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Motorcycle Airbag vests (fortnine)
- Thread starter bigpoppa
- Start date
Priller
Well-known member
As has become usual, I have some real beefs with some of the opinions presented as fact in the video, though it does highlight just how well airbags work as safety apparel.
He dismisses the Klim/in&Motion option due to the subscription model, skipping over the fact that A) you have the option to buy for a similar price to the competition, and b) that the subscription model has some real cost benefits, particularly as the tech in this are is improving fast. Not to mention his concern around 'forgetting to pay' is not a concern for anyone who can manage bills. You can even stop payment for the winter if you so choose, but no mention of that. The in&motion system also can work for both street and track (though there is an extra cost for the track function), which isn't true for a lot of the competition.
He also doesn't talk about how the tether system has some real drawbacks for lowsides where the rider and bike don't separate until after hitting the ground. This is a very common crash, and while it's often relatively mild, broken bones aren't unheard of.
As for charging the battery, they mostly last quite a while (30+ hours), so if you charge when it gets yellow instead of red, you'll never have a problem. Who waits to leave the house before checking if their phone is charged?
I've been looking at a bunch of options, as I'm sold on the safety benefits outweighing the cost. I had wanted one that worked for street and track, but my suit is too snug to throw one underneath. Right now I'm leaning towards the Klim in&motion unit, as RST is coming out with some airbag suits later this year that use the same module. For the one monthly cost, I can swap the module between the Klim vest and the RST suit, and have something with the latest algorithms. I've heard Alpinestars is planning to add track functionality to their TechAir 5 vest, but don't know if that's happening anytime soon...
He dismisses the Klim/in&Motion option due to the subscription model, skipping over the fact that A) you have the option to buy for a similar price to the competition, and b) that the subscription model has some real cost benefits, particularly as the tech in this are is improving fast. Not to mention his concern around 'forgetting to pay' is not a concern for anyone who can manage bills. You can even stop payment for the winter if you so choose, but no mention of that. The in&motion system also can work for both street and track (though there is an extra cost for the track function), which isn't true for a lot of the competition.
He also doesn't talk about how the tether system has some real drawbacks for lowsides where the rider and bike don't separate until after hitting the ground. This is a very common crash, and while it's often relatively mild, broken bones aren't unheard of.
As for charging the battery, they mostly last quite a while (30+ hours), so if you charge when it gets yellow instead of red, you'll never have a problem. Who waits to leave the house before checking if their phone is charged?
I've been looking at a bunch of options, as I'm sold on the safety benefits outweighing the cost. I had wanted one that worked for street and track, but my suit is too snug to throw one underneath. Right now I'm leaning towards the Klim in&motion unit, as RST is coming out with some airbag suits later this year that use the same module. For the one monthly cost, I can swap the module between the Klim vest and the RST suit, and have something with the latest algorithms. I've heard Alpinestars is planning to add track functionality to their TechAir 5 vest, but don't know if that's happening anytime soon...
Priller
Well-known member
Yes, for the vests worn under the suit. The Klim one is a Level 1 CE back protector as is, then a level 50 one if it goes off...
I'm curious to know why no one has come out with one that is a mix, electronic with a replaceable CO2 cartridge? Seems like that would be a winner. Not that you would want to, but you could crash 3x in the same day and have it functional all 3x. And not have the costs associated with shipping back and forth to and from Italy.
Ride42
Well-known member
This is something we will be able to offer thru PLUS racing (Track use only system). More details will be made available in the spring
Relax
Well-known member
Helite has one, don't know why Fortnine didn't mention it.
The one time I got really hurt was when I got ejected and landed on my shoulder, breaking my collarbone and cracking my shoulder blade. The Alpinestars looks like it has the best shoulder coverage and would have saved me some pain. I don't understand why it can't be charged while riding, but I usually remember to charge my helmet after a ride, so plugging in the vest at the same time is no big deal.
Because humans are stupid. When we fall we reach out to break our fall. It works when we are messing around playing human trampoline, not so much at 140kmh.
Priller
Well-known member
From what I've read, the Argon cylinders can inflate faster because they're able to maintain a higher pressure. It then becomes a trade-off between easy/cheap refills and protection. Similarly, the Helite vest is much bigger, but again takes longer to fill.
The Klim vest offers replaceable Argon cartridges, but they're $99 USD each. Klim also wants to inspect the vest after three inflations, which is the cost of shipping.
Same with cyclists. One interesting thing is collarbone breaks used to be one of the most common injuries for GP racers, but that seems to have dropped dramatically since airbags were introduced.
I can't speak for these specifically, but powering accelerometers from a source with noise on it can cause you issues. A battery has no noise, many USB supplies are terrible, I've never scoped the noise on a bike while running but I suspect there will be a bunch. It's not insurmountable, but when you plug an unknown power supply in with an unknown amount of noise, you need to have rock solid filtering in your device to ensure that noise doesn't affect the data acquired. It is much simpler and cheaper to turn off the sensitive bits while charging and fire them up again once you are on battery.
Relax
Well-known member
All the doctors told me the collarbone is one of the weakest bones in the human body. It's not uncommon for babies to break them during birth squeezing through the birth canal. On the flip side, they thought it was crazy that I managed to crack my shoulder blade, being one of the strongest bones.
Ya, that hurts. Broke my scapula into three pieces. Took a long time to heal.
They're long and skinny, don't get to spread the load to other bones and don't have much padding on them. Also as wingboy said, keep your arms in if at all possible. I give the kids hell everytime they stick their arms out in a fall. Keeping them in close to your chest can absorb just as much energy and you don't break things or blow joints. The exception is if you are going to land on top of your head. In one bicycle crash, I was going to lawndart into the concrete so I put out my arm to save my brain. It worked but permanently wrecked my shoulder.
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Relax
Well-known member
I went into the field at the end of the Fabi straight on my first track day. I stood it up and tried to ride it out, but hit some huge pothole and got catapulted off. My fiends in the control tower said I got wicked air. Then I landed with all my weight squarely on my shoulder.
Same here: collarbone and shoulder blade. Collarbones are "Nature's crumple zone", but you do need to eff up pretty bad to also break the shoulder blade. Tire slipped a tiny bit while leaned over in the carousel at Grand Bend, I spooked and stood it up, grabbed way too much front brake and pile-drove myself into the ground when I hit the dusty stuff at the edge of the track.
All the nurses made disapproving tsking noises when they saw the x-rays. Surgery the next day for a collarbone plate, 5+ weeks in a sling. Bone healed fine, but I still have to stretch things every couple of days because of the time in the sling.
An appropriate Alpinestars suit + airbag costs as much as my entire trackbike, but would I spend $3000 to avoid another 5 weeks in a sling? Probably yes. For some reason my reluctance to spend the cash centers around the need to send the whole thing back to Alpinestars in the US to get it recharged. At least I hear that you don't have to send it back to Italy to get it recharged anymore...
All the nurses made disapproving tsking noises when they saw the x-rays. Surgery the next day for a collarbone plate, 5+ weeks in a sling. Bone healed fine, but I still have to stretch things every couple of days because of the time in the sling.
An appropriate Alpinestars suit + airbag costs as much as my entire trackbike, but would I spend $3000 to avoid another 5 weeks in a sling? Probably yes. For some reason my reluctance to spend the cash centers around the need to send the whole thing back to Alpinestars in the US to get it recharged. At least I hear that you don't have to send it back to Italy to get it recharged anymore...
Drop/fall/slide and roll would be perfect. However, instinct takes over. You have a split second to decide what to do. If possible.
Which obviously is almost impossible. For a slow speed accident, you might have time. Who wants to go slow? Is that not why we love the thrill of any sport?
For example skiing/ boarding both generally have different injuries. Boarders, because of the way they fall. The arm goes out by instinct. Skiers have more knee injuries. The body twists and the legs is facing the wrong way.
Same applies to cyclists we defend the body thinking the best way is to stick our arms out.
In line skaters, same thing. shoulder injuries.
Car injuries, slightly different. Wrist because you do the same, you hang onto the arm rest/ dashboard. inertia takes over. Hip injuries. We put our legs out to brace for impact. Again, inertia takes over. The legs are stretched out except the body moves forward, hence, dislocated hip or hips.
Yes, I most definitely wear an inflated vest. Helite. I carry spare cartridges. The weird thing is when i got into a small speed accident. The vest went off and immediately people stopped to help. Lucky for me, she was very kind and beautiful. (No we did not get married. Lol) She immediately offered to help me get up. However, As the vest was inflated, I could not get up. I felt like a Rolly Polly ball, until the vest deflated.
Moral of the story (Finally) I have checked out the other vests and what Ryan said is totally true. Why would I want to send it back to the company and spend $150+ when I can simple screw in another cartridge?
With regards to the insight of the injuries mentioned above. Some of them happened to me and I was an EMT/Instructor/ Instructor Trainer.
Some I witnessed and some I was involved in. What are the last words you say? Oh Sheet. In my case sometimes, not again.
I am sure we have started death in the face. Unfortunately, some do not make it. So. Don`t be a squid.
If you think you look stupid in the middle of Summer, you look stupider? in hospital going through endless skin grafts. With your latest skin graft coming from your bum onto your face. Etc.
OK. sorry, done preaching. Spend the money.
Which obviously is almost impossible. For a slow speed accident, you might have time. Who wants to go slow? Is that not why we love the thrill of any sport?
For example skiing/ boarding both generally have different injuries. Boarders, because of the way they fall. The arm goes out by instinct. Skiers have more knee injuries. The body twists and the legs is facing the wrong way.
Same applies to cyclists we defend the body thinking the best way is to stick our arms out.
In line skaters, same thing. shoulder injuries.
Car injuries, slightly different. Wrist because you do the same, you hang onto the arm rest/ dashboard. inertia takes over. Hip injuries. We put our legs out to brace for impact. Again, inertia takes over. The legs are stretched out except the body moves forward, hence, dislocated hip or hips.
Yes, I most definitely wear an inflated vest. Helite. I carry spare cartridges. The weird thing is when i got into a small speed accident. The vest went off and immediately people stopped to help. Lucky for me, she was very kind and beautiful. (No we did not get married. Lol) She immediately offered to help me get up. However, As the vest was inflated, I could not get up. I felt like a Rolly Polly ball, until the vest deflated.
Moral of the story (Finally) I have checked out the other vests and what Ryan said is totally true. Why would I want to send it back to the company and spend $150+ when I can simple screw in another cartridge?
With regards to the insight of the injuries mentioned above. Some of them happened to me and I was an EMT/Instructor/ Instructor Trainer.
Some I witnessed and some I was involved in. What are the last words you say? Oh Sheet. In my case sometimes, not again.
I am sure we have started death in the face. Unfortunately, some do not make it. So. Don`t be a squid.
If you think you look stupid in the middle of Summer, you look stupider? in hospital going through endless skin grafts. With your latest skin graft coming from your bum onto your face. Etc.
OK. sorry, done preaching. Spend the money.
Is there a deflation release to pull or it just bleeds off pressure over time?
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