Forget Power Commanders! - Attention Rider's Choice

Prince

Prince

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So I was talking to the guys at M4 and threw this idea out to them. A month later this site shows up:

www.gixxertune.com

You mail in your ECU, and they will flash and program it to whatever aftermarket exhaust you have. Or they will mail you a pre-flashed ECU and you mail yours in as a core. My idea? I guess it is but I don't care, I'm sick of buying PC's. They will do this for half the cost of a PC with a better result.

Riders Choice, if you're reading this, put your dyno to work and start recording maps and following this model. There's a huge opportunity here for you to make some dollars.
 
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I agree. This is a much cleaner solution and the way I would probably go......I'm not comfortable with "add-ons" that trick your ECU (with only partial success). The only way to get an optimal tune though is to get the bike on a dyno and spend some time on it. Their mail-in option would leave some ponies on the table.
 
.....nothing new...people have been reflashing suzuki ecu's for a while....
 
So you think buying an ECU that has been tuned in California, under California weather and altitude conditions...And expect it to run properly here in Canada under our much different conditions?

Not only is every bike different, where you live makes a huge difference as to what mapping your bike requires....
 
This is different from making use of the built-in adjustment of the stock ECU (which Rider's Choice, and other shops, can already do). Lately, the possibility of re-flashing stock ECU's has become much more readily available, and there are several companies doing it.

There are advantages and disadvantages to both the Power Commander method and the re-flashing method. It's not uncommon to use BOTH strategies because neither is fully a replacement for the other.

Re-flashing allows built-in restrictions to be changed or eliminated (different mapping in each gear to restrict power, top-speed limiters, rev limiters, secondary throttle actuation, funky programming of ignition timing, etc) and Power Commanders cannot do this.

But, Power Commanders allow easy on-the-spot air/fuel-ratio adjustments and (if you have the right module) ignition timing adjustments. Can't do that if you have to mail the ECU out and wait for it to come back.
 
murf said:
I do think FI compensates for different pressures, temps etc
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To a certain extent yes, but it still doesnt make sense to have your tuning done on the other side of the world, off the bike...Waste of money IMO, leave it stock or have a proper dyno tune done locally....Or if your fancy auto tune via 02 sensor (PCV/Bazzaz).....

For the most part %99 of customers are fine with a stock map, or a PC with a downloaded or preloaded map for the specific bike/exhaust combo...

Ive had some bikes run great on a stock map with a full system exhaust, others needed tuning...
 
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Good timing for the thread...30 mins ago I finally (I think) got rid of my flat spot on my bike using my *** dyno and a PCIII. Remarkeable how just a few very small changes to the map makes a big difference. FYI, my slip-on exhaust isn't exactly that common so I couldn't find a suitable map online, I had to make changes to what I guessed might be the closest available map. This will do until I can afford a dyno run or 10.
 
Hence the "Attention Rider's Choice" part. They could easily implement this model for Canadian riders.

JohnnyP636 said:
So you think buying an ECU that has been tuned in California, under California weather and altitude conditions...And expect it to run properly here in Canada under our much different conditions?Not only is every bike different, where you live makes a huge difference as to what mapping your bike requires....
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Prince said:
They will do this for half the cost of a PC with a better result.
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They are $300? How is that half the price, Royal Distributing is selling PCIII's for Gixxers for $250 right now?
 
FWIW the atmospheric conditions in LA vs. Ontario would be negligible. I've been licensed as a mechanic a very long time and I've never once had a vehicle drive from the hot or even elevated parts of the US to Ontario and have their vehicle all of a sudden running like a broken d*ck. The ECU "will" make any and all adjustments for atmospheric conditions. I'm hoping Rider's Choice will take this idea and run with it as it's a win-win for all. A better running bike for half the cost to riders and a lot of business for Rider's Choice.
JohnnyP636 said:
So you think buying an ECU that has been tuned in California, under California weather and altitude conditions...And expect it to run properly here in Canada under our much different conditions?Not only is every bike different, where you live makes a huge difference as to what mapping your bike requires....
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Royal is clearing out old stock. PCIII's are old technology. You want a PCV with the auto tune (snapshot) adapter if you're going to go that way. It'll cost you over $500 and you won't have a pre-dyno tuned bike tuned to your specific exhaust.
jeffjones said:
They are $300? How is that half the price, Royal Distributing is selling PCIII's for Gixxers for $250 right now?
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reciprocity said:
Who's going to do the programming??
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Sorry, I don't understand your question. And my 1999 Gixx was carbed. Rider's Choice is already flashing ECU's. All they have to do is save the maps of the bikes they've dyno'd and catalogue them according to the specific exhausts they've already done. They're already three quarters of the way there. Once cataloged it's a matter of shipping and receiving. They can even do as this site has done and offer free dyno tunes to specific combos i.e.. my bike, 2009 - 2011 GSXR 1000 with M4 to assist in building their catalogue.
 
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FYI you can not do something akin to "auto-tune" via ECU re-flashing (well, actually you CAN, but it's clumsy and awkward unless you can re-flash directly via OBD-II port, which bikes don't yet have ...)

Normally what happens is that the fuel mapping is sorted out via an add-on box (example: Power Commander), then after that's all taken care of, a map which is akin to the Power Commander map that was developed gets flashed into the ECU so that the Power Commander is no longer needed.

You can not flash the *identical* Power Commander map, because the map in the stock ECU has far more RPM and throttle position data points on it - far greater resolution - which means it would have to be interpolated out of the Power Commander map, a process which is not 100% accurate ... but a Power Commander is far from 100% accurate at interpolating between data points anyway ...
 
While I appreciate the technicals, I think you've missed the entire point of the business model.
Brian P said:
FYI you can not do something akin to "auto-tune" via ECU re-flashing (well, actually you CAN, but it's clumsy and awkward unless you can re-flash directly via OBD-II port, which bikes don't yet have ...)Normally what happens is that the fuel mapping is sorted out via an add-on box (example: Power Commander), then after that's all taken care of, a map which is akin to the Power Commander map that was developed gets flashed into the ECU so that the Power Commander is no longer needed.You can not flash the *identical* Power Commander map, because the map in the stock ECU has far more RPM and throttle position data points on it - far greater resolution - which means it would have to be interpolated out of the Power Commander map, a process which is not 100% accurate ... but a Power Commander is far from 100% accurate at interpolating between data points anyway ...
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Prince said:
You want a PCV with the auto tune (snapshot) adapter if you're going to go that way. It'll cost you over $500 and you won't have a pre-dyno tuned bike tuned to your specific exhaust.
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Isn't that what PC already did? When you pick your bike and your exhaust and load that map?


Prince said:
All they have to do is save the maps of the bikes they've dyno'd and catalogue them according to the specific exhausts they've already done.
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And so your saying if someone dyno-tunes there bike for same bike same exhaust, Mine is going to run Identical to theirs on the dyno?
 
Prince said:
Sorry, I don't understand your question. And my 1999 Gixx was carbed. Rider's Choice is already flashing ECU's. All they have to do is save the maps of the bikes they've dyno'd and catalogue them according to the specific exhausts they've already done. They're already three quarters of the way there. Once cataloged it's a matter of shipping and receiving. They can even do as this site has done and offer free dyno tunes to specific combos i.e.. my bike, 2009 - 2011 GSXR 1000 with M4 to assist in building their catalogue.
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the 99 GSXR750 was fuel injected.

I know a tiny bit about the infrastructure at Riders choice, I set up all of the tuning hardware and software at their site.

The model you're talking about requires someone with programming knowledge as the tuning has to be pulled out of the OEM ecu.

This is more complicated than inputting a state of tune.
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