new place and he took a bath on the old one. He could have bought his way out of the new deal but it likely would have cost him more. He would be in the same house with nothing to show for his bigger mortgage.

It even hits those with decent equity in housing. Buy then sell or sell then buy?

Buy and then sell, you hope to get your price but may not. The agents aren't angels or psychics. If you go cautious you may not get the place you could have afforded if you had a crystal ball.

Sell then buy and the place you had your eye on was snapped up by someone else. Now you go shopping in a rising market and you have a deadline.

The last time we did a conditional offer and were disappointed it fell through. It was the best thing that could have happened as a better deal came along later. The house was fine but the location has turned into a parking ghetto.

 

[AllistonGT]

The lawyer will want to make edits to protect you or they will tell you not to sign. The builder will say sign it as originally written or get out of the way and the next person in line will sign it.

Yes, thats correct. But the buyer will understand the risks and accept the consequences.

 

[Mad Mike]

I know several friends who bought new builds at presale who made out like bandits, walking away a few years later with hundreds of thousands in their pockets.

There's also stories of it going the other way. I can't seem to find the story with a quick google search, but there was a presale neighbourhood somewhere out this way that ended up losing significant value between what people bought in at and what the houses ended up going on the market for when they were actually completed. IIRC some of the new homeowners (some of whom hadn't even taken possession yet) tried to get out of their deals (and others tried to sue IIRC) and were all told to suck it - you signed on the dotted line at X price, now you own it.

I can tell you what happens when it goes the other way. It's not pretty. I made a ****-ton of money buying prebuilds from 85-89, ended up giving everything back and in the 89-90 market correction. I was lucky, I did end up making a bit, some of my friends that did the same ended up bust.

 

[bigpoppa]

There's also the option of gtfo of onterrible

Seriously considering it right now, impossible to find work here right now, impossible to buy a house unless you got some serious coin to drop, looking at other provinces

Was looking at houses, got some interesting stories, I might create a thread about it

 

[Deleted member 50930]

There's also the option of gtfo of onterrible

Seriously considering it right now, impossible to find work here right now, impossible to buy a house unless you got some serious coin to drop, looking at other provinces

Was looking at houses, got some interesting stories, I might create a thread about it

Where to though?

 

[ChrisCBR]

Fact is he might be a lot more ahead. My young neighbour bought his house for 420k 8 years ago. He put 40k down and I’m guessing paid 25k per year in mortgage and taxes, probably 10k per year more than renting. If you figure the initial 40k and another 90 k over and above renting, he was in $130k deep. He sold in Jan for $1.3, netting $840k after retiring his mortgage and paying realty commissions. Pretty good for a 130k investment - also tax free.

His case isnt something that should be considered normal. A 13% annual return on a property for almost a decade.
With rates approaching zero, stagnating wages, record household debt and a government that is going to need to take back the billions it paid out thanks to Covid, I wouldnt expect a 13% annual return in the coming decade.

 

[bigpoppa]

Where to though?

Got inlaws in NB, just applied to a job in sask and NB

 

[mimico_polak]

Got inlaws in NB, just applied to a job in sask and NB

Have some friends in Saskatoon....they all love it and wouldn’t go back (people that have lived all over Canada).

 

[AllistonGT]

Yes homes are cheaper on the east coast. Won't those homes be the same price in 10 years. No real appreciation?

 

[oioioi]

I have a friend who is moving back to rural NB to help out with a family business as its starting to pick up.
He is an engineer,(Civil I think) working for a local Toronto company. As he moves back to NB, he gets to continue working for this firm. Covid served him well, as he was able to show them that he can do the same work remotely. They are fine with him being in another province and will just fly in if needed but he is not expecting that be to too often.

Moving back was always his plan, but now it comes with a bonus of keeping his current job.

 

[bigpoppa]

Yes homes are cheaper on the east coast. Won't those homes be the same price in 10 years. No real appreciation?

Not sure about appreciation, but if I find work in my field and make advancement, live an affordable and comfortable lifestyle, can pay off the mortgage 10 years quicker, pay peanuts in motorcycle insurance, avoid the traffic and crappy roads in ontario etc thats fine by me

 

[Hack]

Fact is he might be a lot more ahead. My young neighbour bought his house for 420k 8 years ago. He put 40k down and I’m guessing paid 25k per year in mortgage and taxes, probably 10k per year more than renting. If you figure the initial 40k and another 90 k over and above renting, he was in $130k deep. He sold in Jan for $1.3, netting $840k after retiring his mortgage and paying realty commissions. Pretty good for a 130k investment - also tax free.

What were the rules eight years ago..? $40k on a $420K house is <10% down...

 

[J_F]

Not sure about appreciation, but if I find work in my field and make advancement, live an affordable and comfortable lifestyle, can pay off the mortgage 10 years quicker, pay peanuts in motorcycle insurance, avoid the traffic and crappy roads in ontario etc thats fine by me

only way that worked for me in the trades was to hit the road
away from the fam 3/4 of the time

but they were comfortable and the wife/kiddos didn't have to change anything
that is a Dad's role, and only you'll know if what you'll miss was worth the time away

 

[nobbie48]

Yes homes are cheaper on the east coast. Won't those homes be the same price in 10 years. No real appreciation?

Also time on market is a factor if you have to move. In Toronto houses sell in a week or two. I've heard many, many months in N.S.

 

[nakkers]

Also time on market is a factor if you have to move. In Toronto houses sell in a week or two. I've heard many, many months in N.S.

Just depends on where you go in the specific regions.

For instance, Halifax/Bedford is doing well real estate wise.

Moncton in NB is doing well too.
Both are doing well the last decade including recently.

Not in the same manner as Toronto or Vancouver but, doing good.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Mad Mike]

I had a chance to relo to Moncton last year. There were only 3 homes available between 600 and 750k, they were pretty nice and had some land, one had an 8 car toy shed. I could buy a modest house similar to what I have now for $225k.

Too far from the fam, a bit sleepy for me.

 

[mimico_polak]

only way that worked for me in the trades was to hit the road
away from the fam 3/4 of the time

but they were comfortable and the wife/kiddos didn't have to change anything
that is a Dad's role, and only you'll know if what you'll miss was worth the time away

This is where we are at. I’m in an industry where the projects don’t come to you...so we made the call to give it a whirl.
it’ll be 2 years now working remote in BC.

Is it tough? Yes
Hard on the family? More on me than them at times
Financially rewarding? Good Lord yes

I justify it to myself as I’m helping our family have a better life. It’s helped us pay of all debt except mortgage, live in a nicer area/home, and allow my wife not to work. We live frugally and I’ve set it all up when I return to my normal salary, we are still good.

having said that, with COVID, project upheaval, I may end up home sooner rather than later. But we planned for this and I can take 3 months off to be with the kids.