M1 Insurnace?

So I did the retest at centennial, everything went pretty smooth, but i failed the test anyway (on the very last exercise)

I spend the whole week leading up to it essentially practicing on a towel so i would have perfect gear shifting(and it paid off) my shifting(up or down) were butter smooth, and quick

I corrected my riding during practice time(turning my head to where i want to go) and the bike essentially went where i wanted it to go everytime


Last time i was too slow on the very first curve and i went over the line so i failed the test, this time:


My speed was perfect, i didnt lose a single point for slow speed(technically speaking) I lost 5 points on the return portion of the first curve which ends in the box....I was making phenomenal time, however they never clarified it wasnt enough to touch the box at the end, but you actually had to be IN the box, so i stopped at the line, my buddy tells me to get in the box, which i did, but i lost some time and got 5 points because i thought i was done the curve, but they didnt stop timing till i actually got the front wheel inside the whole box as opposed to just touching it...5 points no biggie


I continued the rest of the test, everything went pretty smooth that(again made good speed, stayed in lines etc etc), i didnt get any more points...till the very end of the test where you have to swerve depending on which arm they lazily decide to bring up at the last second, i dont know if i was anticipating or not, but out of the 5 cones they have placed I knocked over the one at the very far end as i swerved past and they failed me


This would be no biggie, I almost got through the entire test with flying colours, but they dont let you take another re test....so essentially they want me to retake the whole course again (lol) and pay $500 again and risk getting failed again for some minor technicality (or i could make the down payment on a bike lol)

FYI one the instructors who was closer to me saw that i actually did touch the box, but the chick grading me was 100ft away judging weather or not i touched the box or not, i mentioned this to the head honcho and he insisted 'its the grading instructor' who's opinion matters even though the other one was right next to me and saw what happened more clearly

So essentially at this point I have a few choices

1)I can pay another 500$ and risk getting failed because x ,y ,z lol(not gonna happen)
2)I can put downpayment on a bike i want with an M1, practice on it and take the MTO test, which i hear is a joke compared to the MSF course(probably R3 or Ninja 300)
3)I can rent a bike, practice on it, and take the MTO test (The head dude at the College said there are people online who might be able to let me rent a bike specifically for the MTO test)

I found some people on craigslist/kijiji who can let me take the MTO test on a bike they can let me rent

I even found some 'instructors' who will provide coaching/practice on their bike with a radio setup etc etc who 'guarantee' a pass on the MTO test(considering its a piece of cake compared to the MSF course)

I'm leaning to option 2, although option 3 i can also do, but option 1 is out of the question
Im guessing the original quotes i got for insurance from aviva wont apply for M1, so ill have to get some new quotes atleast till i get the M2 and then i can go with aviva, and as far as i know, only TD primmum and Jevco insure M1 riders, can anyone else think of someone else?

This route seems to make sense, since thats why MTO requires a 60 day wait period anyway, practice with an M1, then get your M2

So first off, good on you for improving and taking note of what you did wrong. Imo, I would not retake the course. I feel that money would be better spent on the m2x course (eventually), or an intermediate or advanced rider training course later. I would now try the MTO with one of your 2 options. Or option #3, find a bike that's about $1g & buy it outright.

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I recommend option 1 or the instructor who can provide extra coaching for extra money if possible. That way you are safer...worse thing to get in trouble on the road with a bike yourself with M1.

samurai said:

I recommend option 1 or the instructor who can provide extra coaching for extra money if possible. That way you are safer...worse thing to get in trouble on the road with a bike yourself with M1.

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I'm still arguing against redoing the course, based on the info provided. At this point, if op gets a bike s/he can practice all the moves in a parking lot.
The extra coaching is a good option too, though. Was going to go back and edit my post to reflect this view.

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I'm not 100% sure, but I would imagine if you don't pass the test at the course, you don't get to say you've done a safety course when the insurance people ask you

Also your insurance is just going to be straight outrageous (wouldn't bat an eye if it was north of 4 grand) so be prepared

samurai said:

I recommend option 1 or the instructor who can provide extra coaching for extra money if possible. That way you are safer...worse thing to get in trouble on the road with a bike yourself with M1.

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Only if you pay for it.

Sorry but not gonna shell out that much cash only to have them say "oh you went too slow on this one, you fail"

If they really cared about me, my life and my riding ability, they would let me take the retest again next week(its only 50$), instead they WILL NOT let me do that and insist on me taking the entire course again, paying 500$
its just a cash grab at this point

The entire purpose of the 60 day wait for the M2 is PRECISELY so that rider gets M1, rider gets bike and 60 days to practice and hone their skill, rider comes into MTO and does their test, rider gets M2!


I made SIGNIFICANT progress and almost passed the test(I was on the last part of the test when they failed me)


I saw riders who weren't half as good as me pass and get their M2 (guys who cant make a simple turn without fumbling, or touching their feet on the ground, knocking the cones over at low speed)

It boils down to luck imo

I'll get a bike of my own and practice and take the MTO test, OR get an instructor who will teach/prepare me for the MTO test, OR just get a rented bike, practice on that and take the MTO.

but im not gonna spend 500$ for essentially basic riding skills that i posses and drills that i have already seen(Emergency braking, swerving, Turning your head where you want to go, Feathering clutch, changing gears, applying breaks instead of downshifting so people know your breaking etc etc etc) I can do all that with tennis balls/cones and a bike of my own.

tricky said:

I'm not 100% sure, but I would imagine if you don't pass the test at the course, you don't get to say you've done a safety course when the insurance people ask you

Also your insurance is just going to be straight outrageous (wouldn't bat an eye if it was north of 4 grand) so be prepared

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I have it on good authority that the 'safety course' at most would give you a 10% discount, I'll call Td Primmum and jevco see what they quote(as far as i know they are the ONLY people who insure M1 riders)

Oh and i called andy singh when i was initially looking for quotes, for M2 and safety course and for someone over 25, he was giving me 4k quotes, so....

The best quotes with M2 i got were with paul south, who cut what everyone was offering in half essentially.



On a side note:

LOL so many people were dropping their bikes left and right, and they didnt even teach us one of the most essential skills....how to pick your bike up after you drop it...one of the MOST common things a beginner does and they didnt even think to include it...

You failed twice, maybe look inwards instead of blaming the whole thing on the course. and 10% of 4000 is a lot, and would almost pay for the course again

tricky said:

You failed twice, maybe look inwards instead of blaming the whole thing on the course. and 10% of 4000 is a lot, and would almost pay for the course again

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Please point out where i blamed the whole thing on the course?


I'd be HAPPY to take the Re test again and pass it(but they dont want me to take the retest, they'd rather just do the cash grab)

Given those options, I would go with rent a bike, practice and take the MTO test. This way you can buy a bike and get insurance as an M2. Getting insurance as an M1 is a pain, even the brokers that will insure an M1 usually won't do so without proof of a safety course booked.

If the bike rental is really pricey, maybe look at buying a cheapo bike outright like Joe suggested. I know you want a new bike, but this would just be a practice bike to turn around after getting the M2.

supernova12034 said:

Please point out where i blamed the whole thing on the course?


I'd be HAPPY to take the Re test again and pass it(but they dont want me to take the retest, they'd rather just do the cash grab)

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It's not a cash grab, you had a second chance, now they have to question how well you absorbed their lessons.

I've taken that course three separate times over the years, and the instructions about stopping with the contact patch in the box were always quite clear, along with any missteps that constituted an instant fail.

O.k. If you say that you didn't know about stopping in the box, you could ask if there is a provision in the testing regulations, for a redo of an element if the person doesn't understand the instructions.

You failed twice on an extremely simple and easy course, simple as that. I don't know how you react under "pressure" but after reading both threads its seems like you waaaay overthink basic instruction, like the stopping in the box scenario. Why do you think they put a box there and not a line? Did you not see any one else stop in the box? These scenarios are demo'd and clear instructions are given before you do them. You cant pass the safety course what makes you think you will pass the MTO one with flying colours? I would get an instructor for some 1 on 1, and I'm not trying to be mean just trying to look at the reality

smc said:

Given those options, I would go with rent a bike, practice and take the MTO test. This way you can buy a bike and get insurance as an M2. Getting insurance as an M1 is a pain, even the brokers that will insure an M1 usually won't do so without proof of a safety course booked.

If the bike rental is really pricey, maybe look at buying a cheapo bike outright like Joe suggested. I know you want a new bike, but this would just be a practice bike to turn around after getting the M2.

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that is the plan

I think they are suggesting you do the course again because they don't feel you have made the proper progress the first time. This is the kind of test you want to pass with flying colours because it's the easiest part of riding.

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Benny! said:

I think they are suggesting you do the course again because they don't feel you have made the proper progress the first time. This is the kind of test you want to pass with flying colours because it's the easiest part of riding.

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Ofcourse, unfortunately id rather drop the 500 on the downpayment or something, iv seen the course, and what they teach and its easy to find an empty parking lot and use tennis balls to practice


And id be willing to bet 100 cash that these guys^ would fail if they did it right now. (just because you have been riding for a season doesnt mean you can adequately perform slow speed maneuvers etc etc with success, while being judged on your riding, speed, positioning, foot placement etc)

I think only 1 person out of our entire class(of 30) passed it with flying colors, and he had previously ridden(back home in india)

most of the people barely passed with the skin of their teeth, id say 5 people dropped their bikes, 1 person got into an 'accident' and decided not to return (he rear ended someone)




Not saying what they taught me wasnt valuable, it definitely improved my riding, but if im gonna drop $500 again its gonna be on a bike and not on a parking lot cone maneuvers

@supernova12034 I'm a gambling man...I might take you up on that offer ?

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hahaha i wasnt talking about you, i was talking about the chumps who were being ******-y(if thats a word?) without offering any recourse

supernova12034 said:

hahaha i wasnt talking about you, i was talking about the chumps who were being ******-y(if thats a word?) without offering any recourse

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I know. I just like to bet! ?
Question though...what if you *hypothetically* fail the MTO test as well? Have you thought about what you might do then?

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Joe Bass said:

I know. I just like to bet! 
Question though...what if you *hypothetically* fail the MTO test as well? Have you thought about what you might do then?

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If hypothetically that were to happen

well atleast they let you take the test again and again(unlike centennial) My mom failed the G2 like 4 times before she finally got it(the G she got on her first attempt)

Plus i can always keep practicing with a bike of my own(yes i know insurance is gonna be high with M1)

I also found a guy that gives people 1-on -1 training/coaching with his own rental bikes(and radio set up etc) and essentially guarantees a pass or he pays for your test

I have heard from several people that the MTO test is supposed to be cake compared to the course

I found several guys that let you use their bikes for rent for practice as well as the test




I was right at the finish line when they failed me at the course, and honestly if they let me take another retest id pass it no problem, but they'd rather i stood there for another 2 days, 500$ lighter

supernova12034 said:

...
I think only 1 person out of our entire class(of 30) passed it with flying colors, and he had previously ridden(back home in india)
...

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The M1-M2 course is physically demanding, even in warm temperatures. I suspect that the cold temperature made it even harder on folks.

That being said, the test is the test and IMHO, it's a decent objective method of measuring the minimum rider skill acceptable to ride on the road.

Maybe you screwed yourself by trying this too early in the year? The advantage of the course is that they provide the bike. The disadvantage is that you have to pay.

One option not mentioned is an offroad course - you may be able to get some 'seat time', albeit also at a cost, but one option to cost out amongst your choices - www.smartadventures.ca