The Bad Drivers of Ontario Thread

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I absolutely hate this crap. I saw ice coming off a truck's roof but thought it was from a different truck, and missed the bits that I later saw in the video. This hit HARD. I accelerated to try and get past it but only managed to make it hit the roof, instead of busting out my windscreen. Fortunately no damage.

 
And remember, people, that legally they are responsible for damage to your vehicle as the HTA was amended in something like 2014. There's a $1000.00 fine to commercial vehicles for it ($500.00 to personal vehicles).
 
Rob MacLennan said:
I absolutely hate this crap. I saw ice coming off a truck's roof but thought it was from a different truck, and missed the bits that I later saw in the video. This hit HARD. I accelerated to try and get past it but only managed to make it hit the roof, instead of busting out my windscreen. Fortunately no damage.

Click to expand...

The problem reminds me of how to win a hockey game. It's easy, just score more goals than the other team.

I was involved in a study of the ice problems caused by the CN Tower. A few decades back they shut down the Gardener Expressway.


A number of Toronto Commercial high rise buildings have the same problem with ice shedding from wall panels and the solutions are like the win a hockey game analogy, just get rid of the ice. No one has figured out exactly how yet.

Aircraft have the same problem but what's another million or two for deicing systems.

Cars have the problem as well but the lower altitude and size can minimize the damage. But wait! If you order at the right time a car can become worse, all for the same price.

A cargo van with an unheated box doesn't tend to melt a snow load and snow doesn't have the impact of a sheet of ice. People in cars don't like to freeze so they turn on interior heat which melts the bottom of the snow load. Due to the different R factors of ice and snow the bottom layer freezes to the roof panel until a combination of factors lets the roof panel release the sheet of ice into the following car's windshield.

The truck issue could be solved by only hiring sixteen foot tall drivers and issuing them with long handled brooms. For shorter drivers they would require working at heights certification in an industry where a lot of them begrudge needing driver's licences or insurance.

Electrically heating the roof of a semi would require an electrical power source equivalent to a 100 amp residential service. You can't just let the melt water drip off as it would, under many conditions, run down the sides of the box and at some point, shed from there. Boost the power source four times to cover the sides and ends of the box. Maybe you could do those with eaves troughs and downspouts.

There are numerous possible solutions but I've yet to see one that is universally practical other than don't build high things, anything over shoulder height.
 
Rob MacLennan said:
And remember, people, that legally they are responsible for damage to your vehicle as the HTA was amended in something like 2014. There's a $1000.00 fine to commercial vehicles for it ($500.00 to personal vehicles).
Click to expand...
I wasn't aware of the fine. How does one pursue a settlement?

Do fines from violating the HTA go to the government or the victim? Assuming they go to the government, how does the injured party get compensation and how long does it take? A lot of insurers don't cover glass anymore.

Who is responsible for the settlement? I assume again the driver is responsible for the fine, likely paying the court. If the tractor and trailer are owned by different ententes who does the victim have to deal with, especially if plates are covered with snow.

It's a big problem and people have died. They're collateral damage.
 
nobbie48 said:
The problem reminds me of how to win a hockey game. It's easy, just score more goals than the other team.

I was involved in a study of the ice problems caused by the CN Tower. A few decades back they shut down the Gardener Expressway.


A number of Toronto Commercial high rise buildings have the same problem with ice shedding from wall panels and the solutions are like the win a hockey game analogy, just get rid of the ice. No one has figured out exactly how yet.

Aircraft have the same problem but what's another million or two for deicing systems.

Cars have the problem as well but the lower altitude and size can minimize the damage. But wait! If you order at the right time a car can become worse, all for the same price.

A cargo van with an unheated box doesn't tend to melt a snow load and snow doesn't have the impact of a sheet of ice. People in cars don't like to freeze so they turn on interior heat which melts the bottom of the snow load. Due to the different R factors of ice and snow the bottom layer freezes to the roof panel until a combination of factors lets the roof panel release the sheet of ice into the following car's windshield.

The truck issue could be solved by only hiring sixteen foot tall drivers and issuing them with long handled brooms. For shorter drivers they would require working at heights certification in an industry where a lot of them begrudge needing driver's licences or insurance.

Electrically heating the roof of a semi would require an electrical power source equivalent to a 100 amp residential service. You can't just let the melt water drip off as it would, under many conditions, run down the sides of the box and at some point, shed from there. Boost the power source four times to cover the sides and ends of the box. Maybe you could do those with eaves troughs and downspouts.

There are numerous possible solutions but I've yet to see one that is universally practical other than don't build high things, anything over shoulder height.
Click to expand...
As a first step, mandate any location where trailers are parked for more than 8 hours to clean the roof of every trailer leaving and enshrine their liability. A common solution is a bar that is pushed down against the roof as the trailer passes under. That scrapes off the majority. Simple, mechanical, no working at heights, no electricity needed and doesn't impede vehicle traffic. It would require slearing the snow piles that built up near it but they already have contractors to deal with that.
 
nobbie48 said:
The problem reminds me of how to win a hockey game. It's easy, just score more goals than the other team.

I was involved in a study of the ice problems caused by the CN Tower. A few decades back they shut down the Gardener Expressway.


A number of Toronto Commercial high rise buildings have the same problem with ice shedding from wall panels and the solutions are like the win a hockey game analogy, just get rid of the ice. No one has figured out exactly how yet.

Aircraft have the same problem but what's another million or two for deicing systems.

Cars have the problem as well but the lower altitude and size can minimize the damage. But wait! If you order at the right time a car can become worse, all for the same price.

A cargo van with an unheated box doesn't tend to melt a snow load and snow doesn't have the impact of a sheet of ice. People in cars don't like to freeze so they turn on interior heat which melts the bottom of the snow load. Due to the different R factors of ice and snow the bottom layer freezes to the roof panel until a combination of factors lets the roof panel release the sheet of ice into the following car's windshield.

The truck issue could be solved by only hiring sixteen foot tall drivers and issuing them with long handled brooms. For shorter drivers they would require working at heights certification in an industry where a lot of them begrudge needing driver's licences or insurance.

Electrically heating the roof of a semi would require an electrical power source equivalent to a 100 amp residential service. You can't just let the melt water drip off as it would, under many conditions, run down the sides of the box and at some point, shed from there. Boost the power source four times to cover the sides and ends of the box. Maybe you could do those with eaves troughs and downspouts.

There are numerous possible solutions but I've yet to see one that is universally practical other than don't build high things, anything over shoulder height.
Click to expand...
Box height drive-through brush that removed 90%+ of the snow, rather than leaving all of it in place and just driving it off. If it's warm enough to melt it into ice, then it's also warm enough to just melt off that small layer that remains.
 
nobbie48 said:
I wasn't aware of the fine. How does one pursue a settlement?

Do fines from violating the HTA go to the government or the victim? Assuming they go to the government, how does the injured party get compensation and how long does it take? A lot of insurers don't cover glass anymore.

Who is responsible for the settlement? I assume again the driver is responsible for the fine, likely paying the court. If the tractor and trailer are owned by different ententes who does the victim have to deal with, especially if plates are covered with snow.

It's a big problem and people have died. They're collateral damage.
Click to expand...
Vehicle owner is responsible. If it's a trucking company then they're on the hook.

If you have a dashcam then it should be relatively easy. If contacting the vehicle owner doesn't get a reasonable response or isn't possible, make a police report using the recording. Use the report to make an insurance claim against the owner.
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