Return of Ford Nation | Page 14 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Return of Ford Nation

Rob MacLennan said:
The PCs moved left under Brown. I've got a feeling there will be more than a few cases of whiplash under Ford, when they shift back.
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I'd say more centre than left for Brown, but where do you measure centre from? I dont' think that Ford will swing that far. Two of the other candidates were left of him, and he'll want to keep the party in contention, and his support alive. The long knives in the party, might be being sharpened yet again, and something will need to be done about that.
 
Things have swung far left when you have leftists provincially & federally
 
RockerGuy said:
Things have swung far left when you have leftists provincially & federally
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Are you suggesting that the current Federal and Provincial Liberal parties could be considered "Far Left"?
 
backmarkerducati said:
I am sure they look far left when someone is sitting on the far right...
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That was sort of where I was going with that. There is a pretty big gap between where they are and what could reasonably be considered "Far Left", just as Harper wasn't what would be considered "Far Right". I guess it's more fun to exaggerate and speak in extremes though; describing someone as "a bit left-ish" doesn't really carry the same punch.
 
Mr.K said:
Are you suggesting that the current Federal and Provincial Liberal parties could be considered "Far Left"?
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They are both Social Democrats, which is by definition far left. Liberals party ideology is not as hard and fast as other parties, they follow the leader and move fluidly between social liberal (Creitien, Martin) and social democratic (Trudeau(s), Wynne) agendas. Right now both are about as far left as they have ever been, both Trudeau and Wynne are Social Democrats, both have a penchant for advancing their own fundamental / activist agenda without a mandate, consensus, or public consultation.

Bob Rae, a stated social democrat, was not as far left as Wynne.
 
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Mad Mike said:
They are both Social Democrats, which is by definition far left. Liberals party ideology is not as hard and fast as other parties, they follow the leader and move fluidly between social liberal (Creitien, Martin) and social democratic (Trudeau(s), Wynne) agendas. Right now both are about as far left as they have ever been, both Trudeau and Wynne are Social Democrats, both have a penchant for advancing their own fundamental / activist agenda without a mandate, consensus, or public consultation.

Bob Rae, a stated social democrat, was not as far left as Wynne.
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That's...extremely inaccurate. Alternative facts, I guess.
 
Mr.K said:
That's...extremely inaccurate. Alternative facts, I guess.
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...and your argument consists of " "? Which seems more an opinion, than a fact. Opinions are like farts, everybody has at least one in them.
 
Mr.K said:
That's...extremely inaccurate. Alternative facts, I guess.
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Care to explain?

While you are it, please bless us with an explanation of the difference between opinion and fact.
 
Mr.K said:
That's...extremely inaccurate. Alternative facts, I guess.
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Here are some social democratic facts for you to dispute:
Fact: Wynne's sex ed curriculum: It peeved a lot of faith groups and has been sidestepped (dismissed and disregarded) by the Ontario Catholic school board. While the curriculum may be accurate and correct (I'm on record of being fine with the content), it oversteps social liberal boundaries in content, and the the way it was forced through. There was no mandate, no public consultation (the 4000 people in gov't approvals and from Wynn's special interest groups is not consultation), and it mysteriously lined up with Wynne's pre-premier Activist agenda. It's the way it was done that makes it a textbook example of how a social democrat achieves their agenda.


Fact: Trudeau mandate: In order to receive federal aid for summer jobs, each business must first sign an "attestation" saying they agree with the ruling government's (Liberal Party) views on abortion and gender identity. Canadians have charter rights that guarantee we can have and express different political beliefs than the government. Again, we have a social democratic process at work.
 
Mad Mike said:
Here are some social democratic facts for you to dispute:
Fact: Wynne's sex ed curriculum: It peeved a lot of faith groups and has been sidestepped (dismissed and disregarded) by the Ontario Catholic school board. While the curriculum may be accurate and correct (I'm on record of being fine with the content), it oversteps social liberal boundaries in content, and the the way it was forced through. There was no mandate, no public consultation (the 4000 people in gov't approvals and from Wynn's special interest groups is not consultation), and it mysteriously lined up with Wynne's pre-premier Activist agenda. It's the way it was done that makes it a textbook example of how a social democrat achieves their agenda.


Fact: Trudeau mandate: In order to receive federal aid for summer jobs, each business must first sign an "attestation" saying they agree with the ruling government's (Liberal Party) views on abortion and gender identity. Canadians have charter rights that guarantee we can have and express different political beliefs than the government. Again, we have a social democratic process at work.
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Oh, we're cranky about the sex-ed stuff again. Kids need to know about sex, gender, relationships, etc. and faith groups can suck it, frankly. This is being done for the public good, so that things like STIs, teenage pregnancy, and hate crimes can be reduced. Faith groups have no power to manage those things in all homes across the province. If individuals kids parents don't want to have their kids learn about whatever thing they're offended by, then they can be pulled out of school those days. Honestly, those kids are not the kids most at risk of not learning some of that information.

The summer job thing does not stop anyone from expressing their different political views, it just means they won't receive federal money for a tiny subset of those views. The greater audience doesn't enjoy seeing aborted fetus photos by the hospital, so I'm having a hard time feeling bad that they aren't getting additional money to create posters.
 
Baggsy said:
I'd say more centre than left for Brown, but where do you measure centre from? I dont' think that Ford will swing that far. Two of the other candidates were left of him, and he'll want to keep the party in contention, and his support alive. The long knives in the party, might be being sharpened yet again, and something will need to be done about that.
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Wynne says carbon tax. Brown agrees. Wynne say increase minimum wage. Brown agrees. Wynne promises subways for Toronto. Brown..... same.
 
Didn't a convicted pedophile made the sex ed curriculum?
I'm sure he was touching himself as he was writing it.
 
I think when the Liberal position themselves with more social policy than the NDP themselves, The PCs only have to avoid a blunder to take control.

The thing is, it’s still a huge possibility the PCs will blow their own chances.

Then again, folks sure seem to enjoy all the spending going on with the Liberals.

Makes you wonder how bad things have been the previous 3 or so years they need to spend so much to make things better???






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Mr.K said:
https://www.politicalcompass.org/canada2015

I guess when I see "Liberal" on the right side of the axis, I'm not inclined to describe it as "far left". Would you?
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"The website does not explain its scoring system.[SUP][6][/SUP] A number of writers, including Tom Utley and Brian Patrick Mitchell, have criticised its validity.[SUP][7][/SUP][SUP][8]
...
[/SUP][SUP]The politicalcompass.org website does not reveal the people behind it, beyond the fact that it seems to be based in the United Kingdom.[SUP][9][/SUP][SUP][10][/SUP] At the bottom of any page on the website, it is stated that the political compass's copyright belongs to an organisation named "Pace News Limited".[SUP][11][/SUP] Pace News Limited is a company registered in New Zealand whose Director is Wayne Brittenden. According to The New York Times, the site is the work of Wayne Brittenden, a political journalist.[SUP][2][/SUP] According to Tom Utley, writing in The Daily Telegraph, the site is connected to One World Action, a charity founded by Glenys Kinnock.[SUP][7][/SUP] An early version of the site was published on One World Action's web server.[SUP][8]"[/SUP]

[/SUP]Looks as though it might be linked to the Labour Party. Which way would they tend to bias results?[SUP][/SUP]
 
Mad Mike said:
Fact: Trudeau mandate: In order to receive federal aid for summer jobs, each business must first sign an "attestation" saying they agree with the ruling government's (Liberal Party) views on abortion and gender identity. Canadians have charter rights that guarantee we can have and express different political beliefs than the government. Again, we have a social democratic process at work.
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More information on said attestation and the true reasons for it can be found here, for those inclined to be fully informed.
 
We are definitely not dealing with Cretien's liberal party here. This is a newer animal, nowhere near center. They have gone further than NDP ever would have, and NDP was supposed to be the further left party.
 
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