Water damage to house | Page 2 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Water damage to house

We're playing darts in the dark until we know where this is happening. While not a structural issue, one municipality I know of wants a permit if plaster is removed. Doors and windows can be changed without a permit if openings stay the same. Some parts of Toronto needed permits to re-asphalt a driveway. Etobicoke doesn't.

Hamilton wanted a survey for a neighbourhood 90 years old. What moved???

In some municipalities a contractor must provide drawings stamped by an engineer or architect for any work, even like-for-like restorations. A homeowner may be exempt from this extra cost if they do the drawings. Could be a couple of thousand dollars.

With this being an exterior wall the security of your home will be compromised during construction. One trick unethical contractors use is to bid cheap and once the wall is down, suddenly find "Hidden damage" that requires a lot more money. Work stops until you agree and alternate contractors will be unwilling to get involved due to potential legal disputes.
 
GreyGhost said:
Given that this is an exterior wall, it will be structural and should get a permit. In this case, I think that is a worthwhile investment as they gives another competent (theoretically) set of eyes to review the plans and temporary supports so you don't end up on he news with a collapsed house.
Click to expand...
While all exterior walls are structural not all exterior walls are considered load bearing. Modification to load bearing walls and foundations are going to require a engineers stamp on the drawings you submit for permits, or on-site building inspections throughout the process if your municipality accepts that. The vast majority of houses in my municipality would fail building code if they were inspected today so you don't get a lot of neighbours complaining about renovation construction going on a mile down the road, ymmv depending on where you live.

Houses don't fall down as easy as you might think, I've had to demolish a few and they are pretty hard to level to the ground unless you beat them to death with an excavator. I have one to do right now if anyone wants to help, I have my 90$ demolition permit in hand :)
 
Sorry, I worked 12 hour shifts all weekend. I'll get those pics up tonight.
 
2MdJwhEl.jpg

Raised Ranch on poured concrete foundation, ground outside is approx 4 inches below sill plate. There's a brick fascia on the other side that goes up to the top of the i-beam, then turns to siding.

oX0m73Vl.jpg


I was able to pull the OSB apart with my fingers. The tar paper that's between the brick and OSB is soaked, and the brick is damp as it rained for the last 2 days.

5t0Uh5Dl.jpg


Intersecting wall on the side. Other intersecting wall is ok.

e2Opet4l.jpg


quvJKBwl.jpg


I'm guessing that's a water path from the top? Insulation above is where my floor joist is.
 
Outside pics now please
 
I think houses should last forever. With the builders getting away with this stuff one has to ask where are the inspectors.
 
couple things, wear a cartridge mask while pulling out that mouldy wood, not a paper 3m mask. They are different and you need the cartridge mask, and plastic isolate that area from the rest of the house.
Thats a brick veneer , not a brick fascia on the outrside (some will say splitting hairs but its important to understand building terminology, or people get things wrong)
The brick will be anchored to the studs with brick ties, corrugated metal strips that are into the mortar joint and nailed to the stud. You need to pull off all the osb from between the studs, cut it with a zip tool so you get panels, not cornflakes. Then you can get the studs out by finding and cutting off the brick ties.
I'm going to bet that's not tar paper, its scutan sheathing. #15lb asphalt felt paper would likely still be intact, scutan falls apart, but its black and probably met code at the time, or got used anyway.
Well, you found the extent of the damage, now lets see some outside shots. You mentioned siding above the brick, 95% sure there is a transition band that was never installed correctly, caulked, flashed incorrectly or worse the siding guys forgot water runs downhill.
 
Poorly ventilated. First you shouldn't use fibre batt insulation at or below grade, they make styrofoam for that and sheet or spray on styrene is impervious to water. There should be drain holes on the outside of the lowest row of brick to evacuate water and allow air to travel upwards and out the top of the brickwork which has a nominal 1" space for that purpose. Ground below the brick vents need to be well drained.
Seems to me almost 100% of your water damage is from condensation unless you had snow piled up against the outside of that wall.

;) the heck with paying for a permit, the neighbours are not going to see this operation unless you have to attack that brickwork.
 
Blog-Brick-Veneer-Wall.jpg


There is a possibility they failed to incorporate the step in the top of the foundation wall for flashing and brickwork to set on, it's not a requirement but certainly less effective for moving the water outwards without it. Maybe they didn't even flash it and that would really rot, watch for that.
 
Last edited:
Appreciate the input so far.

uNiHs6pl.jpg


Insurance adjuster just left. Said no coverage as it's not sudden damage but over a long time. He believes the paper between the brick and OSB has been holding moisture and not breathing. Said it should be replaced with Tyvek. That means all 4 walls needs to be done. FML.

Also, there's no way there's an inch of clearance between brick and paper, the mortar is smushed up against the paper.
 
Trials, there is flashing protruding from under the brick, between that and the foundation, so they at least did that right.
 
Ok. Structural's not my thing but be very careful with that beam. The beam is resting on a pile of wood that used to be kept from tipping over by your sheathing. Your sheathing is now doing nothing.

IMO it's definitely worth getting some competent eyes in to look at your project. I would take Jeremy up on his offer to help you determine the scope of your problem.

To me, it looks like the brick is set closer to the sheathing than normal and obviously that doesn't work as well as the conventional air gap. Getting Tyvek and sheathing on the outside of the studs without removing the brick is probably impossible. Is the cap on top of your brick a Z or just an L with half the water draining behind the brick?
 
Is that a water downspout on the left of the picture?
 
The flashing on top of the brick looks flat not sloped out that is likely the problem. Are the studs actually rotten? If not you may be able to fix the flashing put tyvek on the brick and spray foam the stud spaces to make everything solid and well insulated. The spray foam will add some rigidity and seal any mould out of the house you need to find and fix the leak first which is going to be at the point where the siding meets the brick it may be possible to strap and push the siding out to the front of the brick to make this less likely in the future.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
 
I wish I could take Jeremy up on his offer but I'm no longer in the GTA, I can see Detroit from my house...

Yes, it's a downspout. I have an 8 foot extension on the bottom of it away from the foundation as are the other ones.

Definitely a z-cap on the brick, I just double-checked.

I soaked the walls in concorbium, as per the estimators recommendations to mitigate the mold. Got all the windows cracked down there as well and the furnace return duct taped shut for now. Best I can do atm.
 
It looks like the first course of siding is sitting into a J mould on top of the flashing. The water is coming down and puddling then seeping. And that light fixture is not correctly installed. And the L moulding on top of the brick course is probably about 1-1.5" tall under the J mould and somebody probably nailed through it and didnt caulk.
Its already F'd inside so take a garden hose and wet the wall and look for seepage.
Fiberglass batts are just fine in your installation, but they do soak up water. Rockwool is a better choice, good luck getting Tyvek on that wall and get an expert opinion on spray foaming that cavity, 1 it will add next to no structural, 2 the OSB was to prevent racking, and once you spray foam you have NO ventilation against the brick. There is a steel product called T bar that goes into the stud wall on an angle from floor to ceiling to prevent racking. You should investigate that.
Know that insurance adjusters know NOTHING about construction. At the least nail some 2x4 across the wall at an angle while you think about things

,
 
The sheer mention of mold worries me. I personally think a house that doesn't have touch of mold is as rare as a bike that has never had the crash bars touch the ground. However some people freak out when they hear the word even if they smoke two packs a day and guzzle gallons of diet soda.

What sellers must disclose about a home: Ask Joe | The Star

If you're going through all this repair it would be wise to document the mold remediation.

I hate it when this crap happens. I'm not an estimator in this field but it is going to be a massive bill. All because someone didn't have the brains or ethics to do something right.
 
Would there be any point in contacting the original builder? They're still around town.

I let one neighbour know about my issues, he said he'd rather not know what's behind the drywall. Other neighbour is on vacation but I'll give him a heads up. This may potentially affect the whole neighbourhood as they were all done at the same time by the same builder.
 
DJM said:
Would there be any point in contacting the original builder? They're still around town.

I let one neighbour know about my issues, he said he'd rather not know what's behind the drywall. Other neighbour is on vacation but I'll give him a heads up. This may potentially affect the whole neighbourhood as they were all done at the same time by the same builder.
Click to expand...

if the builder is still selling houses, then by all means, I'd contact them
with a house@ 18 years old, no point in being confrontational about it
but they may be interested in seeing what's going on and helping a bit

after seeing the pics, not that this is my cup of tea
but it really doesn't look all that bad
the structural lumber should dry out if you can give it an opportunity to - rent a fan

like stated, that OSB needs to go, and you need to work out a vapor barrier/moisture barrier
between the brick and whatever you do for sheeting
and I like the spray foam idea, especially if it's toxic stuff
kill the gremlins in that wall

that is all, I'm out, good luck
 
crankcall said:
Fiberglass batts are just fine in your installation, but they do soak up water. Rockwool is a better choice, good luck getting Tyvek on that wall and get an expert opinion on spray foaming that cavity, 1 it will add next to no structural, 2 the OSB was to prevent racking, and once you spray foam you have NO ventilation against the brick. There is a steel product called T bar that goes into the stud wall on an angle from floor to ceiling to prevent racking. You should investigate that.
Know that insurance adjusters know NOTHING about construction. At the least nail some 2x4 across the wall at an angle while you think about things

,
Click to expand...
I'd probably be putting a layer of OSB or ply on the inside to give me back a shear wall. Drywall on top of that to may it disappear. The devil is in the details in this repair though. I also wouldn't be putting spray foam up against the back of the brick, that's just asking to blow the brick veneer apart. Spray foam may be a decent choice, but i'd be using vertical battens with building wrap and sheathing between the studs to maintain the air gap and allow the veneer to drain.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom