Law Enforcement - The Good, The Bad, The Ugly..... | Page 331 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Law Enforcement - The Good, The Bad, The Ugly.....

Who was in the wrong?

  • Cop

    Votes: 23 21.1%

  • Dude who got shot

    Votes: 31 28.4%

  • I like turtles

    Votes: 55 50.5%
  • Total voters
    109
nobbie48 said:
The video doesn’t show the build up. Nor does it show uniforms but rather what appears to be a gang of thugs.
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They are all members of the HP undercover auto theft task force (BEAR). The accused was well known to them (auto theft priors). I see little difference between this and being ambushed by people beating on your doors/windows in an underground parking garage (who I still think were imbibing on the job and should have been tested for alcohol impairment).
 
I see Halton has added another tool in their arsenal. Seen it hovering the other evening around 5sdr and 10th line. was a drone spanning around 5ft diameter.
 
ToSlow said:
I see Halton has added another tool in their arsenal. Seen it hovering the other evening around 5sdr and 10th line. was a drone spanning around 5ft diameter.
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Peel has at least one as well. Something like a 6 rotor jobbie. It was annoyingly hovering over my neighbourhood, for hours, the day after someone "aired-out" a unit down the street. No idea what it was looking for as it had been more than 8 hours after the shots were fired, when it showed up.
 
Rob MacLennan said:
"He did it out of fear." they said. That's not a man showing fear. That's someone who is angry that he doesn't get to go hands-on so starts kicking, so that he can get his licks in. He didn't "lose $30K." He made a couple of hundred thousand that he didn't deserve.
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Should Wren resign for his own good?

If he is truly remorseful he might go forward reluctent to use force in the future when thet force would be justified and needed. That could endanger him or fellow officers
 
nobbie48 said:
Should Wren resign for his own good?

If he is truly remorseful he might go forward reluctent to use force in the future when thet force would be justified and needed. That could endanger him or fellow officers
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That presumes that he thinks he did anything wrong. I may be presumptuous here, but I don't think that he does.
 
Rob MacLennan said:
That presumes that he thinks he did anything wrong. I may be presumptuous here, but I don't think that he does.
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" told a disciplinary hearing that he is “ashamed and humiliated” by his conduct and takes full responsibility.
During the final day of his Police Services Act sentencing hearing Friday, Const. Brian Wren said he is sorry to the victim and recognizes the profound impact on the victim’s life. He also apologized to the police service and community.
Wren pleaded guilty to discreditable conduct last month. The disciplinary charge stems from his criminal court conviction last year when he pleaded guilty to assaulting Patrick Tomchuk, an Indigenous man, and was handed a suspended sentence and 18 months probation."

We complain about the catch and release program but how would we feel if we were the ones arresting, always concerned about a knife wound or other injury?

We complain about the number of auto thefts and criticize the police for the failures. Then we criticize them again when they over react. It seems the only people that are free to under react are the politicians that we re-elect.

I'm leery of presumptions, social media opinions and armchair quarterbacking.

Reality:

A kid working in a convenience store in Peterborough took the bat away from a robber, chased the guy outside and gave him a couple of swats to the body.

It was legally the wrong thing to do. It was wrong as soon as the robber left the store in retreat and the kid has been charged.

What were the alternates?

1A) Call the police after giving the thief the money and smokes.

1B) Police arrive a half hour later as it is a no injury / gun event.

1C) Police may know the individual and may possibly arrest them in a day or so.

1D) Perpetrator is released and told to behave

1E) Perpetrator, with nothing to lose, robs a different store

1F) Go back to 1A)

Scenario 2

2A) A bit of street justice but not life altering

2B) Perp is arrested immediately

2C) Kid is charged for the street justice

2D) Perp is released within 24 hours

2E) Kid's life is trashed

2F) Perps now know about 2C and 2E and that the store will comply in the event of a robbery and 1B) for the police. The store becomes the thief's ATM.

Scenario 3

Similar to scenario 2 but the next time the perp comes back with a gun and all the numbers change
 
nobbie48 said:
We complain about the number of auto thefts and criticize the police for the failures. Then we criticize them again when they over react.
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And your point is? Of course we should complain about the police's usual 'call your insurance company' response to auto theft. Of course we should complain about excessive force by the police. Watching the video there was at least 4 cops, possibly 5 wrestling him out of the car. Wren kicking him in the head till he lost consciousness was completely unnecessary and criminal. Seems like the Courts agree.
 
nobbie48 said:
Reality:

A kid working in a convenience store in Peterborough took the bat away from a robber, chased the guy outside and gave him a couple of swats to the body.

It was legally the wrong thing to do. It was wrong as soon as the robber left the store in retreat and the kid has been charged.
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Is this the same incident that saw the clerk hit the suspect in the back while he was laying facedown on the ground.. submitted?
 
raginduck said:
Is this the same incident that saw the clerk hit the suspect in the back while he was laying facedown on the ground.. submitted?
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If the perp had threatened harm to me seconds prior I'd likely administer some justice as well, regardless if he was standing up or face down on the ground. There has to be consequences, and insta-bail 'n walk ain't it.
 
raginduck said:
Is this the same incident that saw the clerk hit the suspect in the back while he was laying facedown on the ground.. submitted?
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Probably and if the kid got away with it the robber wouldn't likely come back. Now he might figure the kid wouldn't retaliate a second time.

The video I refer to shows the robber getting batted in the back of the head once and the shoulder once he was down. The bat to the head was, in reflection, a bad move. Bruised shoulders or cracked ribs heal easier. Heads sometimes never.

The politically correct police response:

"In a social media post in January, Chief of Police Stuart Betts encouraged people to “stop and think about things before determining what you think has happened, or that an injustice has taken place, because I’m quite confident that not one person who has made a comment about this case has seen the video or has access to the actual facts.”

How about the fact that the guy was robbing a store, weapon in hand. Is everyone supposed to sit down over a cup of tea and discuss procedures? You react. The PM has dibs on verbal salad.

How about the fact that the municipal and federal governments are doing nothing to slow down the growth of these crimes.

How about the fact that people get angry over seeing these people on the streets and in the parks taking over without consequences. Angry people make poor decisions.
 
The adrenaline and anger in the situation can (will) make people do things they would not normally do, maybe take the use of force a little farther (or longer) than it should be. The difference is the police are "supposed" to be trained for this. Regular citizens defending themselves are not trained for a sober second thought in the heat of the moment.

Recently at the LCBO the security guards (2) took down a dude making a break for it with a cart full of scotch just as I was walking in. There was a big tussle in the store but IMO top notch work on their part to take the guy down. Even 5 minutes afterwards you could see the adrenaline pumping in the one guy, he had the smarts to stand down/walk away once the guy was in cuffs--smarter than some cops I guess. The other guy was calm as can be once they had him.

Some do gooder afterwards asked me (as I was just a few feet away for the entire thing) did they punch him? I said no but they should have and I would have.... he was not impressed with my response.
 
backmarkerducati said:
The adrenaline and anger in the situation can (will) make people do things they would not normally do, maybe take the use of force a little farther (or longer) than it should be. The difference is the police are "supposed" to be trained for this. Regular citizens defending themselves are not trained for a sober second thought in the heat of the moment.

Recently at the LCBO the security guards (2) took down a dude making a break for it with a cart full of scotch just as I was walking in. There was a big tussle in the store but IMO top notch work on their part to take the guy down. Even 5 minutes afterwards you could see the adrenaline pumping in the one guy, he had the smarts to stand down/walk away once the guy was in cuffs--smarter than some cops I guess. The other guy was calm as can be once they had him.

Some do gooder afterwards asked me (as I was just a few feet away for the entire thing) did they punch him? I said no but they should have and I would have.... he was not impressed with my response.
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And Wren should have walked away. He wasn't contributing to the arrest in any meaningful way, as there just wasn't room for him to squeeze in.
 
backmarkerducati said:
Some do gooder afterwards asked me (as I was just a few feet away for the entire thing) did they punch him? I said no but they should have and I would have.... he was not impressed with my response.
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He was buying hard seltzer?
 
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