Law Enforcement - The Good, The Bad, The Ugly..... | Page 226 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Law Enforcement - The Good, The Bad, The Ugly.....

Who was in the wrong?

  • Cop

    Votes: 23 21.1%

  • Dude who got shot

    Votes: 31 28.4%

  • I like turtles

    Votes: 55 50.5%
  • Total voters
    109
GreyGhost said:
As much as I dislike paying them while awaiting trial (as the other side of the coin is they are more likely to be accused but i suspect less likely to be charged), I understand your point. I also think it is reasonable to claw back the wage they earned while awaiting trial if they are found guilty. If the are found not guilty, they get to keep the money and return to work.

I still think that psb tribunal should happen toot-suite and have the results sealed until after the trial to avoid influencing a criminal trial. That seems like a more elegant and efficient solution than delaying any internal investigation until after they have been convicted beyond a reasonable doubt. That is not the bar that should be used for employment where you carry a gun and enforce laws. Balance of probability as in civil matters is a much better bar for employment issues.
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Sure, except that a tonne of information comes out at trial, that might not be available to the police board hearing, that could be used to come to a proper determination. Trial then hearing is the better way to do it, for this reason.
 
Rob MacLennan said:
Sure, except that a tonne of information comes out at trial, that might not be available to the police board hearing, that could be used to come to a proper determination. Trial then hearing is the better way to do it, for this reason.
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Fair enough. I still think if balance of probability is met early on, that should be sufficient to convene PSB and adjudicate but I understand the hazard of changing the process for each situation.
 
Theriault got sentenced to 9 months for beating Dafonte Miller. Beating happened in December 2016 (and Theriault claimed self defence so there was very little investigation), DM family finally got an investigation rolling and officer suspended with pay July 2017, convicted at trial in August 2020, sentenced and suspended without pay November 2020, PSB to resume proceedings. He also got a five year firearm prohibition so even on the small chance the blue line tries to shield him, I think he is ineligible.

The laws/procedures around cops suck. He was convicted of an assault months ago, at the very least, that should have been the trigger to stop paying him and start PSB. Theriault's lawyer is still moaning about how sorry he is and in the same thought says that he may appeal the sentence. Dirtbag. He sure is sorry that he got caught, he is not at all sorry for his actions.

www.cp24.com

Toronto cop convicted in beating of Dafonte Miller sentenced to nine months in jail

An off-duty Toronto cop convicted in the beating of a young Black man in Whitby in 2016 has been sentenced to nine months in jail.
www.cp24.com www.cp24.com
 
GreyGhost said:
Theriault got sentenced to 9 months for beating Dafonte Miller. Beating happened in December 2016 (and Theriault claimed self defence so there was very little investigation), DM family finally got an investigation rolling and officer suspended with pay July 2017, convicted at trial in August 2020, sentenced and suspended without pay November 2020, PSB to resume proceedings. He also got a five year firearm prohibition so even on the small chance the blue line tries to shield him, I think he is ineligible.

The laws/procedures around cops suck. He was convicted of an assault months ago, at the very least, that should have been the trigger to stop paying him and start PSB. Theriault's lawyer is still moaning about how sorry he is and in the same thought says that he may appeal the sentence. Dirtbag. He sure is sorry that he got caught, he is not at all sorry for his actions.

www.cp24.com

Toronto cop convicted in beating of Dafonte Miller sentenced to nine months in jail

An off-duty Toronto cop convicted in the beating of a young Black man in Whitby in 2016 has been sentenced to nine months in jail.
www.cp24.com www.cp24.com
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I agree on the suspension. Once a conviction was registered, the PSB case should have been rolling for suspension without pay and cashiering. The Prosecution was asking for 15 months.

Given that officers on-scene deferred to him, and even allowed him to handcuff the kid, that he's being punished at all is a win.
 
On the Monday morning QB front...

I find it interesting that a terrorist cutting off people's heads with a knife can be captured alive in France and a guy with a sword killing people in Quebec can also be taken alive but a black man with a knife in the US needs to be shot multiple times....
 
backmarkerducati said:
On the Monday morning QB front...

I find it interesting that a terrorist cutting off people's heads with a knife can be captured alive in France and a guy with a sword killing people in Quebec can also be taken alive but a black man with a knife in the US needs to be shot multiple times....
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I haven't watched footage of situation A or B to see if part of that was due to suspects that surrendered or disarmed themselves when confronted by officers.

It is quite clear that training is substantially different in Europe (particularly de-escalation training).

Amurica has a very gun focused view of policing. Now, a suspect running at you with a knife is a deadly threat and I have no problem with them dying instead of the cops. The key is can the situation be de-escalated instead of the american (and much of canada) propensity to turn up the heat and escalate until the suspect inevitably snaps.
 
GreyGhost said:
It is quite clear that training is substantially different in Europe (particularly de-escalation training).
Click to expand...

There is a vid on youtube where they took a bunch of American police chiefs and sheriffs to watch training of Scottish police.
If it wasn't so sad it would be funny.
Watching the Scottish CADETS, male and female, de-escalate and dis-arm people with knives and swords and 2 x 4s
The looks on the American's faces....

Another problem: If you ask most cops about their job, they'll tell you about how DANGEROUS it is.
#22 on this list, behind CROSSING GUARDS, small engine mechanics (WTF???) and FARMERS! Top 25 Most Dangerous Jobs in the United States – AdvisorSmith
 
Hack said:
When the only tool you have is a hammer.... All your problems begin to look like nails.
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And in the uk's case, when the only tool most officers have is a soothing accent, de-escalation against a knife seems like a great plan.
 
ToSlow said:
Did I miss something here
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Here's what the average UK officer carries:
They've got a baton which means the suspect has to be almost on you before you can use it, weak ass irritant spray that is best used at 4-6' (so the officer is getting stabbed after spraying them) and that's about it. Nothing effective at a range where the knife is not a threat (no long range option and once the attacker is within arms length, the officer is getting cut and has no tools to shift the odds to their favour other than their hands).
 
backmarkerducati said:
On the Monday morning QB front...

I find it interesting that a terrorist cutting off people's heads with a knife can be captured alive in France and a guy with a sword killing people in Quebec can also be taken alive but a black man with a knife in the US needs to be shot multiple times....
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I think you comment might be a bit loaded... How about "but a black man with a knife in the US needs to be shot multiple times..."
 
Mad Mike said:
I think you comment might be a bit loaded... How about "but a black man with a knife in the US needs to be shot multiple times..."
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Not especially loaded, given that there's sufficient evidence that a Black man with a knife is statistically far more likely to be shot than is a White man with a knife, in the US.
 
Mad Mike said:
How about this in The Hammer:
driving.ca

Motorcycle rider pushed to ground by police in Ontario in viral video

The Hamilton officer seems to try to pay out of his own pocket for damaging the bike
driving.ca driving.ca
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There's another thread on that. That cop will be having a long and unfriendly meeting with their boss. Lots of media attention and heat for something so dumb. He was also caught on tape outright lying about the situation (the bike fell over while the rider was getting off).
 
Rob MacLennan said:
Not especially loaded, given that there's sufficient evidence that a Black man with a knife is statistically far more likely to be shot than is a White man with a knife, in the US.
Click to expand...


Where. ?
Cite source of said sufficient evidence.
 
Hack said:
Where. ?
Cite source of said sufficient evidence.
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I saw a report not long ago that actually claimed the opposite. Police are more likely to hesitate when its a person of colour. Not sure what statistics he's referring to.
 
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