WTF is with China? | GTAMotorcycle.com

WTF is with China?

Blackfin

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Repeated history of blatant copying of others' designs and no one does a ****ing thing (well, except western CEOs that fall all over themselves to set up shop there and we who buy their ****...)

http://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-news-new-bikes/loncin’s-500-twin

There must be legal tools available to the likes of Honda to go after Loncin (who, it turns out, also copies Honda small engines like the GX series).

Unless Honda has given them their blessing but that seems unlikely...

So what's the deal? The Chinese are pretty smart people; why can't they design their own, original stuff? Or is that country generally lacking in ethics and their "smarts" are put to use skipping the hard part and just copying other people's work?
 
Because copying is cheaper than designing, and anything cheaper yields bigger profits.

And they get away with it because copyright laws are basically toothless in China and the people doing the copying just hide behind the borders knowing that they are basically untouchable.
 
If they tried selling it in NA or Europe, Honda probably *could* go after them. I think technically they can go after them in China but it's pretty hopeless for anything to happen.

Realistically it seems like it would be a domestic market only bike, as it's probably actually garbage. There's no way it could be good
 
they don't recognize western patents
it's done with every kind of product available

western companies are complicit in this
used them for cheap manufacturing labour
engineering always done at the mother ship

no surprise they eventually copied the products
 
Creativity is not encouraged in Chinese culture.
 
Creativity is not encouraged in Chinese culture.
This.

Was listening to this program on Friday that explains how creativity is basically beat out of Chinese from Kindergarten. http://www.cbc.ca/radio/thecurrent/...-teaching-methods-author-lenora-chu-1.4289719

On the other hand they're excellent at getting kids to reach their maximum potential by stressing the value of hard work. They're not so much about "you're either born smart or not" like here in the west, what they do is get all kids, without prejudice, to set lofty goals and achieve them through hard work, which instills a strong work ethic. The flip side though is they're completely oblivious to students with genuine learning disabilities, who fall through the cracks for the rest of their lives.

If we could copy their successes without losing the stuff we're already good at, we'd have a crazy awesome workforce in a generation. You can bet they're looking to copy us to fix the weaknesses in their education system, but I have a feeling our Western pride won't let us do the same for ours.
 
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Years back I was involved with a company that sold casting resins. A customer made some GM logo belt buckles and tried to ship them to the USA. Got stopped cold at the border because they didn't have proof of copy-write approval.

So where is that protection coming into Canada or the USA?
 
There is protections for bringing in counterfeit goods, the people writing the shipping paperwork are extremely "creative" . You cant empty every container, and buried in the middle are 'Coach' brand purses, but the manifest says handbags, and they are.

They also are masters of the tweek, well Makita makes a drill thats blue and ours is yellow. Its made in the same factory as Makita, since Makita went there for cheap labor. The factory will sub a bushing for a bearing, a lesser quality battery and suddenly it looks the part, buts is $100 less.

And they will fake anything, including CSA stickers on electrical systems. (they got caught)

99% of the time copyright infringment, which is hard because you have to register in multiple countries, proprietary design, is up to the company that holds the patent to enforce through the courts and a lot of smaller companies just dont have the resources to enforce a patent, especially on a global scale.
You can send a cease/ desist letter to the distributor in your country, which may get a product pulled, meanwhile the Chinese are selling it all over the balance of the planet.
 
This video might explain some things....

[video=youtube;e4wbFdePb-k]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4wbFdePb-k[/video]
 
I have to say, the Chinese copy actually looks better ... which really should not be the case, ever, when they go against such R&D juggernaut as Honda. But such is the state of Honda nowadays ...
 
Don't think Honda(or any of the big makers of cars and bikes) is loosing market share in the world market to the knockoffs. Everyone knows they are knockoffs and of lesser quality.
 
Use to do work for a BBQ manufacturer in the 427-Airport area about 20 years ago, can't remember the name off hand. Plant was unionized. No one looked like they were working too hard whenever I was there, but the product was of fairly good quality. There was a protracted strike. Owner closed up shop, started a new, leaner (read: drastically fewer employees) company north of the 401 doing some in house work, but mostly distributing BBQs imported from the plant he opened in China. A couple of years later I see his not-so-smiling face on the cover of Canadian Manufacturing, with him complaining in the article inside on Chinese companies marketing knockoff products about how the Chinese were flooding the market with cheaper, identical looking BBQs to his (omitting the part about their plant being virtually across the street from his, using his shanghaied labour force, after burying him in red tape). I laughed. I cried. I laughed some more. You handed them the blueprints for both the product and the machinery, ya dooshnozzle. What did you think was gonna happen?
 
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Very little money has ever been lost due to knock offs. Same goes for piracy. Those who can afford authentic, will buy it. Those who could not afford it, never would have bought it anyway. No money lost. Those who pirate software and media, most likely would not have bought it anyway, no money lost there either.

Think Yamaha, Honda, Kawasaki or KTM lost many sales from Canadian Tire selling china dirt bikes? Doubt it
 
sorry billions is lost on knock offs, from straight reduced market share due to a lower cost competitor YOU may have developed, to a devalued brand because of the stigma generated from those that may not qualify have your branded goods.
Piracy is worse, artist X gets a $1. every time the record gets sold or a copy of the movie is sold, unless the copy is paying zero royalties. The artist, producer, actor make nothing, the pirate gets most.

Its pretty well documented in the free world what the estimated cost of forgeries and piracy costs.

Nobody in the bike industry cares about CTC selling bike bikes, except the annoying calls to see if a honda service dept will look at your dongdingba scooter motor.

unless I missed your sarcasm font, in which case carry on.
 
@FullMotoJacket iirc "Fiesta"?

sent from my Purple LGG4 on the GTAM app
 
Yes and no I guess....I buy name branded stuff if it's quality is deserved and proven....and cheaper "almost" brands for disposable or lesser use.
 
sorry billions is lost on knock offs, from straight reduced market share due to a lower cost competitor YOU may have developed, to a devalued brand because of the stigma generated from those that may not qualify have your branded goods.
Piracy is worse, artist X gets a $1. every time the record gets sold or a copy of the movie is sold, unless the copy is paying zero royalties. The artist, producer, actor make nothing, the pirate gets most.

Its pretty well documented in the free world what the estimated cost of forgeries and piracy costs.

Nobody in the bike industry cares about CTC selling bike bikes, except the annoying calls to see if a honda service dept will look at your dongdingba scooter motor.

unless I missed your sarcasm font, in which case carry on.

Here are some real, factual examples contrary to your post which has quite obviously been influenced almost verbatim, by propaganda.

1. I could not afford a Fender Telecaster, therefore could not have bought one from Fender. Instead I bought a copy, and I enjoyed it. Because I was never in a position to purchase their product, they did not lose a sale. BTW, later when I had more money, because I liked the fender designed copy(which did include some fender parts), I did infact purchase a brand new Fender. So rather than a sale lost, a sale as gained. Also note that if I bought a used one, which I might have afforded, they still do not get a sale, even though I bought a authentic.

2. I could not afford a Harley Davidson motorcycle, and definitely not a new one. I still very much like their bikes, and maybe someday I will be able to walk into a showroom and purchase one. Instead of buying a Harley, I bought a Shadow Phantom. Most who don't notice the Honda badge mistake it for Milwaukee iron. In this case, HD did NOT lose a sale, in fact because my shadow has fueled my lust for a low, loud, black cruiser, HD will gain a future sale that may have been lost if I had just gotten bored. Once again, if I bought used, no sale for HD, should they try to crush the used market?

3. For XBOX, I'll use previously owned resale examples because they effect the game industry in the exact same way that they say piracy does. I rarely buy new games unless addicted to the franchise. If I never play the game at all, well the game company neither gains or loses a sale, I simply would not have existed to them. However I bought Forza used, and although the neither gained or lost a sale, I then have bought every Forza title since, netting them 5 further sales that they would not have otherwise had. Similar stories with the Call of Duty franchise. And so on.

4. This is the last one I feel is necessary to make the point, and it may shatter your world to know that what the RIAA fed you was a lie. Do you know who Eric Church is? Neither did I, then I heard him on the radio FOR FREE imagine that, then I downloaded some songs FOR FREE, what a dirty pirate I am. Then, because I so enjoyed the music which I downloaded for free, I bought the next album, joined the fanclub(for early ticket access and a tshirt), pit tickets for the next concert, bought a tshirt at he concert, and bought the next album after that. I bet they sure do wish that I never bothered downloading those pirated tracks. It would have been much better for that artist if I had never been exposed in the first place, right?

There are a lot of artists out there that recognize the potential exposure and appreciate it, as they'd rather be heard by s many as possible, than simply paid by the few. There are software companies like Adobe that don't care if a guy at home downloads a burned creative suite, because maybe he'll teach himself how to use it and help expand the industry which is actually their bread and butter.

In most cases a non-sale today, means a bigger sale tomorrow. These are the facts, the rest is propaganda. But you did answer my earlier query correctly, the big guys never cared about the dingdangdong china dirtbikes at CTC, and they probably made sales to newly addicted riders when the dingdangdongs broke. Guess I didn't need to write this out, since you proved the point.
 
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Here are some real, factual examples contrary to your post which has quite obviously been influenced almost verbatim, by propaganda.

1. I could not afford a Fender Telecaster, therefore could not have bought one from Fender. Instead I bought a copy, and I enjoyed it. Because I was never in a position to purchase their product, they did not lose a sale. BTW, later when I had more money, because I liked the fender designed copy(which did include some fender parts), I did infact purchase a brand new Fender. So rather than a sale lost, a sale as gained. Also note that if I bought a used one, which I might have afforded, they still do not get a sale, even though I bought a authentic.

2. I could not afford a Harley Davidson motorcycle, and definitely not a new one. I still very much like their bikes, and maybe someday I will be able to walk into a showroom and purchase one. Instead of buying a Harley, I bought a Shadow Phantom. Most who don't notice the Honda badge mistake it for Milwaukee iron. In this case, HD did NOT lose a sale, in fact because my shadow has fueled my lust for a low, loud, black cruiser, HD will gain a future sale that may have been lost if I had just gotten bored. Once again, if I bought used, no sale for HD, should they try to crush the used market?

3. For XBOX, I'll use previously owned resale examples because they effect the game industry in the exact same way that they say piracy does. I rarely buy new games unless addicted to the franchise. If I never play the game at all, well the game company neither gains or loses a sale, I simply would not have existed to them. However I bought Forza used, and although the neither gained or lost a sale, I then have bought every Forza title since, netting them 5 further sales that they would not have otherwise had. Similar stories with the Call of Duty franchise. And so on.

4. This is the last one I feel is necessary to make the point, and it may shatter your world to know that what the RIAA fed you was a lie. Do you know who Eric Church is? Neither did I, then I heard him on the radio FOR FREE imagine that, then I downloaded some songs FOR FREE, what a dirty pirate I am. Then, because I so enjoyed the music which I downloaded for free, I bought the next album, joined the fanclub(for early ticket access and a tshirt), pit tickets for the next concert, bought a tshirt at he concert, and bought the next album after that. I bet they sure do wish that I never bothered downloading those pirated tracks. It would have been much better for that artist if I had never been exposed in the first place, right?

There are a lot of artists out there that recognize the potential exposure and appreciate it, as they'd rather be heard by s many as possible, than simply paid by the few. There are software companies like Adobe that don't care if a guy at home downloads a burned creative suite, because maybe he'll teach himself how to use it and help expand the industry which is actually their bread and butter.

In most cases a non-sale today, means a bigger sale tomorrow. These are the facts, the rest is propaganda. But you did answer my earlier query correctly, the big guys never cared about the dingdangdong china dirtbikes at CTC, and they probably made sales to newly addicted riders when the dingdangdongs broke. Guess I didn't need to write this out, since you proved the point.

Then again there are the people that bought a knock off and never pursued the music, biking, etc because the junk they were using turned them off the activity.

The first time I tried camping I thought it was wise to buy cheap stuff to minimize outlay in case I didn't like it. I didn't like it and didn't try it again for years. Many years later, with decent equipment, it turned out OK.
 

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