Connected Battery Backwards! YEAY! | GTAMotorcycle.com

Connected Battery Backwards! YEAY!

Bagman

Well-known member
Let's start the 2018 riding season with a spark!

Bike = 2011 Yamaha FZ8

Don't ask. Just not paying attention.... I connected the battery backward and blew the 50A main fuse. All other fuses are intact, so I'm guessing the main fuse did its job. Bought a new fuse to try again. Problem:

- kill switch in off position
- insert key
- turn to ON
- I hear a constantly electrical, relay type click-click-click noise coming from around front of bike/top of engine. Dash on, and guage sweeps
- switch kill-switch to ON, and now get fuel pump noise, and louder constant click from around area of relays by the battery
- if I try to start, it feels like a dead battery.. very laboured, tries to turn over and doesn't work... will get nothing from pressing the start button after 2-3 attemps.

I've tried 2 other batteries from other friend's bikes. All do the same thing. After having my batter on the Tender Junior I measure 12.5V across terminals. Do you think by some odd chance the battery is still toast?

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]What are symptoms of a fried starter relay? Would a friend starter relay cause the ticking noise even with kill-switch off, and not pressing start button?

[/FONT]Maybe a fried fuel pump relay?

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]I did have my ECU sent off to be flashed. Lord I hope I didn't fry the ECU. I doubt it, and I doubt the flash (done by reputable shop) was done incorrectly such that the bike won't start..

Lookin' for help. TY.
[/FONT]
 
12.5v is ok for a sitting battery, not perfect by somewhere around 80% however that's not a complete test -- you might want to take it to CTC to completely rule out a dead battery. If the headlight shines bright for 3 minutes, your batter is probably OK -- if it dulls out it make be done.

The main fuse should have caught the reverse polarity before anything else smoked. Do you have any items installed that take power before the main relay (power socket, rice lights, other accessories) these could be short and causing the problem, if so disconnect them and try again. If I recall correctly, that bike has 2 x 15A fuses in the solenoid, these may blow if polarity is reversed -- check them too.
 
Personally I would try a set of jumper cables and a known good battery, being very, very careful not to connect them incorrectly ;)
 
Personally I would try a set of jumper cables and a known good battery, being very, very careful not to connect them incorrectly ;)
He said he already tried 2 known good batteries with same results.
Unfortunately I have no idea other than fried relay or solenoid. Following for interest.

Sent from my SM-A500W using Tapatalk
 
Unfortunately, relays and solenoids don't "fry" as a result of and fuses don't "catch" a battery being connected backwards.

Fuses open due to excessive current flowing and this often happens through semiconductors (especially diodes) like those in, say, the regulator/rectifier. A 50A fuse can carry a lot more than 50A for a short period, easily enough for semiconductors to get hurt. Remember, fuses are there to protect against wiring harness fires, not to protect the itty bitty bits of electronics downstream of them.

If you had the main switch "off" when the mis-connect happened the only things exposed to the reverse polarity would have been the reg/rec and the instruments (which are protected by their own fuse.) If that fuse ("fuel injection system spare fuse") is intact you're probably okay on the cluster (you said the tach swept and the dash is "on").

My feeling is that the reg/rec got hurt.
 
Same thing happened to me like 8 years ago, it is a fuse, you need to remove all your fuses and check them all out not just the one you replaced, it isn't the battery.
 
if you have a multimeter, use it to test the fuses, use the continuity setting, and if the fuse is good you will get a beep/tone, this is easily done if they are blade type fuses, on top of each fuse you will see small metal bits, put a probe on each one and if it's good you will know.....

.
 
There's a 15A fuse (and a spare) on the starter relay itself - double check it.
 
lemme guess, battery is on it's side
when putting it back in, you stood it upright
which leaves the terminals backwards
common on late model Yamahas with sealed batteries

the ignition fuse usually blows as well as the main 50A
when you hook it up backwards, that'll give crank but no fire

you should be able to put a finger on the relays and feel which one is constantly clicking

so basically you put battery voltage through the ground circuit
the main 50A will blow, but take enough time to allow excess current to other devices
like the control side of relays that are designed for milliamps, not 50A
they are fused, but not on the negative side

go through all the fuses again with a meter, don't need to pull them out
can probe both sides from the exposed area of each terminal on top

if all are good, start looking at which relay is making the noise
 
If there is a relay fried, it generally doesn't repeatedly engage and disengage... but you never know. Once all the blown fuses are replaced you will need to check the function of each component individually, then I suspect you will find out the issue is the ECU. But do your due diligence and diagnose it correctly and you may get lucky replacing a few relays and diodes.. <breath held>

Edit: To correctly check a fuse you must remove it and isolate it so you don't erroneously measure the circuit and not the fuse, as intended. You can compare voltage across the fuses for a quick check, but if you want the OEM procedure, remove and check continuity.
 
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Battery taken to Burlington Cycle, along with the starter relay/solenoid. Both tested good. As for the battery it makes sense given two others caused the same issue. When the 50A fuse blew, the key was not in the ignition. I can't recall if the kill switch was on or off, but I don't think that matters if the key ain't in the ignition and turned to ON.

You guys speak of checking fuses like there is more to it than removing the fuse and physically looking at it. I have physically looked at every fuse I am aware of around where the battery is. That means the starter fuse, it's spare as well as the fuses + the spares in the mini fuse box. They are all intact - from what I can physically see. Do I still need to multimeter them to be certain?

When I am checking fuses with a multimeter, must the key be in ignition and set to ON? I ask, because then I get all the clicking and would rather not let it be like that for prolonged periods.
 
following the fuse check procedure from the post just above yours
member is a Yamaha tech, so I'm sure it's good advice

the fuse is out of the bike and meter in diode check or ohm mode
so it makes no difference if the key is on or off

it is possible, though unlikely, for a fuse to look okay
but be open-circuit

one other thing comes to mind: a loose ground wire
maybe sending batt voltage to ground
has caused a problem with ground connection

follow the negative cable from the battery and see where it is bolted to chassis
check if that bolt is loose, or maybe take it off and inspect
 
When you say "...try to start, it feels like a dead battery.. very laboured, tries to turn over and doesn't work... will get nothing from pressing the start button after 2-3 attemps..."; have you measured the voltage across the battery terminals when you press the starter button and the cranking is laboured and/or "nothing" happens?

Does the battery die if it's left connected to the bike?

You might try taking a fully charged battery, connecting it, measuring its terminal voltage when connected (and observing for sparks/arcing when the GND connection is made...) If you see arcing when you make that connection it's a sign something is drawing current; a little spark is normal; a big "pop" is a sign of a lot of current. If the battery terminal voltage drops steadily as you watch it you might try putting a hand on the reg/rec (on my 2011 Fazer the reg/rec is visible under the seat, above the rear tire; it's the finned object under there. Later bikes with ABS put the reg/rec down the right side of the engine...) to see if it's getting warm. If it is it's most likely got a bad diode. You can try unplugging it to see if the current draw normalizes.

You can try starting it without the reg/rec plugged in but only verify it'll crank normally and start. If it does, shut it off immediately and look into a replacement rectifier assembly.
 
Battery taken to Burlington Cycle, along with the starter relay/solenoid. Both tested good. As for the battery it makes sense given two others caused the same issue. When the 50A fuse blew, the key was not in the ignition. I can't recall if the kill switch was on or off, but I don't think that matters if the key ain't in the ignition and turned to ON.

You guys speak of checking fuses like there is more to it than removing the fuse and physically looking at it. I have physically looked at every fuse I am aware of around where the battery is. That means the starter fuse, it's spare as well as the fuses + the spares in the mini fuse box. They are all intact - from what I can physically see. Do I still need to multimeter them to be certain?

When I am checking fuses with a multimeter, must the key be in ignition and set to ON? I ask, because then I get all the clicking and would rather not let it be like that for prolonged periods.

Fuses are checked statically, out of the bike, but it doesn't sound like that is the problem you are chasing right now. Some of the information you gave in the first post has been interpreted a couple of different ways in this thread and I'm hoping you can clear it up...

1. Battery hooked up backwards and the main 50 A fuse blew before you turned the main ignition, correct? or did you turn the key on?

2. The "constant electrical click-click-click", does this continue forever? or just happen for 5 or so seconds and then stop? I ask because there are no relays (that I can remember off the top of my head) at the front of the bike. The only thing near the front that might make a clicking under normal circumstances is the ISC valve or one of the throttle servos.

3. Ideally, you would need to isolate the component that is cycling (making the clicking noises) so I can guide you how to test it. You should be able to physically feel it clicking. Just a description of location and number of wires will suffice, I happen to own a 2014 Fazer8 myself.

4. Check to make sure the "Fuel Injection" system fuse is not also blown.

5. And also the one labelled "Backup"... which is not a spare fuse, but rather supplies another circuit called "Backup"

6. If all those fuses are in good shape, unplug the Regulator Rectifier (under your seat, just in front of the battery mount location) while the key is on (with the clicking) and see if it stops.

7. Unplug the headlight relay (located under the rear seat with wires: Red, red/white, Brown/green and Grey). See if the clicking stops.

If all of the fuses are intact, and if you didn't key up with the battery hooked up backwards you may get lucky.
 
Battery taken to Burlington Cycle, along with the starter relay/solenoid. Both tested good. As for the battery it makes sense given two others caused the same issue. When the 50A fuse blew, the key was not in the ignition. I can't recall if the kill switch was on or off, but I don't think that matters if the key ain't in the ignition and turned to ON.

You guys speak of checking fuses like there is more to it than removing the fuse and physically looking at it. I have physically looked at every fuse I am aware of around where the battery is. That means the starter fuse, it's spare as well as the fuses + the spares in the mini fuse box. They are all intact - from what I can physically see. Do I still need to multimeter them to be certain?

When I am checking fuses with a multimeter, must the key be in ignition and set to ON? I ask, because then I get all the clicking and would rather not let it be like that for prolonged periods.

Yes to needing multi-meter, it will even show if you have a weak ground connection, you can't do that visually. Every electrical trouble-shooting job should begin with the electrical schematic, do you have one? Study it up and if you wire everything backwards what is the first weak link?
... for some reason I think you might want to test the ignition switch.
... also use your nose, fried electrical components often have a very distinct smell.
best luck with the repair.
 
LPakkala.

1. You are correct. I did not turn the key. I think the key was still inside the house.
2. The constant electrical tick-tick-tick continues forever. I am not aware of any relays there myself, and as best I can tell from where it's coming from a throttle servo or something fuel injector related or (what's ISV valve?) sounds about right for location wise. Maybe starter motor?
4. I now triple checked fuses and noticed one of the fuses on the starter relay was indeed kaput. Replaced both. Doesn't matter. Same problem persists
6. I unplugged regulator and put key ignition to "on." Same problem persists.

I'll have to try the headlight relay later. Kids/Life/Sleep.
 
Edit: To correctly check a fuse you must remove it and isolate it so you don't erroneously measure the circuit and not the fuse, as intended. You can compare voltage across the fuses for a quick check, but if you want the OEM procedure, remove and check continuity.

If you check the fuse with a multimeter using the continuity then the fuse does not need to be removed, if there is a break in the fuse you will get no tone from your meter..

And by doing it this way you don’t need to have the bike on, no battery, nothing, as you are just checking to see if the fuse has continuity.

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If you check the fuse with a multimeter using the continuity then the fuse does not need to be removed, if there is a break in the fuse you will get no tone from your meter..

And by doing it this way you don’t need to have the bike on, no battery, nothing, as you are just checking to see if the fuse has continuity.

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... Unless the circuit the fuse is protecting, provides a path... or the circuit is partially energized... or the slight pressure the meter uses activates a diode.. or maybe he could just test them the right way.
 
LPakkala.

1. You are correct. I did not turn the key. I think the key was still inside the house.
2. The constant electrical tick-tick-tick continues forever. I am not aware of any relays there myself, and as best I can tell from where it's coming from a throttle servo or something fuel injector related or (what's ISV valve?) sounds about right for location wise. Maybe starter motor?
4. I now triple checked fuses and noticed one of the fuses on the starter relay was indeed kaput. Replaced both. Doesn't matter. Same problem persists
6. I unplugged regulator and put key ignition to "on." Same problem persists.

I'll have to try the headlight relay later. Kids/Life/Sleep.

... none of that information sounds good. It is not the starter motor and you can skip the headlight relay. Try unplugging the "Relay Unit" (12-13 wires) which is located near the starter relay under the rear seat.

Your information has eliminated more than half of the electrical systems, based on which fuses blew.
 
... Unless the circuit the fuse is protecting, provides a path... or the circuit is partially energized... or the slight pressure the meter uses activates a diode.. or maybe he could just test them the right way.

it's a continuity test, if the fuse has a break it won't have continuity, and will not work, none of the above makes a difference.....as we are only testing the fuse, nothing else...

Hell don't even test them, go buy some new ones and replace each and everyone, at least you know then all are good, but do you really, you could end up with a dud even if they are new......

.

Anyways OP do as you see fit, it's only my opinion and the way I learned to test and troubleshoot.

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