brucewayne
Well-known member
i like turtles
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New rider with many question
- Thread starter DFlikks
- Start date
When a mistake happens on behalf of the driver (or someone else), which face it, is very likely during the initial baby-steps learning stages of driving....survivability is far better in a cage.
Anyone who suggests that a newly minted 16 year old driver is going to go out and know everything (despite what they think), be able to anticipate everything, and handles his vehicle perfectly is living in some la-la land of alternate reality. They're not invincible either, again, despite what they think.
A very, very small percentage of those left behind look at it from that perspective. When someone very intentionally and by choice, despite the odds, puts themselves in a dangerous situation and pays the ultimate price, most people left behind often wish that their loved one had made a better choice, not that he "died doing what he loved".
I agree the OP is making a wise choice starting out on a low CC bike, seems responsible and realistic, etc etc etc...but when it comes down to it and he's out driving one day and gets into a situation where more experience would have been able to prevent it, it's hard to not argue the old saying - experience counts. Gaining that initial baby-steps experience is far safer in a cage.
Did not read whole thread, hope I'm not out of line. Road awareness via osmosis. They strap you into a car seat as a toddler and you've been riding shotgun coming up on a couple decades. If you don't have road awareness check for pulse. Ride motocross for hard interface.
Rode street bikes from 16-21 when I bought my first cage (had driven cars occasionally). Changed the way I drove a car for the better. Any vehicle has dangers and motorcycles have a greater inherent risk due to lack of protection. However, I am not one to say that at a certain age there should be a restriction. Everyone matures and learns differently. Some people still act like 12 year olds when they are grown adults. Others are fairly mature at 16. We cannot throw a blanket over everyone and come out with a set of guidelines. I have known several people killed on motorcycles, from 16 years old to 50 years old, and it doesn't matter what the experience, it CAN happen to anyone at anytime.
My sons will not be deterred from getting motorcycles, just like I was not deterred from getting one. Safety and responsibility is something everyone needs to learn regardless of their age. JMHO.
My sons will not be deterred from getting motorcycles, just like I was not deterred from getting one. Safety and responsibility is something everyone needs to learn regardless of their age. JMHO.
I bought my first street bike at 16, 500 two stroke at 17. Didn't buy a car until I was in my 20s.
It's not hard at all.....driving a cage is not riding a motorcycle and from my perspective is a negative. I have two very good riders my son and his friend ( now my staff ) who I've participated with since they started off road nearly a decade ago to illustrate my point.
My son got his G for work when he was 22. No tickets, no accidents, and he rides hard. Rides 9 months of the year and did a 10k 22 day trip to the west with me this summer.
Both started off road at Motopark, both started with small bikes..my son with two 50cc scoots and then moved up.
The OP is on the right track...leave off with the negative crap...gets tiresome. The way you learn to be responsble is to take responsibility.
He's come here to ask questions and get intelligent answer, not get talked out it by pantywaists
I gotta say PrivatePilot...if that's indicative of your "other pursuit"....you are hardly one to lecture...
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Driving experience is driving experience is driving experience, period.It's not hard at all.....driving a cage is not riding a motorcycle and from my perspective is a negative. I have two very good riders my son and his friend ( now my staff ) who I've participated with since they started off road nearly a decade ago to illustrate my point.
My son got his G for work when he was 22. No tickets, no accidents, and he rides hard. Rides 9 months of the year and did a 10k 22 day trip to the west with me this summer.
Both started off road at Motopark, both started with small bikes..my son with two 50cc scoots and then moved up.
The OP is on the right track...leave off with the negative crap...gets tiresome. The way you learn to be responsble is to take responsibility.
He's come here to ask questions and get intelligent answer, not get talked out it by pantywaists
I gotta say PrivatePilot...if that's indicative of your "other pursuit"....you are hardly one to lecture...
If he's going to live out in the sticks, never go into the city, and move to Australia for six months of the year, then it might be less consequential to not have city driving experience. Also, if he's not tremendously wealthy, or has someone to pay his way, then the costs are also consequential, to participate in a recreational activity.
Sparkcycle
Well-known member
Another good reason to drive a car before a bike is that you get first-hand awareness of which areas around the car are hard to see a bike in. Knowing the visibility profile of cars will help you stay within view on a bike so drivers don't forget you're there.
So you now are stooping to a personal attack because you are losing your argument..or just jealous perhaps?
...I've been riding for 50 years - sometimes all year round in university and generally 9 months here. Why would you think Australia has anything to do with it aside from the fact that I have to adjust to opposite sides of the road twice a year which has its own set of challenges.
We don't live in the "sticks", here or Australia , we ride in the GTA all the time and take your off topic snarks and shove it.
•••••
http://www.bikebandit.com/blog/post/7-reasons-motorcycle-riders-are-better-car-drivers
Even the insurance companies know the benefits...
Learn to RIDE first, then to drive a cage if you want to.
To each his/her own...
Learning to ride before driving is asinine. New drivers and riders make mistakes. Lack of road experience and awareness increases the risk. Would you rather make a mistake on a motorcycle or in a car? Pretty damn straight forward. The last thing I'd want is my own kid learning to handle a motorcycle while also learning the intricacies of road use. Double your fun!!!!
Makes good sense... ^^^^^^^^
You're right, keep your kind off motorcycles completely. I'd prefer a better demographic to base our insurance rates on. Any other narrow views you would like society to acquiesce to? Maybe we can just sell off the motorcycles and buy a **** ton of bubble wrap.
x2.
When a kid starts driving you have no clue what you're driving headlong into, with no clue nor understanding of the sheer stupidity of most other drivers on the road..and you're at the whim of forces you have no idea even exist yet (physics to mention but one)...due to inexperience. That's a lot of things going against a new driver.
Put a brand new driver behind the wheel of a car and set off into traffic and see how quickly they get mentally overwhelmed and "behind" in their actions - it happens to most very quickly. Would you really want your kid mentally overloaded, 2 or 3 seconds behind in physical control vs mental observation, and all alone with nobody to give them advice or pointers...on a bike?
Having a cage (literally) around you during that formative stage is a potential lifesaver, quite literally.
I can't help but see a hypocrisy here. You're a truck driver, right? Allow me to bring you back to a time when you were learning how to do so.....without exception, every student I had in a tractor trailer approached this new task with a respectful trepidation, and yet the only mechanism available to teach them the intricacies of such a heavy and large vehicle was to get out and do it. There is no starting out with a "small" version of an AZ class vehicle or air brakes. And yeah, you'll be so much safer in a big truck, but God help everyone else.
In the context of this thread, the OP has already shown an equally respectful trepidation to learning the hobby, and there is no better way to learn than to ride a bike. I suggest that the added "protection" of a cage brings a serious disservice to the equation, in that the insulating qualities of being in a vehicle with so many driver aids will in fact keep them from the sensation that a more visceral vehicle with provide (G force, speed, spacial awareness, etc).
The fact that the only hypothetical example you guys can provide is "union station at rush hour" is further evidence of a complete lack of understanding to how people learn, and an arrogance that your way is the only way. Young people are often underestimated, and usually when it provides convenience for you to do so. It was fine when a 17 yr old could go to war, become a parent, ride a snowmobile or atv, play pro sports, or even contest world championship motorcycle racing. But hey, if your Little Johnny can't navigate a suburbanite traffic circle, we should all just keep 'em under wraps until they're 30. Love it
On a motorcycle, many times you need to have split-second decision making as they are so quick and nimble... and as PrivatePilot mentioned, if that 'new, inexperienced rider' gets a tad overwhelmed with his/her thought process, well....... need I say more???
Many new, inexperienced drivers/riders can be timid of the whole driving process... Timidness and Motorcycles don't mix well...
