I installed the creepy surveillance app/device to get an insurance discount | GTAMotorcycle.com

I installed the creepy surveillance app/device to get an insurance discount

Twisted Wrister

Well-known member
I know it's gross but getting a permanent 25% off tempted me. Most insurance companies have a program like this. I installed Ajusto under Desjardins.
Here's a report:

You have to have it installed for 100 days and drive at least 1000km. It detects when you're driving and after each trip it scores you based on a number of factors. It can't make your insurance go up, it can only discount you. The discount is adjusted to your average score of all your trips after the term ends. The app uses your location service and the movement sensors in your phone.

The biggest scoring penalties are hard acceleration, hard braking, speeding and phone use.
Acceleration is the easiest. if you have an eco indicator you're used to it. You can accelerate hard enough to go over that, I've never gotten a penalty for this.
Braking is the toughest. It's about 1/4 of the way to your seatbelt locking so you really have to stay far back, look way ahead and know your route.
Speeding penalty kicks in around 10-15 over. So no more 119 on the 401 for 3 months. Watch the 50/60 limits in the city guessing wrong can put you over. This penalty seems not that sensitive.
Phone use is stupid anyway and easy to avoid. Bluetoothing is fine. I think it counts touches. I did 3 touches to switch the phone to bluetooth from speaker for a 911 call I told Siri to make and didn't get penalized.

All scoring penalties hit pretty hard especially if you have more than one in a trip. They are aggravated by driving near rush hour and trips> 20km. Penalties take several perfect trips to smooth out. At the end of each trip you have to select what you were doing to get scored. You pick from driver, passenger, walking, biking, motorycling, bus, train, plane. Once you select, you can't change it. This way you won't get a penalty for flying to Halifax at 920km/hr. This is your best vector of abuse if you know your trip had penalties without seeing your score. You can also delete a trip, but you can only delete one trip every couple hundred km. You can also disable location services on your phone and drive undetected but you won't advance the 100 day counter unless you also drive with it enabled at least once that day.

The average final score I'm told is a 14% discount. However, experienced, alive bikers like us aren't normal drivers. You all should be able to hold at 21%-25%. Winter is the probably the easiest time to do it since you have to be smooth and won't be riding.
 

Mad Mike

Well-known member
I found this app to be useless. If you ride a MC forget it, it only works for cars. The best I could ever get in a car is 2% discount. In an urban area you can’t run at the speed of traffic or keep a typical inter car distance while trying to earn a good score.

It might be useful outside high traffic areas of the GTA.
 

J_F

Well-known member
Site Supporter
average final score I'm told is a 14% discount

a spy device that will save me around $100/year
and make me alter the way I drive....no bueno

there are times when you need to accelerate/brake hard
not because you are
irresponsible
but because there are so many buttheads on the roads
us riders know that better than anybody

but I can see how this could = big savings for younger drivers paying out the wazoo
 

Mad Mike

Well-known member
average final score I'm told is a 14% discount

a spy device that will save me around $100/year
and make me alter the way I drive....no bueno

there are times when you need to accelerate/brake hard
not because you are
irresponsible
but because there are so many buttheads on the roads
us riders know that better than anybody

but I can see how this could = big savings for younger drivers paying out the wazoo
It's pretty hard to get a discount off these devices. I had my daughter take my phone on the bus to see how GO drivers fared -- every trip between Markham and Union scored zero.
 

GreyGhost

Well-known member
Site Supporter
Winter is the probably the easiest time to do it since you have to be smooth and won't be riding.
Not for me. I don't have nearly enough power to drift in the summer, in the winter however ;) It would be interesting to see what adjusto thought you were doing and whether it was worth a penalty. Theoretically it could use GPS and gyros to determine your orientation.
 

Twisted Wrister

Well-known member
average final score I'm told is a 14% discount

a spy device that will save me around $100/year
and make me alter the way I drive....no bueno

there are times when you need to accelerate/brake hard
not because you are
irresponsible
but because there are so many buttheads on the roads
us riders know that better than anybody

but I can see how this could = big savings for younger drivers paying out the wazoo
I agree with you. I made this thread to share all the intelligence I gathered about the tracking system I'm studying and how I think it can be gamed.

I'm paying almost nothing for my FZ1 but my Corolla and Mazda3 and stupid wife make that 25% look good.
 

Brian P

Well-known member
Moderator
Site Supporter
So is that 100 day / 1000 km period a permanent adjustment that you only have to do once as long as you stay with that insurance company? If not, what's the deal?

I take it that this is the phone app and not the OBDII plug?

Is the discount applied to all vehicles that you have on the policy? (although, sport bikes and Desjardins i.e. State Farm no longer coexist in the same space and time, so it may not be an option anyhow)
 

GreyGhost

Well-known member
Site Supporter
So is that 100 day / 1000 km period a permanent adjustment that you only have to do once as long as you stay with that insurance company? If not, what's the deal?

I take it that this is the phone app and not the OBDII plug?

Is the discount applied to all vehicles that you have on the policy? (although, sport bikes and Desjardins i.e. State Farm no longer coexist in the same space and time, so it may not be an option anyhow)
My parents did the OBDII plug for a period of time a few years and haven't needed to repeat so it looks like the discount is permanent (I don't think it was Desjardins though). One car, two drivers. They got 15% IIRC.

Based on how, where and when they drive, the 25% is probably impossible to achieve. You would need to drive exclusively where there are no other vehicles that could affect your driving. They are slow accelerating, not commuting, not driving late at night, decently anticipating traffic, not speeding folks. It's like the sledgehammer game at the carnival with some logarithmic (or worse) weighting where a single event probably prevents you from ever achieving the maximum discount.
 

ChrisCBR

Well-known member
So how do we game the system? 1000 km will be easy to do.
So dont drive during rush hour or at night, turn on location services only in the ideal environment and if you know you had a trip filled with negatives, select passenger.
I pay $3500 a year, which is outrageous for 1 car and 1 bike. A 20% saving is $700 per year, that's significant.
 

GreyGhost

Well-known member
Site Supporter
It may be easier to install adjusto on an old phone. Only bring that phone with you when you plan on driving like a saint in low-risk times.

Or, just dont bother gaming the system. They give you 10% minimum fo installing the app and I've never heard of someone getting 20 or better. Realistically, you are probably looking at 10 to 15% regardless of how you drive. If they find out you gamed adjusto, I am sure they have a clause that can deny a claim in the future. The safe bet is to be straight with them and take the 10% (or slightly more depending on your driving).
 

Malks

Well-known member
I'm guessing that you need a data plan on your phone for this to work. Or does the phone/app upload the captured data once it regains access to the net? Not that I would ever consider this, just curious because I don't have a data plan.
 

Mad Mike

Well-known member
So how do we game the system? 1000 km will be easy to do.
So dont drive during rush hour or at night, turn on location services only in the ideal environment and if you know you had a trip filled with negatives, select passenger.
I pay $3500 a year, which is outrageous for 1 car and 1 bike. A 20% saving is $700 per year, that's significant.
It’s almost impossible. I tried just about everything possible to get a great score. I leave for work super early and don’t see any traffic — the road is basically mine. 10 km commute on roads that range from 40 to 80 with 29 stop signs or lights. I could never get a meaningful discount. I suspect the GPS coordinates are also factored somehow.

I have tried rural drives and results are better. prrhaps that’s because the starts, stops and turns are infrequent.
 

PaisaMed

Well-known member
I talked with Desjardins about this Adjusto program and was left feeling that I had a lot of unanswered questions. Like , for example, do you have to re-qualify for the discount after so many years? Does it apply to my whole insurance premium? (1 car, 2 bikes) The 100 days requirement, is that 100 recorded trips no matter how short a distance they are? 1000 kms would certainly prove to be an easy hurdle to pass over 100 driving days.

Inquiring minds want to know.
 

JD_PICKLE

Well-known member
Soooo, if I don't have a cell/smart phone, (yes I'm a caveman) I can't use this and save on insurance.... mmmmm
Talk about discrimination, my feelings are hurt. I'll be over there in my safe corner. ~~~>
 

justride

Well-known member
When these become the norm. Insurance companies will jack up the price to make up for the shortfall of revenue.
Also driving to suit the device and not traffic/road condition might put the driver at risk. Sometimes you have to brake hard or accelerate to get out of a potentially dangerous situation.
 

Twisted Wrister

Well-known member
I talked with Desjardins about this Adjusto program and was left feeling that I had a lot of unanswered questions. Like , for example, do you have to re-qualify for the discount after so many years? Does it apply to my whole insurance premium? (1 car, 2 bikes) The 100 days requirement, is that 100 recorded trips no matter how short a distance they are? 1000 kms would certainly prove to be an easy hurdle to pass over 100 driving days.

Inquiring minds want to know.
I'm certain the discount is permanent. I think it applies all vehicles where you are the primary driver but you'll have to ask them to be sure. 100 days is distinct dates with driving trips. For example, if you drive once per week, it'll take you two years to reach 100 days.
 

LePhillou

Well-known member
Site Supporter
I have something similar but for Life Insurance...not as intrusive though.

It's called manulife vitality, and you get points for your activity level during the day (5k, 10k, 15k steps or time doing an activity @ x % of heart rate)
As you gain points, your premium goes down... so bronze, silver, gold, platinum... at each level you get some "perks", ie, amazon gift cards (platinum gives you a $50 gift card) and monthly you get to play in randomized games that could get you more points or points + amazon gift cards... each week that you hit a certain number of points you get to "spin" for points or amazon money.

You can also get a smartwatch out of it (currently only apple watch, they used to have garmin too). Rebates at goodlife, etc etc.

Supposedly most members of that plan reach platinum... and to me it makes sense since i'm already active 'enough'. You get points for having a health checkup (cholesterol, blood pressure, etc) and having good habits. The one thing i find iffy is they use BMI as an indicator as well which...works well for the masses isn't a great indicator of health.

Since the data used is mainly heart rate and/or steps + my health markers, i'm okay with it.
But the type of tracking the ajusto does is a bit too intrusive i find.
 

Twisted Wrister

Well-known member
When these become the norm. Insurance companies will jack up the price to make up for the shortfall of revenue.
Also driving to suit the device and not traffic/road condition might put the driver at risk. Sometimes you have to brake hard or accelerate to get out of a potentially dangerous situation.
I think it reduces their risk and costs by more than the discount. Claims hurt their bottom line the most. That said, most people are like me and never file a claim yet still pay 150-350/mo.
I agree with you a bit about driving for the device. I have veered onto the shoulder to avoid setting off the braking penalty and I've run a couple really late yellows/early reds that I would have normally stopped for easily. Everything else on this thing is cake, just that hard braking penalty is too strict. If it was a little less sensitive, it would be fair. The app knows you need to brake hard sometimes but doing it twice in one trip dropped me from 25% to 20% discount which is a pretty hard hit. That was 10 days ago and I'm only up to 23% now.
 

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