Law Enforcement - The Good, The Bad, The Ugly.....

Who was in the wrong?

  • Cop

    Votes: 23 20.5%
  • Dude who got shot

    Votes: 33 29.5%
  • I like turtles

    Votes: 56 50.0%

  • Total voters
    112
I agree 100 percent. Unfortunately, I see no movement at any level to resolve "laws for thee, not me" which is endemic in policing. The blue line and all those that believe in it must be purged.

My own experience with the police is limited. A few traffic related tickets over the 50+ years I've been driving. Many polite and neutral officers doing their job and several who were total pr***s, and had no reason to be, as I was polite and compliant.

One encounter was disconcerting. Spouse and I walking along a sidewalk in Toronto. Two TPS officers on bicycles became involved with someone on the sidewalk just ahead of us. We stopped as the sidewalk was narrow and not a lot of room to walk by. Officer turns to me, puts a hand on my chest and and pushes me back aggresively telling me to "stay back or I will charge you with obstruction". We just kept walking, nothing to do but suck it up and move on.

Every officer on the force, and every vehicle on duty, should have cameras that can not be turned off. The "I said, he said" and the blue wall of obstruction would be neutralized to a great extent.
 
Every officer on the force, and every vehicle on duty, should have cameras that can not be turned off. The "I said, he said" and the blue wall of obstruction would be neutralized to a great extent.
The blue line means that will never happen. That would be a great first step. All of the arguments about privacy are BS as that can be addressed on the backend with limiting/logging access to footage. We all know they don't want it as the evidence of police committing crimes would be overwhelming.

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Case in point. Ontario prosecutors have highlighted 28 cops for lying under oath. In the Umar Zameer case, the judge instructed the jury to consider that the officers colluded as they all presented the same story that was contrary to videos and facts. OPP was retained to investigate those officers 17 months ago. Still no report. Consistent stories that are inconsistent with irrefutable evidence should be enough to fire them all in weeks. Instead they drag it out for years and hope everyone forgets. TPA argues the officers experienced a traumatic event watching their friend die and that explains everything and they will continue to stand by their lying dirtbag colleagues regardless of truth or fact.

 
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The worst case (or best example if you prefer) of how badly the authorities can screw up is unfolding in Belleville court. It’s a case over the alleged theft of 208 Classic and Collectible Cars from Grogan Ford and later Grogan Classics. Six people have so far been changed but the true crime is that some 45-50 people who bought the cars have had them seized by the OPP. The OPP have tracked cars down from the east coast right across to BC and are still looking for 150+ more. The rub is that the OPP have given the cars back to Larry Grogan who is trying to force Service Ontario to reverse ownerships back into his company’s name so he can resell them before legal ownership has been proven.

It started with a shady partner who allegedly falsified documents and in turn used those to help an accomplice in Service Ontario switch ownership into his or others names. Those vehicles were then sold to unsuspecting bona fide buyers.

It is rumoured that Larry Grogan blew the whistle on his partner after the arrangement went south. However, court documents have his lawyer claiming Grogan was a sick old man who made the mistake of trusting the wrong person. He failed to keep tabs on what was happening until he sold the Ford Dealership and tried to transfer ownerships of his inventory into Grogan Classics. This had somehow been going on for nearly FOUR years.

OMVIC is neck deep in this too. They failed at every turn to meet their mandate. By not doing their jobs it allowed for this to go on for over four years. Even after the two main suspects, Robert Bradshaw and Garry LeBlanc had pled guilty for operating a un licenced car lot OMVIC appears to have failed to investigate further.

The owners of the seized vehicles have lost not just their cars but their passion for the hobby that brought them such joy. They have lost more than just the purchase price and taxes paid. They have also lost every red cent and ounce of sweat they poured into their cars after the purchase. Without theirs cars they can no longer take part in car shows, drives and cruise nights that once gave them such joy. Oh and how the police got around the legalities of the seizures are one for the books.

Most people got a visit from the OPP and told they were in possession of a stolen vehicle and that they had to give it up. Many times all they saw was a blurry image on a cell phone as the vehicle was being loaded onto a waiting flatbed. For those who had a little knowledge of the law the OPP came back with a proper paper copy but still the owners had no or extremely limited warning of the seizures.

Look up Larry Grogan, Robert Bradshaw, Gary LeBlanc, Michael McClory, Charlotte Johnston, Jack Bradshaw and Roger Thompson.

There are also lots of news articles in the London Free press and The Independent like these two:

Over 160 stolen classic cars from Watford dealer still missing says lawyer | The Independent

Uncle of man in $6.5M classic car theft ring accused of lying to police

There are also many videos on-line like one:

 
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IIRC the following happened in Saskatchewan.

A vintage canoe was stolen and sold to a third party who didn't know he was buying stolen goods. He restored or had the canoe restored and then the legal owner found out. The legal owner got the canoe back but had to pay for betterment.

There's some fuzzy legalities on ownership if the buyer paid in good faith. It is my understanding that if a con artist falsifies deed paperwork and basically steals your house, selling it to a person who paid in good faith, you don't get your home back. Title insurance is supposed to work that out for you.
 
IIRC the following happened in Saskatchewan.

A vintage canoe was stolen and sold to a third party who didn't know he was buying stolen goods. He restored or had the canoe restored and then the legal owner found out. The legal owner got the canoe back but had to pay for betterment.

There's some fuzzy legalities on ownership if the buyer paid in good faith. It is my understanding that if a con artist falsifies deed paperwork and basically steals your house, selling it to a person who paid in good faith, you don't get your home back. Title insurance is supposed to work that out for you.
That has always been a mystery to me if you buy a stolen car it gets returned to the owner. But if your house is stolen you are sol?

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I don't know how pawn shops get away with stuff either. A friend had to buy his camera back from a pawn shop.
Get the police involved and it goes right back to you. The pawn shops around the university learned that they shouldn't be accepting stolen computers, rather quickly.
 
IIRC the following happened in Saskatchewan.

A vintage canoe was stolen and sold to a third party who didn't know he was buying stolen goods. He restored or had the canoe restored and then the legal owner found out. The legal owner got the canoe back but had to pay for betterment.

There's some fuzzy legalities on ownership if the buyer paid in good faith. It is my understanding that if a con artist falsifies deed paperwork and basically steals your house, selling it to a person who paid in good faith, you don't get your home back. Title insurance is supposed to work that out for you.
Was a case like this in NS or maybe still going on.

A couple bought a house and restored it just to find out it was owned by an American that didn’t sell it .

I can’t recall the full story behind it but was in the news.
 
Was a case like this in NS or maybe still going on.

A couple bought a house and restored it just to find out it was owned by an American that didn’t sell it .

I can’t recall the full story behind it but was in the news.
Yep, that was Lorna and Ian Tenniswood’s sad story due to another government screw up. They lost big in the end.
There was a CTV W5 show on it and I think one of the US news shows like 60 Minutes did an episode as well.

Owners of prized historic N.S. home in legal nightmare, thanks to local government
 
I don't know how pawn shops get away with stuff either. A friend had to buy his camera back from a pawn shop.

Kinda how Igor ran his bicycle chop shop on Queen W. If the bikes got to him before they hit the stolen list, he was in the clear and you had to buy your bike back from him if you found it in his shop. He eventually effed up and they nailed him to a cross.
 
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