Red light camera ticket for turning right

You can request disclosure which will only give you a bit more information but you basically already have everything. In my opinion it is not worth it to challenge the ticket in court. You might get a reduction depending on the prosecutor at early resolution but in my case they skipped that step and went right to trial. At trial they put a value on how long the light was red for and increase the cost accordingly. In my case they were talking $750. They also look at other factors to raise the ticket value like pedestrians, vehicles, transit etc whom you could potentially be endangering. They will not reduce the original cost at trial. I pressed the prosecutor for a reduction and ask him mutiple questions. He was a a-hole and knew he could basically act how he wanted. There is no video evidence, photos are photos and not taken from video. I challenged the ticket as a learning experience for me and the person who actually caused the ticket. In the end, after arguing with the prosecutor several times prior to court commencing I opted to pay the original fine and not risk the chance of a larger fine and wasting my morning. Considering I wasn't actually paying the ticket! There were several things that I could have potentially used as a defence or to get a reduction, one being that I requested early resolution and only received trial option which wasted my time and court time, second that their evidence shows a static image of my vehicle stopped behind the line and no video to show motion. They would counter with the speed from camera which could be challenged. I was also contemplating suggesting that I be fined with a rolling stop at a stop sign because at traffic lights you can make a right on red (basically a stop sign) which is $110 . However that fine carries 3 points which I didn't want them to tack on. There is also the problem with the initial charge itself in that it states you must come to a complete stop and not proceed until green, 🤷🏻‍♂️ how do you do that with committing the infraction? Another question I asked is if they accumulate and the pro said that they can't see how many you have had ever. Said that I could have 10 and he wouldn't know. My suggestion if you are at a traffic light that has a redlight camera and you have passed the white line, stop immediately and do not proceed until it changes to green, you most likely will not receive a ticket when it is reviewed and you have a leg to stand on if it goes to court. Otherwise stop accordingly, complete stop behind the white line and proceed like normal.
 
Thanks for sharing your experience.
Guess the "pay up" option is preferrable to dealing with the hassle.
 
Chris-CJ said:
Thanks for sharing your experience.
Guess the "pay up" option is preferrable to dealing with the hassle.
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Ya this automated crap is a new ball game. Honestly even the fact the cop can show up remotely is a pita. I had great success with the cop not showing and or adjourning until they didn't show. I would still try early resolution with the prosecutor, maybe you get lucky and they are nice. The guy that I had to deal with was someone I dealt with in the past and he was a jerk then too.
 
Past experience tells me to never go into a negotiation without something in your back pocket.
I had none, except a "he said", a right turn on red.
So I gave Ceaser his coin.
Now I have fitted and tested a dash cam that will be insurance against Popo's automated crap.
Which begs the question - how does one make a right turn on a red, without getting a ticket?
May be do it like they do in Montreal, no right turn on red!
(and be subject to honking from the line up behind also waiting to do a right turn on red).
 
Chris-CJ said:
Past experience tells me to never go into a negotiation without something in your back pocket.
I had none, except a "he said", a right turn on red.
So I gave Ceaser his coin.
Now I have fitted and tested a dash cam that will be insurance against Popo's automated crap.
Which begs the question - how does one make a right turn on a red, without getting a ticket?
May be do it like they do in Montreal, no right turn on red!
(and be subject to honking from the line up behind also waiting to do a right turn on red).
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Technically, stop behind the stop line, then pull forward to curb line and stop again, then turn right. In practice, that will get you rear-ended quite often. Make sure you put a huge card in your dash cam if you want to use it this way. You may get the ticket a month after the event.
 
GreyGhost said:
Technically, stop behind the stop line, then pull forward to curb line and stop again, then turn right. In practice, that will get you rear-ended quite often. Make sure you put a huge card in your dash cam if you want to use it this way. You may get the ticket a month after the event.
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LOL, one way to invite road rage.
 
Here is the answer I got when requesting for disclosure:

Peel AE confirms that our RLC system was actively monitoring the intersection with ideal performance.
The RLC system is configured to capture vehicles that proceed into the intersection against a red light, meaning although the vehicle’s brake lights show in the photographs one and three, the vehicle did not come to a ‘complete stop’ behind the painted stop bar before proceeding to make the legal right-turn-on-red maneuver–this is the reason for the RLC infraction.
According to the Ontario Highway Traffic Act (HTA), a complete stop is bringing your vehicle to a complete standstill with all wheels stopped, before proceeding through an intersection or stop sign.
Please note that the HTA does not specify how long the stop must be; it only requires that it be a full and complete stop (all wheels locked = vehicular speed of 0 km/h). This is the same rational law enforcement uses when enforcing fail-to-stop violations.
To be on the safe side, some experts recommend stopping for a minimum of three seconds before proceeding through an intersection equipped with a RLC (a signalized intersection where all approaches are signed with the regulatory Red Light Camera signs prior to the system).
Please note it may not be guaranteed that supplementary images exist to the ones already in your offence notice. Please also note that all RLC systems in Ontario by law only have the capability to capture static/still images and videos cannot be captured.
 
That answer pretty much summed up the reason why it would be a "no contest" if I took the option of telling the judge, "look at the brake lights, the driver had stopped prior to making the right turn on red"
 
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Chris-CJ said:
Here is the answer I got when requesting for disclosure:

Peel AE confirms that our RLC system was actively monitoring the intersection with ideal performance.
The RLC system is configured to capture vehicles that proceed into the intersection against a red light, meaning although the vehicle’s brake lights show in the photographs one and three, the vehicle did not come to a ‘complete stop’ behind the painted stop bar before proceeding to make the legal right-turn-on-red maneuver–this is the reason for the RLC infraction.
According to the Ontario Highway Traffic Act (HTA), a complete stop is bringing your vehicle to a complete standstill with all wheels stopped, before proceeding through an intersection or stop sign.
Please note that the HTA does not specify how long the stop must be; it only requires that it be a full and complete stop (all wheels locked = vehicular speed of 0 km/h). This is the same rational law enforcement uses when enforcing fail-to-stop violations.
To be on the safe side, some experts recommend stopping for a minimum of three seconds before proceeding through an intersection equipped with a RLC (a signalized intersection where all approaches are signed with the regulatory Red Light Camera signs prior to the system).
Please note it may not be guaranteed that supplementary images exist to the ones already in your offence notice. Please also note that all RLC systems in Ontario by law only have the capability to capture static/still images and videos cannot be captured.
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They didn't explain any of that when I requested disclosure.
 
I still think the fine should be $110 for incomplete stop while turning right. If you blow right through a red and go straight it should be $325. I agree with you, i usually wait a ridiculous amount of time now and if it is about to turn yellow i stop early. I wouldn't want to be mid turn on a yellow and get dinged.
 
Fuzzbuster said:
They didn't explain any of that when I requested disclosure.
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I requested disclosure from the RLC dept and not the Prosecuter (the thought being that the Prosecutor gets his info from the RLC ppl, so why not go to the source).
I had to leverage the FOI clause to obtain this.
(check on the 'net, 'cos each area has it's own separate set up)
Prolly the reason for the difference in info.
 
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