waaaaa??? you haven't eliminated your fender and put on $2 blinky lights?? Heathen!
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Loud Vehicle Legislation Across Canada
- Thread starter CanadianBiker
- Start date
waaaaa??? you haven't eliminated your fender and put on $2 blinky lights?? Heathen!
Both Harley and Energetica have engineered a gear noise into the drivetrain. I rode a Brammo Empulse R in California this spring.
Zero range is 170miles. Brammo 130 city, 70 highway.
The Zero is built like a 125-250 in size, the Empulse is like a Ducati 696. They are fun, but the price is unrealistic. Neither has an appropriate transmission, which is why highway range is limited.
And that's also how it works (or rather doesn't work) in the downtown core, with all of those office buildings to bounce sound off of.
油井緋色;2205856 said:
I think what we have for cars is more or less acceptable, with the exception that we (i.e. the EPA) have pushed too hard for too little benefit recently. I don't think that legislating fuel economy was a great idea, only time will tell what the true impact of that will be.
What we have for motorcycles ranges from "ok" to "very half-assed"... a simple test for this is the presence of an O2 sensor. Contrast the CBR125 which has one, with say a Kawasaki Ninja 1000... which does not (or didn't used to, not sure about 2014). Wonder how long each of the respective catalytic converters will continue to do anything useful...
I was referring to people wasting money on loud exhausts for their piece of crap cars. I'm not referring to the actual tuner cars where the performance exhausts are actually doing something other than making a loud continuous farting noise....
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theraymondguy
Well-known member
This is so long overdue. Our church is on Lundy's Lane, near the 1814 Battle memorial (they've constructed a wall on the one side that acts as an echo chamber, the other side of the chamber being the church) and you can hear the pipes fart and the intake honk as they rock up the hill and then the decel slobber / pop and wheeze as they roll down the hill all service long.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a hotrodder and always will be. But street performance shouldn't come down to who's the noisiest. If it's 'excessively loud' for 'excessively long', it sure as heck isn't 'excessively fast' is it?
FWIW for the guys / Police looking to use SPL / dB meters - this is a fools errand. There are so many variables, proximity to a wall for example - I think we all realize that an engine makes the most noise when they are pulling max vacuum, taking a measurement of the engine revving in a static position (don't want wind noise tampering with the reading, also don't forget most SPL / dB meters require that the mic be 1 Meter away from the source for accuracy) isn't going to prove much.
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The US knows too well they can no longer afford wars to keep control of oil, they need to lessen their economy on foreign oil dependence. It has nothing to do with the EPA. It's about money.
Low motorcycle sales and low mileage of bikes has avoided the EPA, as well as self-regulation by the industry, but customers are screwing that up. California has a law that forbids any aftermarket exhaust, but its not enforced, yet.
Modern bikes gain nothing from louder slipons anyway. It's just more noise.
theraymondguy
Well-known member
Lol, I guess you're right. I'm stuck in the age of carburetors and points ignition.
Buzzomatic
Active member
That's a strawman argument. 18 wheelers, dump trucks, buses and yes trains could all be made to produce far less noise. A sportbike with a full system can produce a significantly more HP. Is that necessary for the street? I don't know but if society wants to address noise pollution, it should be done in an evenhanded manner. Say at the manufacturer level or the vehicle inspection level. Not at the cop can pull over "any bike he wants, any time he wants" to check his pipe! level.
Bike manufacturers already make quiet bikes, even Harley. If they leave it to the safety certification level, then some kid will just take the bike home and slap on a baffle-less Akrapovic.
It's too easy to swap exhausts.
Not trying to argue your overall point, but it is worth mentioning that trucks and buses ARE being produced quieter and cleaner. At a considerable cost to the end user, I might add. Bikes are arguably the least affected so far by pollution and noise control, so really some new enforcement techniques are of no real surprise. I'd love to know the percentage of motorcycles with aftermarket exhausts compared to the percentage of any other vehicle with a modified exhaust.
a >3 yr old sport bike or Harley with a stock exhaust is a rare beast. They used to rot out in about 5 years, but all bikes now have stainless systems.
This is complete nonsense. I want to think you're putting us on. But I fear you're not.:glasses6:
Buzzomatic
Active member
Slipons that add only looks and noise (can be done with close to stock sound output) are silly and cruzers with straight pipes are ignorant. The beer cooler sized CAT on my bike tells me they have the emissions under control these days. I'm more concerned with giving the discretion to law enforcement when they can't test and write an accurate ticket on site.
Buzzomatic
Active member
No, not really. Care to elaborate on why you think its nonsense?
CanadianBiker
Well-known member
All vehicles are subject to Transport Canada standards and regulations and in Ontario the HTA already forbids modifying an exhaust system to produce "excessive" sound. The new municipal laws being enacted quantify what exactly what is excessive. And they're being enacted as a direct result of far too many motorcyclists making far too much noise for absolutely no good reason. If a stock SS makes 100+HP, there's no way anyone needs more on the street. Even lumbering cruisers like mine which barely break 70HP can manage to keep up with traffic in stock form. The real strawman arguments are made by those who cite safety as the reason they "need" to make noise.
Yes, the laws are discriminatory. For good reason.
Like I said, all vehicles are improving emissions wise, but bikes are nowhere near the level of most other modes. Specifically, any obviously identifiable (i.e: easy to target) group that modifies their stuff IS being targeted. Ever go to a darknights show? Fart cans, nitrous, all kinds of mods are regularly ticketed for. Personally, this is one time where I do want enforcement discretion; it's far too subjective to use the current testing they have now. Straight pipes, no baffles, should simply be an automatic plate removal. That would easily address cars, cruisers and sportbikes equally. The discretion of course, would be there to protect the oldsters that legitimately have to use aftermarkets for their vintage stuff
Buzzomatic
Active member
The devil is in the details. I don't believe it will be enforced equally. I also think that other major noise polluters are not regulated or enforced adequately (Trucks, Busses, Trains). Their is an epidemic of unsafe driving going on right now (electronics use, speeding) that is costing lives. Is this what we as a society want the police focusing on? Get this this issue off the roads as much as possible. Make non noise compliant exhaust systems illegal for sale period. Tracks are all starting to measure noise output anyway.
Race tuners might have something to say about that.
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