Biker Cafe Idea - need some feedback from all of you | GTAMotorcycle.com

Biker Cafe Idea - need some feedback from all of you

rorider

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Hey guys, I've been thinking about this for a while now, as we don't seem to have anything quite like it in the GTA.
I'm looking to open a biker oriented/friendly cafe place (liquor licensed as well) similar to the Ace Cafe in London, England.
A place for motorcycle fans to get together, talk bikes, watch MotoGP, Dakar Rally, etc. Have some documentary/movies nights, old school movies, etc and live bands.

What do you guys thing about this? Would you stop by?
 
Hey guys, I've been thinking about this for a while now, as we don't seem to have anything quite like it in the GTA.
I'm looking to open a biker oriented/friendly cafe place (liquor licensed as well) similar to the Ace Cafe in London, England.
A place for motorcycle fans to get together, talk bikes, watch MotoGP, Dakar Rally, etc. Have some documentary/movies nights, old school movies, etc and live bands.

What do you guys thing about this? Would you stop by?

I would go if there was strong coffee and good food. Good wings, nachos and all day-breakfast food are a must. Having some cool bikes and motorcycle memorabilia on display as well. Would be nice to have a breakfast spot to watch the motorcycle races while you eat on a sunday morning. I guess it depends where it is too. Personally, the closer it is to downtown Toronto the less I would end up going. Not too fun riding in that area. Definitely a cool idea though.
 
You'll need density to keep the patrons coming through the doors. Even a moto-cafe is going to need non-riders to survive the winter months and rainy days. Zoning will be critical too. Guess how many residential neighbours enjoy the noise of blipping/straight pipe/race exhausts all week? Somewhere between zero and noise complaints to the cops.

Overall, I approve of the idea and would be happy to stop by, just keep it north of Bloor. South of Bloor is basically Mordor at this point. Up in The Junction area maybe? Something semi-industrial, with a bit of a buffer against gentrification. That and lots of space for street parking.
 
I'm a pessimist. I see people dropping in, buying a coffee then taking up real estate for hours, not a good business plan.

Don't ask friends for advice about opening a business because they are afraid to tell you if your idea sucks. Ask Kevin O'Leary. That SOB will nail you with the truth.
 
Hate to be blunt, but I agree with Flywheel above - you'll starve in the winter, especially considering how many "riders" only ride from June until mid September...and many can't seem to get past the nearest Tim Hortons.

The audience outside the motorcycle scene will be limited as well (unless you're basically building a pub with motorcycles secondary which doesn't seem to be your goal), so once the MC season wraps up it'd be a tough go IMHO.
 
The idea is nice but the reality might be cruel.

A place that has nostalgia and makes fellow riders comfortable. Meet up for a drink or bite before heading out on a road trip or a place to go after a ride.

A place to go during the winter and share stories, plan a ride down south. Watch some races, share some secrets etc.

As long as the food is good and the location easy to get to, I think it can have some staying power. Like any place can. Why do people go there?

So the theme can be what you want but the core needs to keep folks coming back and pay the bills.

I know an owner of a Scottish pub and has a pretty good amount of regulars that watch football after hours as private events. And they regulars come in and run up a decent tab. There is live music or karaoke etc.

But he also caters outside events and has great food. The football element is only a small element.

You could have tvs for races and decor that is themed for bikes. But even that can get spendy in a hurry.

Open a bar/restaurant and keep the pricing reasonable and food good and beer cold and it should do alright. Have a motorcycle theme and it should still do fine.


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Very similar threads have popped up from time to time in the past. So far none have come to fruition but it might be useful to find and speak with them about their experiences. I would check out a place like this, especially if races are being shown.
 
It would have to be a pub/restaurant first, with good food at reasonable prices. Having a moto theme is just gravy(pun intended). When moto stuff is is broadcast it could get first priority, but when it's not, there would be other sports or other events to cater to.
 
1. you'll need financing and banks will show you the door when you mention resteraunt.
2. nothing has the closure / bankruptcy rate of a resteraunt business
3. leasing space is tough because landlords hate resteraunts (they close all the time)

Open in Daytona, Sturgis, Vegas, Orlando maybe, Toronto not so much
 
This is great feedback, thanks guys. I guess I'm just day dreaming about a place like this. Most likely not a very good viable business.
I love bikes and I wish there was a place where I could go and hang out once in a while and talk about bikes, trips, racing, etc. In Europe, in places like England and Italy they have more of a passion for bikes than here and I was hoping to create the same vibe with a place like this.
 
Its not more passion, we have this thing they dont called snowmobile season.

Guy that used to post here a long while ago, Japanese dude, opened a 50's Japanese rockabilly bar on Dundas W called Black Dice. Bit weird drink menu, heavy on sake cocktails and it stays open. There is something for everybody out there.

But he's in a hot nieghborhood, like Ossington now and Queen W was. In the bar/cafe/food business its location, timing and location. Be different and they will seek you out, or ignore you completely.
I'm not saying dont do it but if you have 100k in your pocket, you might wanna think a bit on this one.
 
I think it can work but you have to expand on the vision.
Try to get something close to the highway.
What areas did you have in mind?
 
This is great feedback, thanks guys. I guess I'm just day dreaming about a place like this. Most likely not a very good viable business.
I love bikes and I wish there was a place where I could go and hang out once in a while and talk about bikes, trips, racing, etc. In Europe, in places like England and Italy they have more of a passion for bikes than here and I was hoping to create the same vibe with a place like this.

Keep dreaming (I mean that in a good way). Any sort of restaurant is a tough row to hoe but that doesn't mean impossible. Research and planning helps manage your risk, just like any other business. Ultimately, the product is food/beer, not people taking up space watching TV. Will a strong moto theme actually help you sell that? Or will the reputation as a "biker" bar drive customers away? Image management will be critical to avoiding that.

Let's spitball here. I ride, but nobody I know does. We all like decent food at decent prices. Can I bring a bunch of friends, eat a good meal and see some cool machines through the BIG WINDOWS as they come and go? What do the locals around the world's famous racetracks or motorcycle factories eat? There's your food lineup right there. Can you trade advertising space to someone like FortNine in exchange for small web order discounts? That sort of thing. Pay for good graphic design/branding and sell caps/shirts based on it. There's some free advertising.

A gixxer bro who buys one beer and attracts the cops with burnouts and wheelies is not your customer. If you want stunting, contact the guys who know their stuff (Johnny P, etc), get the permits if they exist and turn it into a show. You know what people want while they watch a show? Something to eat and drink. Parents may even want to bring their kids. Keep dreaming, just don't sleepwalk into a disaster in the process. Good luck.
 
Lets all remember there was 2 big-name attempts at this in Toronto in the past - the "1903" Harley Cafe and the Indian Motorcycle cafe.

Both are now closed. The Indian Cafe went a few years, the Harley Cafe just opened this past June and is closed already.

If Harley can't make a go of it (much less last even 6 months, during the summer at that) I'd use that as an indicator of the viability.

Edit: Ok, if the Harley Cafe was a lease issue as Roadghost suggests, different story....I couldn't find anything about it's closure aside from the fact it didn't seem planned.
 
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Hey guys, I've been thinking about this for a while now, as we don't seem to have anything quite like it in the GTA.
I'm looking to open a biker oriented/friendly cafe place (liquor licensed as well) similar to the Ace Cafe in London, England.
A place for motorcycle fans to get together, talk bikes, watch MotoGP, Dakar Rally, etc. Have some documentary/movies nights, old school movies, etc and live bands.

What do you guys thing about this? Would you stop by?

Harley Davidson had a coffee shop like that on Ossington called 1903. I went there and the staff all told me the shop did really well - a great success. Unfortunately some big company stole the lease out from under them before it could be renewed, so they're looking for another location. Ossington just happens to be rather trendy at the moment I guess.

I think it's a great idea, but you have to pay special attention to location, a welcoming and comfortable atmosphere and above and beyond all, ample, safe parking for motorcycles where they can't be hit by cars. It's important to have the bikes parked visibly, because they are essentially an advertisement for the business. You can charge high prices in Toronto as long as the coffee, tea and other products are top notch.
 
the H-D cafe on Ossington was a short term venture, it was never meant to open longer than the summer. H-D used it as a pop up idea to get bikes looked at by younger hip people. They didn't loose a lease, they had no intention of running longer than they did.
They may try another location someday, maybe not. There was an interview published with the CEO of HD Canada in a CDN moto mag where he outlined his marketing strategy.
 
Lets all remember there was 2 big-name attempts at this in Toronto in the past - the "1903" Harley Cafe and the Indian Motorcycle cafe.

Both are now closed. The Indian Cafe went a few years, the Harley Cafe just opened this past June and is closed already.

If Harley can't make a go of it (much less last even 6 months, during the summer at that) I'd use that as an indicator of the viability.

Edit: Ok, if the Harley Cafe was a lease issue as Roadghost suggests, different story....I couldn't find anything about it's closure aside from the fact it didn't seem planned.

Did you ever go to Indian? I did. It was a someones fun idea.
Opening a bar/cafe of this nature in places where the rent will swallow you up or shut you down with a minor increase is not the way to go imo.
 
I've always thought this was a great idea.
Location would be the key. If it were downtown, I'm thinking location close to the DVP or 401 would be best, so people could organise rides using the café as a start point.
Other than that, Bellfountain would be a great spot. Close to some nice roads.
If you could open a business on Side Rd. 15 that would be perfect.

Then it would be wise to open a Harley oriented one and a Jap oriented café. Last thing I want to do is go to a restaurant and sit with a bunch of Harley guys that were looking at me weirdly.
 
Campbellville would be a great spot as well. That's almost a ready to go spot.

Open it and they will come.
 
When it comes to Brand Specific, the business model allocates half the square footage to merchandise as the food is break even and the booze makes some money but not enough time keep the lights on.

It it's more like a "grass roots" pub, you could make it all makes and styles two or three wheels. Cafe, GP, cruiser etc.

Definitely need to sell $40 tee shirts and $10 key chains etc.


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