How`s your house pricing doing?..

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Renboy said:
I didn't realize it was that long ago for exterior walls.
If a run is longer than a certain distance (30' for example) then recirculation is required. That one I know for sure because a friend built a house a few years ago and he was the one that told me about it.
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30m for recirculating or 4 storeys. That exempts most houses.
 
GreyGhost said:
30m for recirculating or 4 storeys. That exempts most houses.
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Recirculating is simple and not that expensive, a pump plus a length of pipe in new construction, or a crossover valve in existing construction. It’s also great for outbuildings as it offers some freeze protection. It’s also a great convenience upgrade.
 
Renboy said:
That's how it should be. Putting $30 outlets and $100 useless pain in the @ss breakers all over the place is nonsense.
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On the flip side tho don't be so cheap as to have things like residential grade receptacles in you place.
The extra couple of dollars each for spec/commercial grade receptacles is a no brainer.
 
Renboy said:
Just going off the top of my head.
2x6 exterior walls instead of 2x4.
Insulation for those walls.
Attics I believe now require r60.
HRV systems.
Copper wire is at retarded prices.
AFCI and GFCI pretty much everywhere now.
Hardwired smoke detectors with flashing lights.
Recirculating pump and line for runs longer than a certain distance (can't remember the number).
Drain water heat recovery pipes.
Anti-scalding mixing valves.
Plumbing materials have gotten cheaper and is way faster to install (pex vs copper).
Cost of labour has gone way up in the last 10 years or so for all trades.

Then there are the wants. Carpet is basically non-existant anymore. Tile and wood are far more expensive. Curbless showers instead of fibreglass pans. Kitchens loaded with granite even though most people couldn't make a sandwich to save their life.

All the crap adds up. And this is just off the top of my head. There's more for sure.
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Some of that stuff is also expensive to maintain.
 
Renboy said:
Just going off the top of my head.
2x6 exterior walls instead of 2x4.
Insulation for those walls.
Attics I believe now require r60.
HRV systems.
Copper wire is at retarded prices.
AFCI and GFCI pretty much everywhere now.
Hardwired smoke detectors with flashing lights.
Recirculating pump and line for runs longer than a certain distance (can't remember the number).
Drain water heat recovery pipes.
Anti-scalding mixing valves.
Plumbing materials have gotten cheaper and is way faster to install (pex vs copper).
Cost of labour has gone way up in the last 10 years or so for all trades.

Then there are the wants. Carpet is basically non-existant anymore. Tile and wood are far more expensive. Curbless showers instead of fibreglass pans. Kitchens loaded with granite even though most people couldn't make a sandwich to save their life.

All the crap adds up. And this is just off the top of my head. There's more for sure.
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I'm a supporter of passive systems so the 2X6 walls and insulation are OK.

Building materials are subject to inflation like everything else so copper pipe and wire are a necessary evil. A 4000 SF house has ~ twice the evil of a 2000 footer.

Heat recovery systems, mixer valves, sprinkler systems, active solar systems etc all require maintenance which is money you can't put towards the mortgage payment. If they are complex it means $150 to $200 an hour for service.

Granite looks like crap if it doesn't get a spa day once or twice a year so, in comes the guy with a buffer. $150 taps don't look right so to balance the posh factor the taps are 5X the price.

To maintain the posh balance throughout the house all trim in all the rooms have to be posh. If you don't do it, the plain rooms stand out like a half iced cake.

The tax man notices how expensive your house looks and smiles.

What does a couple need in a house?

My cousins had a place in Rochester NY when Kodak was solid. No kids but they entertained a lot in their story and a half, three bedroom detached.

It had a 30 ampere 120 volt service, two fuses. One circuit did lights and the other did receptacles. The stove and clothes drier were gas and the furnace gas with no fan. It relied on convection. Other than going through a lot of fuses when someone tried making toast and tea at the same time it worked fine. You had to be patient.

You also had to be aware of what other people were doing in the house so no toast or tea if someone is drying their hair. You also had to think about usage.

Labour rates are high so your DIY efforts, if done right, pay you higher rates. You get your hands dirty but the tens of thousands you save buys a lot of soap.

Inflation is dependent on inflated egos and too many people have distorted expectations expectations.
 
How about roofs? A nice simple gable roof with all the same rafters and two simple planes to shingle. Instead all the new McMansions have roofs with more peaks and vallies than an EKG readout. A sea of complicated rafters with every change in plane an opportunity for leaks.
 
timtune said:
How about roofs? A nice simple gable roof with all the same rafters and two simple planes to shingle. Instead all the new McMansions have roofs with more peaks and vallies than an EKG readout. A sea of complicated rafters with every change in plane an opportunity for leaks.
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Yup...seeing lots of roofs with so many sides/edges/slopes that it's got to be a nightmare to do.

Ours is simple....2 roofs with fairly small slopes.

Time to start saving.
 
Dirty Frank said:
On the flip side tho don't be so cheap as to have things like residential grade receptacles in you place.
The extra couple of dollars each for spec/commercial grade receptacles is a no brainer.
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x2.....the builders grade receptacles, switches and dimmers are garbage.

Plugs/switches I like Leviton or Eaton and dimmers I use nothing but Lutron (Caseta - no one every complained about a little more $$ for lighting controls)
 
Renboy said:
That's how it should be. Putting $30 outlets and $100 useless pain in the @ss breakers all over the place is nonsense.
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I sat on the Electro Federation for years and was a voting member when manufacturers spearheaded by Eaton, Schneider, Siemens and GE, to get the CE Code changed to require ACFI's in bedroom circuits - their reasoning was bedrooms had dressers that usually had things plugged in behind them and if the plug did not have a 90 degree connector you could get a series arcing fault and it could lead to a fire.

Once it was in for bedroom circuits it was just a matter of time it was required in 90% of the locations. Could not blame manufacturers - single pole breakers went from $15 to $50.....that is good business
 
410001661 said:
Could not blame manufacturers - single pole breakers went from $15 to $50.....that is good business
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While I haven't personally had an AFCI fail, I would be shocked if they lasted as long as dumb breakers. So more money up front and some recurring revenue.
 
I find they trip too frequently. Power bars, led lights and programmable switches seem to play havoc with them.

I had them in my garage, no more. Heavy brushed industrial motors, welders and my millwakee charger/radio tripped them all the time.
 
We had an electrician in the house for a fairly complicated project , logistically ridiculous ceiling fan , in chatting he said the proliferation of Chinese LED light fixtures and econo dimmers have become a serious revenue source for his service work . The Amazon lighting and Home Depot fixturing is mostly awful and the three pack of dimmers for eight bucks is just a fire hazard regardless of who’s “ cert sticker “ is on it


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crankcall said:
We had an electrician in the house for a fairly complicated project , logistically ridiculous ceiling fan , in chatting he said the proliferation of Chinese LED light fixtures and econo dimmers have become a serious revenue source for his service work . The Amazon lighting and Home Depot fixturing is mostly awful and the three pack of dimmers for eight bucks is just a fire hazard regardless of who’s “ cert sticker “ is on it


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That’s my experience too. I don’t think safety is the main issue, it’s electrical noise. A lot of this stuff is electrically noisy and that doesn’t play nice with AFCI, sometimes with each other.

I recall a member here had noise issues with leds and dimmers a while back.
 
We had a RockFish Bluetooth speaker setup , installed USB outlet in the same room , USB Mini transformer created so much noise the RockFish would not function. My first experience with that sort of stuff , I understand it’s pretty common.


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