Will the real Pierre Poilievre please stand up?

[PrivatePilot]

He's now waiting on a CT scan and if it's longer then a month he's going to go back to buffalo.

I've had my last 3 or 4 CT's in anywhere from hours to weeks. Hours, last December when I had my head injury and ended up in the hospital and they thought I might have a brain bleed. The few times before that, I simply advocated for myself and most importantly, made myself available at all hours of the day and also on short notice cancellation. A few of them were in the middle of the night, one I had literally a few hours notice and drove into Toronto for it.

Key is, I got them in short order, especially when it was an emergency.

Same for things like Ultrasounds. I got quoted 3 months for the last one I needed because the doctors requisition showed a clinic that was booked full. I called around and got one the next day. But a lot of people just call the number on the top of the requisition, get told "we can see you in 3 months", and accept that. Things like Xray and ultrasound clinics are everywhere, you don't need to go to the one on the piece of paper.

Too many people just make one phone call and take what they're told without making any effort to find something better, because there *are* options quite often that people just fail to explore. I guess it's partly the fault of doctors who don't explain things better, and part the fault of people who just don't know better, but there ARE options. My wife works in the medical field and frequently tells people how to explore all those options and frequently gets people that were told they'd have to wait weeks or months for tests in for those tests in days or weeks instead.

 

[jc100]

I know someone doing research into this. It’s very location based even within Canada. The further away from major catchment areas for hospitals people live the higher the morbidity rate for a bunch of things. Unfortunately in Canada there’s a lot of land that’s far away from main hospital catchment areas. Some of our patients here have to travel up to 2-3h from very rural areas if they don’t have transport. Our catchment area goes right up to just south of Ottawa and stretches east and west quite a distance especially for the regional cancer centre we have. In essence the issue is one of transport.

Edit: I’ll elaborate a bit on this because what I wrote above seems to just be common sense. The issue is more severe with people who have life threatening illness where treatment COULD either help with longevity or increase quality of life. Many simply choose to not seek treatment due to distances and the trouble they think they will cause and time involved. As explained to me the situation is quite sad. The solution is outreach and volunteer transport in a lot of cases.

 

[Evoex]

I've had my last 3 or 4 CT's in anywhere from hours to weeks. Hours, last December when I had my head injury and ended up in the hospital and they thought I might have a brain bleed. The few times before that, I simply advocated for myself and most importantly, made myself available at all hours of the day and also on short notice cancellation. A few of them were in the middle of the night, one I had literally a few hours notice and drove into Toronto for it.

Key is, I got them in short order, especially when it was an emergency.

Same for things like Ultrasounds. I got quoted 3 months for the last one I needed because the doctors requisition showed a clinic that was booked full. I called around and got one the next day. But a lot of people just call the number on the top of the requisition, get told "we can see you in 3 months", and accept that. Things like Xray and ultrasound clinics are everywhere, you don't need to go to the one on the piece of paper.

Too many people just make one phone call and take what they're told without making any effort to find something better, because there *are* options quite often that people just fail to explore. I guess it's partly the fault of doctors who don't explain things better, and part the fault of people who just don't know better, but there ARE options. My wife works in the medical field and frequently tells people how to explore all those options and frequently gets people that were told they'd have to wait weeks or months for tests in for those tests in days or weeks instead.

Bingo.

He's called every private/public clinic that process OHIP that he can find and closest date was 2.5 months away, so far.

 

[FullMotoJacket]

We still have free health care.

Free health care? So no one pays for it? And you teach? Now it's starting to make sense.

 

[Mad Mike]

Yeah yeah, we pay taxes for our "Free healthcare".

In the end, even those who pay very little taxes for whatever reason ultimately...get healthcare.

No matter how you look at it or what arguments you make for or against it, I'll take it any day of the week over the shitshow in the USA, and I'll gladly keep paying my taxes to fund it. I've had a few surgeries (one being a 12 hour neurosurgery, plus my 3-4 hour shoulder reconstruction) that would have literally bankrupted us in the USA. Or rather, wouldn't have bankrupted us because I probably would never have had them done to begin with as I couldn't afford them.

So instead I'd be living my life risking severe spinal damage if I bent, fell, or twisted the wrong way (My reality before I had that issue fixed), and in constant debilitating pain from a full thickness rotator cuff tear that I'd have to live with for the rest of my life. That doesn't include things like many broken bones, etc etc etc over the years.

Please, take my money.

My guess is you work in a profession where your $5000 annual healthcare plan for your family would be paid by your employer.

Your shoulder would have been scheduled a week after diagnosis, saving you a year of agony. Same for the brain transplant and broken bones.

I had a neck operation 3 days after diagnosis when I lived there 20?years back. It’s getting a scheduled redo in November, till then I get to suffer.

 

[jc100]

Free health care? So no one pays for it? And you teach? Now it's starting to make sense.

You pay your access to it in taxes which you cannot generally avoid paying but you’re not paying fee for service. I know you prefer to look for cheap shots but that’s fine. I’ve taught less capable students that also need a patient approach when they act out. Have you tried yoga?

 

[FullMotoJacket]

You pay your access to it in taxes.

So health care is not free.

 

[TK4]

So health care is not free.

Just like CPP you pay into it and reap the benefits as necessary. As Dr. Nick Riviera said, "If you die, you don't pay !"

 

[FullMotoJacket]

Just like CPP you pay into it and reap the benefits as necessary. As Dr. Nick Riviera said, "If you die, you don't pay !"

Exactly. We have universal health care. Outside of subsidized outliers like homeless and disabled who can't or shouldn't pay, it is not free*.

*unless there's some new LIbEral mandated definition of the word free that I'm not aware of.

 

[PrivatePilot]

Bingo.

He's called every private/public clinic that process OHIP that he can find and closest date was 2.5 months away, so far.

I might suggest that his priority category isn't particularly high then, he should ask for a new referral if indeed it is something urgent.

If the referring doctor categorizes it as low priority, the people actually doing them certainly take this into consideration when prioritizing appointments.

 

[Evoex]

I might suggest that his priority category isn't particularly high then, he should ask for a new referral if indeed it is something urgent.

If the referring doctor categorizes it as low priority, the people actually doing them certainly take this into consideration when prioritizing appointments.

Bigger issue;

Long story short he had infected tissue surgically removed and it’s now healing. However he noticed a month ago or so that it still seemed to be infected and that they may not have dissected it all. So he had a conference call with his surgeon in Edmonton after waiting 3 weeks for him to return from vacation. They agreed that he may need another surgery (his 5th) and to get a CT before scheduling it. By waiting 3 months for a scheduled CT his body will heal up and the surgery will be more invasive. So he’d like to get back under the knife sooner rather than later.

Basically he’s had a hole in his body for years and he’s just tired of it at this point. It’s prevented him from working (50% LTD salary), furthering his career and starting a family.

 

[PrivatePilot]

Bigger issue;

Long story short he had infected tissue surgically removed and it’s now healing. However he noticed a month ago or so that it still seemed to be infected and that they may not have dissected it all. So he had a conference call with his surgeon in Edmonton after waiting 3 weeks for him to return from vacation. They agreed that he may need another surgery (his 5th) and to get a CT before scheduling it. By waiting 3 months for a scheduled CT his body will heal up and the surgery will be more invasive. So he’d like to get back under the knife sooner rather than later.

Basically he’s had a hole in his body for years and he’s just tired of it at this point. It’s prevented him from working (50% LTD salary), furthering his career and starting a family.

That stinks. He should get into his doctor(s) about the issue then and have them advocate on his behalf, or change his priority to urgent. Or he could just go to emerg with whatever reasons he needs to come up with...and quite possibly get one while he's there.

Sometimes things fall through the cracks admittedly and this sounds like one of them.

 

[spitRR]

My guess is you work in a profession where your $5000 annual healthcare plan for your family would be paid by your employer.

Your shoulder would have been scheduled a week after diagnosis, saving you a year of agony. Same for the brain transplant and broken bones.

I had a neck operation 3 days after diagnosis when I lived there 20?years back. It’s getting a scheduled redo in November, till then I get to suffer.

I shouldn't have laughed, but I did

 

[Mad Mike]

...

Meanwhile best friend has been on medical long term disability for about 5 years now and has gone across the boarder previously for an MRI when he was told 7 month wait here. Got it done in buffalo next day for $800 iirc. He's now waiting on a CT scan and if it's longer then a month he's going to go back to buffalo.

That seems odd. My local hospital has both, I had a CT done on my knees the same day I saw the Orthopod, no wait. I opted to go on a waitlist for a less urgent shoulder MRI, that wait was 3 weeks.

When I was coaching hockey, I'd have a few players a year get checked for concussions. They had CT scans done immediately.

Go to Markham Stouffville Hospital with your friend. After parking, punch him in the face then run him into emergency. I'll bet he gets his CT scan right away.

 

[Mad Mike]

So why is the expected lifespan of your average person higher in Canada than the US?

Mainly because our restaurants serve cheeseburgers and fries in way smaller portions. And our liquor and smokes cost twice as much.

Level those playing fields and I'll bet we're even.

 

[GreyGhost]

Mainly because our restaurants serve cheeseburgers and fries in way smaller portions. And our liquor and smokes cost twice as much.

Level those playing fields and I'll bet we're even.

And we don't have millions of undocumented immigrants afraid/unable to find healthcare. I don't like averages for most statistical analysis as they are often very skewed by the outliers. For instance, high infant mortality rips the average down quickly. Median is much more interesting to me. Median is also much harder to find.

 

[timtune]

Ah yes, the cherrypicking exercise has begun. Let's just throw away the majority of history for the sake of arguing on the Internet with petty little gotchas.

Did you miss the point? I only poke holes when you make ridiculous blanket statements. Tighten up your message so there aren't so many "cherries" left over maybe.

 

[Brian P]

And we don't have millions of undocumented immigrants afraid/unable to find healthcare. I don't like averages for most statistical analysis as they are often very skewed by the outliers. For instance, high infant mortality rips the average down quickly. Median is much more interesting to me. Median is also much harder to find.

On a related note ... why is infant mortality in Canada significantly lower than in the USA?

(there are quite a few countries with a lower rate than Canada has ... most of Europe + Japan + Australia + NZ + South Korea)

 

[GreyGhost]

On a related note ... why is infant mortality in Canada significantly lower than in the USA?

(there are quite a few countries with a lower rate than Canada has ... most of Europe + Japan + Australia + NZ + South Korea)

My guess without research is accessible healthcare. When you are poor and/or undocumented you quite likely have both physical obstacles to health care (distance to healthcare facility) and financial ones. There are some pretty poor towns (and states) in the US. For the most part, canada doesn't have as many health care black holes (our reserves obviously have issues but we pick up the medivac flights to mitigate the risk somewhat).

 

[Shaman]

Did you miss the point? I only poke holes when you make ridiculous blanket statements. Tighten up your message so there aren't so many "cherries" left over maybe.

Except it wasn't a ridiculous blanket statement. It was a statement of fact. Uncontrovertible fact, actually. There was a time that the sun didn't set on the British empire and the same was true of the Roman empire in its day. These are facts. Both of those civilizations brought tremendous improvements in living quality, housing, water quality, healthcare, and many other innovations that the rest of the world did not have before them. They built the modern world as we know it today. These are facts. They don't care about your feelings or your fantasies.