What's a good first car?

You can get something used but, then you have to anticipate the occasional downtime for something. And knowing a decent place to get repairs.

I've been shopping and in the market looking for used in the 3 year old and under price point. That puts you in a position of partial to no warranty and any financing terms are typically shorter or more expensive depending on the term.

I've actually been looking at Kia.

Ok, not me but the wife.

But, beyond journalist impressions and consumer reviews, I never really looked at them.

They have come a long way with improvement of their fit and finish. Backed with decent warranty and appear to be just as reliable as other manufacturers. If not, a little better.

I prefer to support the local economy by looking at civics or corolla but, the lady wants a hatch back and something with a higher seating position like her Matrix.

Not suggesting you have the same needs.

Just saying it's worth a look to see if they have any product offerings that meets yours needs within you budget.

They are on my radar so, maybe they could be too?




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Matt Rain said:

Heard the same from several sources. Wouldn't know, I just rent the things.

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The 1st gen Mazda 3 2003-2009 had the rust issue. The previous gen (smiley face ones) and current 3rd gen do not have that problem from what I understand

RockThis52 said:

I agree with this. Any particular reason why you think so? I feel I can get more bang for my buck. Plus not trying to spend more than about 300 a month which I think would be hard to find (unless it's a micra or mirage) and on lease (which obviously won't work as I'll exceed the km allowance).

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The majority of losses occur within the first few years of ownership. However there are currently some other forces at work pumping up used car values these days. For certain models at least, the most obvious is the fact that the dollar is weak compared to the US currency so exporting to the us is a thing.

Some other points; check insurance rates. I payed a substantial amount more for my accord than my Equinox. It was a coupe so maybe that was the reason. Always good to check before you buy.

The used market allows you to get much more for your money. However not having cash or access to a low interest bank loans sometimes equalizes out the savings.

I have managed to typical own my cars to the 13 year old mark without much issue. So when buying used I look for nice off lease cars and stay away from rentals or fleet vehicles. The odd private deal is good but carries a bit more risk.


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+1.

klr_guy said:

You're still in school, haven't started working yet and you're looking to blow 20k on a car?

Take the $5k you have as a deposit, and find something to buy outright. Contact Mina on this site - he's a stand-up guy and has connections in the used car game.

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Mazda 3's are fun to drive. However, Mazda 3's are only designed to last 120K. After that, everything falls apart surprisingly quickly. It would take too much space below to list all of the items that have broken requiring replacement. Compare that to my Subaru wrx that I sold at 200K which required nothing more than oil and brake pads. Same driving conditions for both cars.

You're cheapest option is to get a custom seat for the Honda Civic, but that's not what you really want is it? I understand, I was your age once and wanted my own car. Something that I bought, not something that was given to me. For me it was an 11 year old Toyota Supra, but gas and insurance were a lot cheaper then. If it were me at your age, I'd be looking at a used Scion FRS.

Good luck with your decision!

I have to agree with those that recommended the Mazda 3. They are far better built that Plant W made it seem. I am factoring in your yearly mileage at an anticipated 30K km + so most likely 40K km per year. Mazda offers a 5 year unlimited mileage warranty that would work for you nicely as you will be out of warranty at 2 - 2.5 years.

Since you are driving such a distance consider the 2008-2012 Subaru Imprezza hatchback or the newer one for better gas mileage.
A good used 2008-2012 models you can get for $9-$12k. You will be driving worry free for a while and you can always make it a dedicated winter car later in life and buy yourself something more sporty when you are making more money.

Just go drive one, really drive one, stomp on the brakes, steer hard.
There are some nice ones with leather and sunroof our there too.
The base model is a solid car.
You will be super happy in bad weather. You put snow wheels on these cars and they are like tanks.

They are solid cars with no issues (not the turbo).
AWD is awesome, the seats are very comfy.
It takes 30 minutes to swap out the stock stereo and install a nicer modern unit.
Youtube video. I did it for a friend. Just buy the proper harness and it's simple plug and play.
Bought deck and harness from Crutchfield Canada.

Whatever car you buy, make sure you get it properly inspected BEFORE you buy it and then go to Krown, spend $100 and rustproof it.
Since you can do basic work, change ALL the fluids, plugs, wires, filters.

The Imprezza insurance was lower than a smaller car with less power. It was lower by $400. There is the price difference for gas savings.
My friend ask how can the car that costs more and has more power be cheaper. Insurance said because they crash well and less injuries.

put some nice summer wheels on the Imprezza with a tint and you have a decent fun to drive car. Those cars corner really good and the brakes are impressive how it pulls the car down, prevents nose dive.
Good luck.

I know absolutely nothing about your personal situation, but I'm going to throw out a suggestion anyways. Have you considered moving closer to work in lieu of a car? That commute is likely going to suck three hours out of your day sitting in traffic, that would be on a good day.

If you are set on commuting and buying a car. Buy an econobox that's 3-4 years old with 40-60k km on it for about $10k. It has already depreciated 40-50% of it's initial value and will still be reliable and relatively new. You're going to be putting on approximately 40000km/year, a brand new car will depreciate at an astronomical rate with that mileage. You're much better off letting someone else take the initial hit.

Also don't worry too much about the fuel economy. The cost difference at $1/litre for 40k km between a car that does 7l/100km and 10l/100km is $1200/year.

regder said:

I know absolutely nothing about your personal situation, but I'm going to throw out a suggestion anyways. Have you considered moving closer to work in lieu of a car? That commute is likely going to suck three hours out of your day sitting in traffic, that would be on a good day.

If you are set on commuting and buying a car. Buy an econobox that's 3-4 years old with 40-60k km on it for about $10k. It has already depreciated 40-50% of it's initial value and will still be reliable and relatively new. You're going to be putting on approximately 40000km/year, a brand new car will depreciate at an astronomical rate with that mileage. You're much better off letting someone else take the initial hit.

Also don't worry too much about the fuel economy. The cost difference at $1/litre for 40k km between a car that does 7l/100km and 10l/100km is $1200/year.

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I was with your logic until the last line. $1200 a year difference equals 4 car payments ($300 per month) or likely half his insurance rate.
If you were comparing a small car with a nicer midsize and the price difference in gas was a few hundred then I can understand the comfort trade off.

regder said:

I know absolutely nothing about your personal situation, but I'm going to throw out a suggestion anyways. Have you considered moving closer to work in lieu of a car? That commute is likely going to suck three hours out of your day sitting in traffic, that would be on a good day.

If you are set on commuting and buying a car. Buy an econobox that's 3-4 years old with 40-60k km on it for about $10k. It has already depreciated 40-50% of it's initial value and will still be reliable and relatively new. You're going to be putting on approximately 40000km/year, a brand new car will depreciate at an astronomical rate with that mileage. You're much better off letting someone else take the initial hit.

Also don't worry too much about the fuel economy. The cost difference at $1/litre for 40k km between a car that does 7l/100km and 10l/100km is $1200/year.

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I have considered it, however it didn't work for 2 reasons.

1) I'm not quite ready to leave home yet.

2) The housing market is on fire right now, what I'd pay for a condo in that area plus maintenance fees will be far more expensive than gas + car + insurance. Not to mention I'd still need a car. And I'd probably let go of my bike (which I don't want to do) in lieu of all the bike thefts that occur in a condo in Toronto.

-D- said:

I was with your logic until the last line. $1200 a year difference equals 4 car payments ($300 per month) or likely half his insurance rate.
If you were comparing a small car with a nicer midsize and the price difference in gas was a few hundred then I can understand the comfort trade off.

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Agreed, the $1200 could be in my pocket. Unless I'm making 100k+ I can understand the logic. But I'd rather save it for a house or something lol

-D- said:

Since you are driving such a distance consider the 2008-2012 Subaru Imprezza hatchback or the newer one for better gas mileage.
A good used 2008-2012 models you can get for $9-$12k. You will be driving worry free for a while and you can always make it a dedicated winter car later in life and buy yourself something more sporty when you are making more money.

Just go drive one, really drive one, stomp on the brakes, steer hard.
There are some nice ones with leather and sunroof our there too.
The base model is a solid car.
You will be super happy in bad weather. You put snow wheels on these cars and they are like tanks.

They are solid cars with no issues (not the turbo).
AWD is awesome, the seats are very comfy.
It takes 30 minutes to swap out the stock stereo and install a nicer modern unit.
Youtube video. I did it for a friend. Just buy the proper harness and it's simple plug and play.
Bought deck and harness from Crutchfield Canada.

Whatever car you buy, make sure you get it properly inspected BEFORE you buy it and then go to Krown, spend $100 and rustproof it.
Since you can do basic work, change ALL the fluids, plugs, wires, filters.

The Imprezza insurance was lower than a smaller car with less power. It was lower by $400. There is the price difference for gas savings.
My friend ask how can the car that costs more and has more power be cheaper. Insurance said because they crash well and less injuries.

put some nice summer wheels on the Imprezza with a tint and you have a decent fun to drive car. Those cars corner really good and the brakes are impressive how it pulls the car down, prevents nose dive.
Good luck.

Click to expand...

Will look into the subbys, my neighbour down the street has I think 2 or 3 of them so he's clearly an enthusiast, I'll ask him about it. Thanks for the suggestion

JZ67 said:

I have to agree with those that recommended the Mazda 3. They are far better built that Plant W made it seem. I am factoring in your yearly mileage at an anticipated 30K km + so most likely 40K km per year. Mazda offers a 5 year unlimited mileage warranty that would work for you nicely as you will be out of warranty at 2 - 2.5 years.

Click to expand...

They are also fun to drive. That warranty seems attractive, reminds me of Mitsubishi's 10 year power train warrant not sure if it's unlimited mileage though.

On a side note, how on earth do I multi quote on Tapatalk

RockThis52 said:

2) The housing market is on fire right now, what I'd pay for a condo in that area plus maintenance fees will be far more expensive than gas + car + insurance.

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$20k car, condo. Nothing but the best eh ?

How about a ~$7-9K used car, and a basement apartment ? :\

mstram said:

$20k car, condo. Nothing but the best eh ?

How about a ~$7-9K used car, and a basement apartment ? :\

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I like to live lavish. Anyone know the best boat I can buy?

In all seriousness though, a quick kijiji search found some bachelor basement apartments for around 700 a month. I'd need a ttc metro pass though so extra 140 and I still think I'd need a car. My family is in Milton. The only thing I'd save on is gas imo because I'll be paying more for insurance.

mmmnaked said:

^ for about 3 months, until it disappears into rust

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They supposedly "fixed" the rust issue after 2013.

<3 my Impreza tho. On the newer model with CVT, I get about 500kms (9-10l/100km) on a tank commuting into/out of the city, while on a country-side road trip, just about 800kms on the tank (at 6.4l/100kms). A beast in winter as well....

In terms of insurance, I'm 24 and pay ~$330/mo (with a previous at-fault claim on record).

Part of the reason I got it was because I knew I'd have a long commute (time-wise) and wanted something I'd be comfortable driving in winter without issues. The other reason was because I needed a car for work.

RockThis52 said:

I like to live lavish. Anyone know the best boat I can buy?

In all seriousness though, a quick kijiji search found some bachelor basement apartments for around 700 a month. I'd need a ttc metro pass though so extra 140 and I still think I'd need a car. My family is in Milton. The only thing I'd save on is gas imo because I'll be paying more for insurance.

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After you commute 2-3 hrs per day for a few months, you'll see the value of your 'time'.

nfq said:

After you commute 2-3 hrs per day for a few months, you'll see the value of your 'time'.

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I don't disagree with you in the slightest, however, I have become accustomed to it as I have always lived in the west end (west Mississauga and now milton) and have been commuting to downtown Toronto for the past 4 years.

The logic behind owning my place makes perfect sense, but I'm not ready to make the move yet. Plus work is flexible in that I can come in at 10 and leave at 7 if I'd like, saving me about an hours worth of the commute.

1. Buy used. At 40,000 km per year, let someone else take the initial depreciation hit. After 3 or 4 years of this, the car's value will be approaching nothing one way or the other, so it's better to start off with a smaller number.

2. And the problem with the invariable Honda/Toyota suggestions is that people want crazy prices for them as used cars. So what you really want, is something that is a decent, but underappreciated, used car.

3. The differences in reliability nowadays between brands isn't nearly what it used to be. Honda/Toyota aren't all they are cracked up to be (they started cheapening them about 10 or 15 years ago) but GM, Ford, Chrysler aren't the horror shows that people make them out to be.

4. Many of the smallest cars nowadays have standard or available equipment that was only in luxury cars a few years ago and not even dreamed of a few years before that.

If you think the seats in a Civic are uncomfortable then you have a fussy back, and only you can make the assessment of whether seats in any particular car are comfortable or not. Neither I nor anyone else can help with this.

I've had quite a few compact/subcompacts as rental cars, and for ME ...

Nissans are on the "do not rent" list. All of them. They have forgotten how to calibrate power steering assistance. They all have CVT transmissions, and I don't like them.

Hyundais are "meh". The Sonata is a decent car. The smaller models are take-it-or-leave-it. Hyundai has not figured out suspension and steering yet. Kia = Hyundai underneath the skin.

Corollas are good but forgettable except for that big gaping maw of a grille. My rental had the old school 4 speed automatic (Really, Toyota? In this day and age?) The new one is a lot better looking but still 4 speed automatic in the base trim. The other choice is CVT ... yuck. I despise Toyota's trademark pinkie-finger-light numb, overassisted power steering but the Prius (now-previous model) is far worse for this than the Corolla is. The new Prius is supposed to have much better suspension and steering. They may have fixed the chassis, but they broke the styling. Yuuuuuck.

I drove VWs for years. I recently had a current-generation Beetle as a rental. Meh. They've lost something. The Beetle feels big and doesn't feel nimble. I have good memories of my Mk5 VW Jetta, which is mechanically the same underneath, but for some reason the Beetle just didn't do anything for me. Decent car - yes. Would I rent one again - sure. Would I buy one - no.

The Chrysler 200 had two generations. The first one was a re-branded Chrysler Sebring. That is another "do not rent". The new one is a decent car - although I still wouldn't buy one, because I can't see out of it. The windows are narrow gun-slits, and the corners of the car are distant and invisible from the driver's seat.

The Chevy Cruze is a decent car. So is the Sonic. So, believe it or not, is the Spark ... CVT transmission and all. (It has one of the better ones)

Favorite rental cars ... #1, Ford Focus. #2, Ford Fiesta. If at all possible, opt for manual transmission if you can find one. Good suspension and decent steering, quiet, comfortable (for me). The Fiesta is a fuel sipper. The Focus doesn't get exceptional mileage.

I haven't encountered a recent Mazda in the rental fleet. Honda doesn't do fleet sales. Haven't rented a Subaru but a friend of mine had a 2012-ish Impreza and the problem there was that it offered neither power nor gas mileage. (The all wheel drive system adds weight and drag, and if you don't need it ...) He sold that and went back to an older-model VW Jetta which he likes a lot more.

Generally it's all become the the same global parts suppliers underneath.

My 04 grand prix has been excellent. Only a throttle body sensor and a preventative maintenance wheel bearing in 12 years isn't bad.

The 2010 mazda 3 (first gen of the smiley face car) we bought in 2010 is an absolute piece of garbage. 150k and its ready to be thrown out. Good on gas, reasonably fun to drive, but mechanically and electrically it has been poor.