Oh, ok. I find some of these long winded posts tedious, and read the first paragraph, then skim. Carry on then.Besides the history of our interaction; That was pretty direct, no?
This is why we can't have nice things
[the high] Insurance rates have almost nothing to do with rider behavior in Ontario...if you are thinking this and feeling rage at your fellow riders...just stop now.
this griff2 guy reminds me of several people I've had occasion to meet and know over the years....
- likely can barely stay on the bike just riding from place to place (when he's actually on the thing and not posting on here).
- equates his inability to perform advanced manuevers in traffic to unwillingness and "restraint" on his part
- probably thinks it's ok to go 79km/h on Airport Rd on a sunny Sunday afternoon and not help people pass him and his equally milk-toast buddies.
Look dude, after coming here and reading about 4 of your posts I have two things to say to you:
- You are more likely to die due to low riding capability than the sport bike people you are so frequently making reference to
- The world isn't subject to your imagined ethical standards...nobody gives a **** that you're going the speed limit...it's dumb, that's why most people in Ontario don't obey it...forget bikes, look at cars at any given time.
People aren't complicated creatures - if you give them a rule that doesn't make any sense to them and don't strictly enforce it, they will all break it...cars drivers and motorcyclists are no exception to this.
Welcome back! 4 days without you; I was worried
Inability to perform "advanced maneuvers in traffic"? Really? What's that? Stand-up wheelies?
I've been riding a long time. The number of my years of riding without crash probably exceeds the IQ demonstrated in the post above, but carry on. Say anything you want.
Reading traffic, rapidly changing lanes to avoid hazards and dangerous situations, making your way quickly and efficiently through herds of cars to find the safe spaces inbetween large groups of them (on highways)...things that you don't learn while keeping busy scoffing at other riders.
Experience and skill aren't related - you can spend years white-knuckling it to Starbucks on Sundays and still be a ****** rider.
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Hey, if you're a good rider, awesome - keep it safe out there, but your posts give the impression this is not the case...just some outsider perspective for you, you're welcome.
Unfazed :thumbup: nail meet hammer
Btw brand new member oh oh another griffripper
I bet that passenger got a real justice boner from that. I didn't see the car in any danger. D-bag.
Well, technically, the car whomever recorded this was in was close enough for bad things to happen if one of these guys looped it.
Anyway, she seemed entertained from the background giggles; wonder if she actually sent it to the media/police, or if it was posted to social media where it was pick up on
I wonder how fast the car was traveling.
They should take this crap to the track...oh wait, hmmm
Well, technically, the car whomever recorded this was in was close enough for bad things to happen if one of these guys looped it.
Anyway, she seemed entertained from the background giggles; wonder if she actually sent it to the media/police, or if it was posted to social media where it was pick up on
I doubt you will see the point, I am going to make here, because when it comes to anything I post you immediately seem to have some form of negative reaction to.
I agree, 100% with your point of view that the speed limits, (in MOST cases), are artificially too low in the province. Having said that they are set by engineers etc and then "approved" by the politicians we elect, not the police. The police merely enforce what is put into place by others. They set the limits based upon the "perceived" skill level of the "average" driver. I believe we all have seen drivers on the 401, who shouldn't be on ANY road with a limit of more than 40 km/h. There are also a select few who have the skill set to be able to drive at 200 km/h in safety, (although there are MANY who THINK they fit into this category). The problem is when those who think they are in the latter group meets up with someone in the first group.
hedo2002 said:I also agree, that these riders, could perform these "stunts" in total safety, IF they were being done in a facility designed for them or if there were NO other vehicles even remotely close, (which as you pointed out was not the case here).
The biggest issue with doing this type of stuff on a public roadway in plain view of other road users, (not to mention when it is done for a prolonged period of time, to permit it to be recorded), is not if it was safe or if the rider, (and NO ONE truly knows what their skill level is based solely upon the video), is the perception it leaves with those who view it.
My issue is not with if it as safe, or if it should be done, but rather with two other issues.
1. We ALL hate the rates we pay for bike insurance, more so, those who are young and ride sport bikes, (then as you like to refer to me, fat old guys falling off cruisers). Riding in the manner that these riders are on a public road, only reinforces the stereotypes, (in most cases wrongly applied). But it also damages ANY lobbying effort riders may try to mount about insurance rates being too high. Insurance executives see these type of videos and smile, because they know how the general public will vie ALL riders and ANY lobbying we as a group may try to bring forth will easily be dismissed. These riders may well have been in their 40's or 50's but the public won't know or see that they will simply see "some young punk" riding like an ******. This unfortunately doesn't just affect 20 something riders on sport bikes but is translated into higher premiums for ALL riders
2. Somewhat along the lines of my first point is the damage that this style of riding does to riders of all types of bikes. We have made some gains over the decades, think back to the 60's if the general public saw a group of 20 harley's with guys in leather jackets, they automatically, went to the idea of a biker gang. Today, you don't assume that to be the case, because riders of harley's and cruisers have made strides to change public perception. Back then we didn't have cell cameras and social media. Regardless, of how hard we as riders try to make the same strides to change public perception of guys on sport bikes, a single video like this gets splashed all over the internet and main stream media, and that negative perception is reinforced for the general public.
hedo2002 said:There are as you rightfully pointed out no true places where a rider can go and stunt legally, (although I don't agree it is due to NIMBYism, but more to due with liability, and although the stunter may sign a waiver of liability that doesn't prevent their loved ones from filing lawsuits).
My reactions are always based on the content of the post, or sometimes, as in a case like this, the content which is missing. See you blame the politicians while absolving the police competely; but the reality is, these types of policy are based around information supplied by the loudest groups. Front of that line; the police.
Are you honestly going to sit back and tell us all that Police services don't lobby the government on behalf of their own best interest. Wait.. you just did.
This doesn't mean all cops share the same interest, but it's pretty blatant misinformation on your part; again.
I guess you missed the part where I called these guys tools... I'm not a wheelie for the kids kinda guy; particularly in a group around other cars. As I said, the camera car was close; close enough that I wouldn't even think of lifting the front. But I'm glad you got that out.
ps. I never called you fat
Those are obviously contributing factors as well. But IMO a huge reason we don't have many options is noise. When they built the road course at TMP, it almost didn't survive the first year because of noise complaints. This despite the fact the drag strip had been in the area for ages.. Everyone wants you to go to the track, but don't build it near them...
***trimmed the wall of text***