Hierarchy of racing talent | GTAMotorcycle.com

Hierarchy of racing talent

bigpoppa

Well-known member
Everyone knows the best basketball players in the world are american, and the best hockey players are canadian, everyone else is further down the ladder, heck the chinese basketball league would lose to the bench players on most NBA teams

How does this work for motorcycle racing? I Imagine the American racers are better than canadian ones, and the europeans are even better than the americans?

And every now and then one of the americans gets really good and you have the exceptions like Kenny roberts or Nicky hayden?
 

boyoboy

Well-known member
How does this work for motorcycle racing? I Imagine the American racers are better than canadian ones, and the europeans are even better than the americans?

And every now and then one of the americans gets really good and you have the exceptions like Kenny roberts or Nicky hayden?
[/QUOTE]

yup. or ben spies...
 

bitzz

Well-known member
Canada has traditionally punched above her weight class in motorsports.
DuHamels (and there's a BUNCH of em), Crevier, Szokes, Mike Duff, Picotte, Trev Deely, Malcolm Smith
Don Biederman and Bob slack in short track stocks
Villeneuve in Cart and F1
Ray Barton, many time NHRA Super Stock champ
Not bad for country covered in snow half the year.
 

Jayv

Well-known member
Site Supporter
Canada has traditionally punched above her weight class in motorsports.
DuHamels (and there's a BUNCH of em), Crevier, Szokes, Mike Duff, Picotte, Trev Deely, Malcolm Smith
Don Biederman and Bob slack in short track stocks
Villeneuve in Cart and F1
Ray Barton, many time NHRA Super Stock champ
Not bad for country covered in snow half the year.
Some bad luck for Mccormick when he was overseas, he could have done very well. Same for Greg Moore, lots of talent but taking from us too early.
 

lucky2

Well-known member
Site Supporter
Canada has traditionally punched above her weight class in motorsports.
DuHamels (and there's a BUNCH of em), Crevier, Szokes, Mike Duff, Picotte, Trev Deely, Malcolm Smith
Don Biederman and Bob slack in short track stocks
Villeneuve in Cart and F1
Ray Barton, many time NHRA Super Stock champ
Not bad for country covered in snow half the year.

don't forget JR Hanley on short track,

Iv'e known Trevor from back when he was a young kid running go-karts
 

Mad Mike

Well-known member
Kenny Reidmann comes to mind. Doesn’t race often, but when he does he’s usually in the podium.
 

boyoboy

Well-known member
Canada has traditionally punched above her weight class in motorsports.
DuHamels (and there's a BUNCH of em), Crevier, Szokes, Mike Duff, Picotte, Trev Deely, Malcolm Smith
Don Biederman and Bob slack in short track stocks
Villeneuve in Cart and F1
Ray Barton, many time NHRA Super Stock champ
Not bad for country covered in snow half the year.
malcolm smith is a cdn? cool, I always thought he was a USA citizen for some reason.

As for Mike Duff, he was not only a great GP racer, but a great writer for cycle canada magazine. I can remember way back when he wrote memoirs of his gp racing exploits in europe. Whenever I got a new cycle canada magazine his articles always got first readings. Later I had the opportunity to briefly meet him at shanny, where he was now a she, michelle duff.

remarkable canadians.
 

bitzz

Well-known member
don't forget JR Hanley on short track,

Iv'e known Trevor from back when he was a young kid running go-karts
Sorry, I meant Jr when I mentioned Slack. Slack build some cool cars, but in JR's league.
NO ONE builds a short track car like Jr Hanley. Lots of, no, MOST of the big name NASCAR guys ran JR's short track cars... with Hoosier tires with Goodyear painted on the sidewall...but I digress.....
If you want to win short track you need a Jr Hanley car

A buddy of mine, Bob Perkins, built the motor for the Biederman car that's in the Motorsports hall of Fame. (For those that don't know Don Biederman was Canada's answer to Smokey Yunick. Motor builderEXTRAORDINAIRE ) We trailered it down to Hotrod Scotts to get an exhaust installed.
After ya gets a new exhaust ya gotta run the thing to test it out... at redline... RIGHT?
Somewhere there's pictures of Perkie doing SMOKIN' donuts in Biederman's car, on Kipling out in front of Scott's, with a couple of Toronto cops blocking traffic for him.
These are the Good ol' days we old guys speak of.

MS was born in BC, the gulf islands I think, moved to Cali as a lad.
 

lucky2

Well-known member
Site Supporter
Sorry, I meant Jr when I mentioned Slack. Slack build some cool cars, but in JR's league.
NO ONE builds a short track car like Jr Hanley. Lots of, no, MOST of the big name NASCAR guys ran JR's short track cars... with Hoosier tires with Goodyear painted on the sidewall...but I digress.....
If you want to win short track you need a Jr Hanley car

A buddy of mine, Bob Perkins, built the motor for the Biederman car that's in the Motorsports hall of Fame. (For those that don't know Don Biederman was Canada's answer to Smokey Yunick. Motor builderEXTRAORDINAIRE ) We trailered it down to Hotrod Scotts to get an exhaust installed.
After ya gets a new exhaust ya gotta run the thing to test it out... at redline... RIGHT?
Somewhere there's pictures of Perkie doing SMOKIN' donuts in Biederman's car, on Kipling out in front of Scott's, with a couple of Toronto cops blocking traffic for him.
These are the Good ol' days we old guys speak of.

MS was born in BC, the gulf islands I think, moved to Cali as a lad.

for those that don't know JR was from nova scotia. Don AND JR had some kinda friction on and off track. JR son Jeff is still building cars.

i remember cayuga when it was standing room only, been to many a stock car races
 

Brian P

Well-known member
Moderator
Site Supporter
Everyone knows the best basketball players in the world are american, and the best hockey players are canadian, everyone else is further down the ladder, heck the chinese basketball league would lose to the bench players on most NBA teams

How does this work for motorcycle racing? I Imagine the American racers are better than canadian ones, and the europeans are even better than the americans?

And every now and then one of the americans gets really good and you have the exceptions like Kenny roberts or Nicky hayden?
4 factors have to come together: Talent, upbringing, money, and luck.

Recommended reading: "Dream. Believe. Achieve" by Jonathan Rea. You can see how those factors all came together in one person. Watch out for his kids Jake and Tyler (currently 6 and 4 years old).

Europe and Asia, and in particular Spain, Italy, and to some extent Ireland (because of road races such as the Northwest 200, and the Isle of Man a short ferry ride away), have a major advantage because of a more motorcycle-oriented culture. MotoGP races are on mainstream TV in Italy, and it seems that practically everyone rides. They may not be riding on any particular day (lots of cars and trucks on the road) but they probably have a scooter at home for running around town. So, kids get exposed to it. That's not the case for most kids in North America. The lucky ones (like Nicky Hayden, and Jordan Szoke) have a father who was involved in motorcycles as they grew up. Most don't. I certainly didn't.

The top level riders almost invariably start riding when they are 3 years old. Then the techniques for operating a motorcycle get built into their minds. It becomes intuiitive for them.

It's more nuanced than just "motorcycle racing". You will note that a good many MotoGP riders are Spanish or Italian. That's because the feeder series CEV operates in mainland Europe and is mostly based on previous-years Moto2 and Moto3 bikes - the feeder classes for MotoGP. You will note that a good many WorldSBK riders are from the British Isles. That's because there is a pretty good chance that they came up through BSB (British Superbike) which is a well established series.

Australia punches above its weight ... not sure why. Granted, you can ride there all year. Canada is at a disadvantage because of our climate - and because the general public doesn't care about motorsports.

I remember sitting in the stands at Shannonville next to Bob Szoke (who raced motorcycles way back - that's how Jordan got started so young). Teenager Jordan at the time was riding the wheels off one of several Honda CBX250s that were put together for racing back then. Bob turned to me and said "Don't tell Jordan this, but he's a lot faster than I ever was!"
 

justride

Well-known member
Watched a motoamerica video where there were two groups. the superbike and the stock superbike racing at the same time. So many bikes on the track at one time.
 

Trials

Well-known member
Wojo rides amazing.
Jake Stapleton rides amazing.
Jordan rides amazing.
Sean Bird rides amazing.
Paul Yvan is one of the best experts to learn from.
Amy is the nicest to look at.
 

crankcall

Well-known member
Site Supporter
Canada has problems getting sponsorship with the volumes of money to get to the next level. Europe has enough interest to generate the bags of money to get there.
It was once a case of having talent, a lot of racers worked regular monday to saturday jobs and raced weekends, saturday afternoon and sunday. Now its a full time job to be a top level racer.
And building a bike from parts bins, then winning a national title which happened in the 50's may never happen again. Money, bags of it, and factory support, then more money.
 

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