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Bicycle Protests

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Thousands of people use Lakeshore Blvd. daily. Why should it be blocked off for 4-5 days for some special interest groups like car racing enthusiasts?


Ah, it's only events/activities that you're fond of that should get special treatment. Everyone else can pound sand. Got it.
Wrong. I don't give a hoot about Indy racing but if once in a while I'm inconvenienced by an event that has no other option I'm OK with it. I'm OK with the High Park 5 Mile bike race once a year. Same with marathons and Ride for Sight.

What I'm against is a bunch of self serving individuals taking over a major Toronto Park. I'm thinking the lycra crowd driving the joggers away and then the BMX takes over the woodland trails. The number of special interest groups is vast.

There is a BMX track at Centennial, bult for the Pan-Ams and it's usually locked. Why?

The problem is that although the modern bicycle preceded the car by a quarter century, once the internal combustion engine took over, the west became car oriented until late in the 20th century. By then urban land was largly gone.

BTW how many people spend big bucks at Indy? The last High Park 5 Miler I attended didn't have 50 spectators and there were no fees, no $20 beers or $5 bags of chips.
 
I don't see a problem with them having 6-8 am to ride at a decent training ride pace. The park is supposed to be for everybody.
There are plenty of places to ride bicycles at a training clip.

How about High Park gives 6-8am on odd days to cyclists, even days for motorcyclists? Why should we have yo ho sll the way yo Shannonville to train?
 
Like many things in life.

Someone was out riding their brakes. Someone else stepped in front, and got clocked. Calls were made. Enforcement was started.

We've got narrow mixed use paths, with lots of yield to pedestrians, max 20 kph signs, and I've had several unannounced close calls over the years.
That's with me walking to the left (facing traffic) and at the very edge of the path most of the time.
An elderly couple I know walk the trails early in the morning to avoid being buzzed by the cyclists. They are intimidated into a time frame.

It isn't just the city. I know cottagers that do their canoeing early in the AM as well to avoid the jet skis and water rockets.

A big part of the problem is that if car and motorcycle drivers habitually acted as agressively as the some cyclists and as stupid as some joggers, skate boarders and pedestrians the motor vehicle owners they actually end up financially paying for their behaviour. Sometimes without trials.
 
I wouldn't say that cyclists riding 30-35 is fast enough to take it to the track. As you already know, riding around the track is a substantially different experience in almost every way. The cyclists are arguing that they should be able to do ~50-100 km ride safely. I can only imagine how your body would feel after 200-400 laps of the track.
I think cyclists in this instance are arguing they are special, and therefor should be able to use public roads exempt from rules.

My wife does 50-80km rides regularly thru York Region on uncongested roads. The roads have proven safe for her and she can roll WOT thru the countryside.

No special track required. Respecting speed and other road rules.
 
I think cyclists in this instance are arguing they are special, and therefor should be able to use public roads exempt from rules.
For 2 hours a day in the wee hours of the morning, when almost no one else is there. Yes, we're asking for the moon.
 
I walk my dog every morning on paths and trails near my house... I encounter cyclist all the time.. most are decent about their riding and passing. If they call out, whistle or bell.. I will try to get out of their way.
About a month ago... a cyclist, that appeared to be more into it than most.. called out "on the left"... I was already to the right side of the path... but my leashed dog was on the other side. I figured easier if I cross over to the left side that the dog was on.. as she's not a dog that is easily pulled and not a dog that a anyone wants to spook.. she will go into "defense" mode.
I made it across but the guy did have to slow as I did. I actually apologized as I crossed but He stopped and started arguing with me about "next time I'll ride through" you... I politely let him know why I jumped across and that if I didn't he would have hit the leash.. and probably been attacked when he did. He sprayed me with his water bottle, called me some names... I kicked his bike over and stomped his rim hard enough to bend it.
I see the guy occasionally since... and now I usually make a point of getting in his way.
 

I'm one of those lycra cyclists who "took over" High Park last Sunday - this is my own footage above. I will preface this by saying that they shouldn't have called it a "takeover" since the idea was to propose a sharing solution. The name is needlessly combative. And why the event was scheduled on a Sunday is also a mystery to me - the average road cycling enthusiast is mostly looking for a venue for mid-week workouts. Weekends are for long rides out of town.

Cycling training requires lots of volume. We don't think we're special - that's just the sport. All of us are hyper-alert when looping HP and I have yet to witness a single incident there.

There is also the loop around The Ex which I use regularly, but that one is regularly closed without warning and the surface is rough.

If you're a runner, ask yourself how you would feel if you were asked to run half as fast as your normal training pace in the name of "safety", when accident data and common sense already show that you're simply not a great source of danger.

I know that public opinion is squarely against me on this topic.

I'll see myself out.
I'm open to suggestions and open minded discussions. The situation is complex.

Health Canada tells us to exercise but doesn't give us any help. We pay taxes on gym memberships that theoretically reduce medicare costs. The obesity epidemic and assosiated costs, escalating as the years go on. This is a long term investment that won't pay off for decades. Meanwhile higher taxes to feed the program means fewer people being able to buy their dream home.

We are told that we have to expect higher population densities. The single family home dream is fading like cheap cotton.

New subdivisions have minimal facilities. Developers slice the pie with a sharp knife.

Slugging jobs started fading after WWII as machines took over with TV and a bag of chips becoming the normal end of the day. Find your own solution to your beer belly.

Life is vanilla pudding if you toe the line. A lot of people are prepared to accept that. If you aren't, how do you do your thing without stomping on the rights of the ones that are OK with vanilla pudding?

If the goal of the cyclist is exercise it can be done at low speeds but it isn't fun and it's harder to stay at it.

The big need is land and it isn't cheap. Cheap land is far from the city so an evening lap or two isn't realistic. Weekend jaunts would require accommodations.

Add in the list of expected land uses. This started with bicycles but the whole solution includes skate boards, e-bikes, joggers, runners.

The government will build new roads based on road taxes. Where does the money come from for bicycle tracks? NFMP says the motorist, Not From My Pocket

The solution is higher taxes, the death knell for a politician.

Sharing requires critical thinking. You don't have to study trail interactions. Just go to a supermarket and see the carts blocking the aisles as Mr or Mrs Dumass brouse across from their cart, oblivious to others. Follow them to the parking lot where they walk down the middle of the driveway blocking traffic on their way to their poorly parked car. Watch them drive home monopolizing the left lane.

Watch the mom's and dads walk their kids without telling them to look out for traffic.

Try correcting anyone that is obviously misusing a pathway or trail and you get F*** Y*******

Two choices, billions in land costs (Taxes) or educating the public. No government is going to offer more than crumbs.

In the mean time people become more confrontational.
 
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Can't you guys ride to the speed limits on the roads?
If you speed in your car, it's on you. You pay or fight the ticket, take the points & insurance bump.
On a bike you pay the fine and you're scott free. If you can afford the bike, the shorts, shoes and shirt, you can afford the fine.
 
I walk my dog every morning on paths and trails near my house... I encounter cyclist all the time.. most are decent about their riding and passing. If they call out, whistle or bell.. I will try to get out of their way.
About a month ago... a cyclist, that appeared to be more into it than most.. called out "on the left"... I was already to the right side of the path... but my leashed dog was on the other side. I figured easier if I cross over to the left side that the dog was on.. as she's not a dog that is easily pulled and not a dog that a anyone wants to spook.. she will go into "defense" mode.
I made it across but the guy did have to slow as I did. I actually apologized as I crossed but He stopped and started arguing with me about "next time I'll ride through" you... I politely let him know why I jumped across and that if I didn't he would have hit the leash.. and probably been attacked when he did. He sprayed me with his water bottle, called me some names... I kicked his bike over and stomped his rim hard enough to bend it.
I see the guy occasionally since... and now I usually make a point of getting in his way.

Escalating violence is inevitable.

Some guy on a bike apparently punched a woman on the MG trail. Was it random or was she on the wrong side of the path.
 
If you speed in your car, it's on you. You pay or fight the ticket, take the points & insurance bump.
On a bike you pay the fine and you're scott free. If you can afford the bike, the shorts, shoes and shirt, you can afford the fine.
Doesn't it go on your driving record and hit your insurance?
 
Can't you guys ride to the speed limits on the roads?
We could say the same thing for cars or motorcycles. 90 percent of people in a 50 zone aren't driving 50 unless :
- its congested
- the design of the street limits the speed
- they're old

And the police generally doesn't stop someone going 10-15 km/h in their car. So why fuss over a cyclist doing the exact same.

I've seen so many people get tailgated for going the speed limit, it's not what is expected. So someone hops on their bicycle after being a driver for 15-20 years and you expect them to go the speed limit... Or else be ticketed for it? When they've done it without issue at high speed in 2-ton vehicles?
Once again I call bull$hit on a double standard

Random Anecdote : was enjoying ice cream by myself on lakeshore in South missisauga this evening on a regular Wednesday night. I saw probably 6-7 casual cyclists use the sidewalk in 15 minutes. Probably ranging from. 15y old to 35 y old. Why? There's no infrastructure to get places and lakeshore is too busy (actually only lycra squad or advanced cyclists will feel comfortable enough to cycle on the road there generally) . People will argue that about 500m south of there there's a multi use trail so "they don't use the infrastructure) . But people who need to go places won't make a detour of about 1km to be able to go from point A to point B over small trips, they'll take the unlawful shortcut.
If you don't design proper infrastructure, you create friction points between the various users of your "interface" which leads to undesirable scenarios.
 
Doesn't it go on your driving record and hit your insurance?
I'm going by this:
"tickets being issued to cyclists came with a $125 price tag, more than the cost of many used bikes. In order to get a speeding ticket that high you would have to driving at least 30km/h over the speed limit: Schedule 43 – Last Updated: July 1, 2022 | Ontario Court of Justice @TheBikingLawyer #bikeTO https://t.co/2fosj6KUIE

— Ry Shissler (They/Them) (@RyShissler) July 26, 2021"

Maybe at some point, they'll put in a law that confiscates and auctions your bike if you're found going double the 20kph limit.
 
Was in Bahrain last year, where cyclists could actually "take it to the track". F1 track would run regular track days/nights for cyclists, runners and kids on bicycles, same time, separate circuits. Outer long track for cyclists, inner track for runners, inner track/pits for kids. $5 entry for cyclists, $3 for runners, kids for free.

SmartSelect_20220720-215259_Instagram.jpg
 
don't assume overweight = shorter life span ( which actually would cost less anyways )
The study found that overweight people could expect roughly the same survival odds as those in the normal-weight category. "There was no difference in mortality risk for those who remained overweight and those who remained normal weight," noted Mark Pereira, an epidemiologist at the University of Minnesota.
There are other benefits of course to some cardio ..and I'm finding the eBike a good mix of errand running, enjoying the fine weather and some cardio without triggering my tachycardia.

Infrastructure is vital ..the GTA has 627 km of bike ways against 450km in our tiny city of 150,000.

If the city wants to reduce congestion then building more and better bike paths is a major step and with the surge in ebikes it gets more commuters out of cars as they can get to work without being drenched in sweat ...one reason my doctor is getting one. Then do a workout ride on the way home.

The nasty part is theft for regular bikes, ebikes are heavy so not quite as prone plus have easy built in locks. Save on gas, on parking and often get there faster as they get to 25 kph right quick,
A degree of civility tho needs to be present...with strict speed enforcements here and 1.5 meter stay clear of bicycles law enforced that helps.
There will always be brain dead people that treat two wheelers as second class ( even motorcycles ) but we can see in examples like Copenhagen where they ride all year and bicycle use is catered to ( 4 lanes each way of bike paths in the CBD while cars get one.
Hopefully fuel prices stay high for a while to nudge people away from ICE vehicles for local commutes.
I think public transit is still a stretch while covid is about,.
 
Was in Bahrain last year, where cyclists could actually "take it to the track". F1 track would run regular track days/nights for cyclists, runners and kids on bicycles, same time, separate circuits. Outer long track for cyclists, inner track for runners, inner track/pits for kids. $5 entry for cyclists, $3 for runners, kids for free.

View attachment 56599
Great idea. How many acres is the site? What would the land cost in the GTA? How much is the annual maintenance?

It comes back to money. The home underprivileged would be chanting "Spend the money on us"
 
We could say the same thing for cars or motorcycles. 90 percent of people in a 50 zone aren't driving 50 unless :
- its congested
- the design of the street limits the speed
- they're old

And the police generally doesn't stop someone going 10-15 km/h in their car. So why fuss over a cyclist doing the exact same.

I've seen so many people get tailgated for going the speed limit, it's not what is expected. So someone hops on their bicycle after being a driver for 15-20 years and you expect them to go the speed limit... Or else be ticketed for it? When they've done it without issue at high speed in 2-ton vehicles?
Once again I call bull$hit on a double standard

Random Anecdote : was enjoying ice cream by myself on lakeshore in South missisauga this evening on a regular Wednesday night. I saw probably 6-7 casual cyclists use the sidewalk in 15 minutes. Probably ranging from. 15y old to 35 y old. Why? There's no infrastructure to get places and lakeshore is too busy (actually only lycra squad or advanced cyclists will feel comfortable enough to cycle on the road there generally) . People will argue that about 500m south of there there's a multi use trail so "they don't use the infrastructure) . But people who need to go places won't make a detour of about 1km to be able to go from point A to point B over small trips, they'll take the unlawful shortcut.
If you don't design proper infrastructure, you create friction points between the various users of your "interface" which leads to undesirable scenarios.
Before cars had cup holders, cell phones and electronic orchestras I had no fear of riding the secondary highways from west Toronto to Orangeville, Niagara Falls, Trenton etc. Now I plan short trips in my neighbourhood and take advantage of park routes.

In Toronto you're not supposed to ride on the sidewalk if you're over 14 YO. So a 30 ish mom or dad with a toddler or infant in a bike seat has to ride along Bloor Street???? If you allow them to use the sidewalks it opens the door to a 30 YO Lance Armstrong blasting along the walk.

According to Google maps I could ride my bicycle from the TO Mississauga border to Harbourfront faster than taking the TTC. Under an hour by bike, over an hour by TTC and a half hour by car.

However the bike route prepared by Google would be mostly high volume city streets. I've had my knuckles brushed by door handles and it isn't a comforting feeling. A friend had to hit the ditch to keep from being run over by a moto-texter. No broken bones but he was off work for weeks due to sprains and strains.

Our driving education and subsequent enforcement has to change. More infrastructure without those just gives idiots more places to screw up.

This goes right to the top. You can't change the rules when you cross the Mississauga / Toronto border.

Police have to enforce more than speeding, DUI and red lights. There goes the revenue.

Add DWI to the list of charges, Driving While an Idiot. The fine is a one day course learning why your desire to hog the left lane isn't right and why using a turn signal isn't all that bad. A second charge gets you the week long course. Fines don't work.

Bicycles need to follow the same rules. E-bikes and their ilk have their place but need to be legislated. They need plates and the riders need some form of licence, even like the boat operator's card with ID. It's a written exam that tells you that you can't do anything you want. We were on the Yonge Street sidewalk around noon on a nice summer day and it was crowded. An overweight person on an ebike (Total weight over 500 pounds) was trying to weave through the pedestrians. Further north an ebike was riding the wrong way on Yonge.

We need massive law changes or massive attitude changes. It's not going to happen under current leadership.
 
Was in Bahrain last year, where cyclists could actually "take it to the track". F1 track would run regular track days/nights for cyclists, runners and kids on bicycles, same time, separate circuits. Outer long track for cyclists, inner track for runners, inner track/pits for kids. $5 entry for cyclists, $3 for runners, kids for free.

View attachment 56599
Montreal does the same thing with its F1 circuit. Last time I went was a long time ago and it was free, I assume it still is. It's awesome.
 
Montreal does the same thing with its F1 circuit. Last time I went was a long time ago and it was free, I assume it still is. It's awesome.
It is awesome. Took my Genesis Coupe there...the 30kph (or something stupid low) speed limit sucked though.

But 2 runs on the course to make sure there's no police....and you could have some fun on that track right quick.

Good times.
 
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