Looks like Photo Radar is coming back..! | GTAMotorcycle.com

Looks like Photo Radar is coming back..!

kiwi

Well-known member
Published Tuesday, November 8, 2016 9:54AM EST OTTAWA - Ontario municipalities could soon introduce photo radar in school zones under new legislation.
Premier Kathleen Wynne says the bill would allow municipalities to introduce it on municipal roads, in school zones and community safety zones.
The photo radar, also known as automated speed enforcement technology, would take pictures of the licence plates of drivers who are speeding.
The bill would also allow municipalities to create reduced-speed-limit zones and let them participate more easily in the red light camera program.

Wynne says too many people are being injured and killed by drivers who speed.


http://www.cp24.com/news/ontario-to-bring-back-photo-radar-for-school-zones-1.3150721
 
Good. Always felt it was a good deterrent to those who feel the speed limits don't apply to them, particularly in school zones where people seem to drive at grievous speeds without a second thought. And before everyone pig piles me for that comment, read the damn press release - school zones is the main target here.

So long as it was like it was before (I wonder how many around here will even remember it?) it results in a financial penalty only, no points or anything on your record. In the end the hit to the pocketbook makes people slow down and think which is the ultimate goal.

I remeber when Harris killed it solely to get votes. Yet another political decision made simply to grasp at power, not based on common sense.
 
I would be ok with School zones only but that is not what it says


Premier Kathleen Wynne says the bill would allow municipalities to introduce it on municipal roads, in school zones and community safety zones.

Good. Always felt it was a good deterrent to those who feel the speed limits don't apply to them, particularly in school zones where people seem to drive at grievous speeds without a second thought. And before everyone pig piles me for that comment, read the damn press release - school zones is the main target here.

So long as it was like it was before (I wonder how many around here will even remember it?) it results in a financial penalty only, no points or anything on your record. In the end the hit to the pocketbook makes people slow down and think which is the ultimate goal.

I remeber when Harris killed it solely to get votes. Yet another political decision made simply to grasp at power, not based on common sense.
 
Premier Kathleen Wynne says the bill would allow municipalities to introduce it on municipal roads, in school zones and community safety zones.


"Community safety zones" are typically surrounding built up areas around schools (and school zones themselves) as well as playgrounds and areas where there's large concentrations of kids - city parks etc. I have no issue with that.
 
"Community safety zones" are typically surrounding built up areas around schools (and school zones themselves) as well as playgrounds and areas where there's large concentrations of kids - city parks etc. I have no issue with that.

That is just political speak for putting them anywhere they feel is a community safety zone.

That is the kind of wiggle wrong I'm not comfortable with.

The road to hell is paved with the best intentioned.

If the real issue is speeding in school zones, park LE in those zones and give them the charges they deserve. Not just a tax.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
If the real issue is speeding in school zones, park LE in those zones and give them the charges they deserve. Not just a tax.

Agreed. This is just going to turn into a revenue-generation tool by cash-strapped municipalities to generate revenue, nothing else.
 
Agreed. This is just going to turn into a revenue-generation tool by cash-strapped municipalities to generate revenue, nothing else.
Everything is.
 
That is just political speak for putting them anywhere they feel is a community safety zone.

That is the kind of wiggle wrong I'm not comfortable with

Like all things there is certainly room for abuse, however it's important to keep in mind that designating an area a "community safety zone" isn't as easy as having a few city workers slap up some signs – it is governed by the highway traffic act and does require a application and designation process before beforehand.

I think it's a reasonably safe assumption that there must be a justifiable reason for the request as well.

If cities rush out to designate easy picking speed traps areas as "community safety zones" for no more reason than to allow photo radar installs, we can revisit the discussion, however until that point we are dealing with today's reality where they are (AFAIK exclusively) in areas for which there is plenty of justification. Mainly around schools.
 
Thin end of the wedge. Who can argue with saving the children. "Speed Kills" marketing works. And yes, a new revenue tool for municipalities.

If they really wanted to improve safety in school zones, they should have officers there to manage the chaos of all the parents who insist on driving to drop off their little darlings. I'd be really curious to see of the 150 people who died on the streets over the 4 years in Ottawa, how many were killed in a school zone during school hours.

Also, Toronto passed a by-law to lower the speed to 30 kph on all local roads in old Toronto & East York. Schools zones are currently 40, but as most schools are on local roads, would go down to 30. If they start enforcing 30 with photo radar, the City's budget would be running a surplus in no time.
 
Last edited:
The Libs really need to go ... everything they touch is just a peach .... you said that before the last election, eh?

Should we start ... "You know how many people die from playing sports every year?" .....??? Like their reasoning really matters.

I expect these "reduced-speed-limit zones " will be popping like mushrooms .... why not? If they can put 50km/h zones on three lane main streets, just because there's a few intersections with no direct driveway or house entrance adjacent to it, surely the revenue will be hard to pass on .... Let's hope the bill doesn't get traction before she's voted out, but I have a feeling it will be too late for that.
 
If cities rush out to designate easy picking speed traps areas as "community safety zones" for no more reason than to allow photo radar installs, we can revisit the discussion, however until that point we are dealing with today's reality where they are (AFAIK exclusively) in areas for which there is plenty of justification. Mainly around schools.

When did a municipality official or provincial liberal lie or abused a law/bill the last time? ... I know, they never do.
 
Thin end of the wedge. Who can argue with saving the children. "Speed Kills" marketing works. And yes, a new revenue tool for municipalities.

If they really wanted to improve safety in school zones, they should have officers there to manage the chaos of all the parents who insist on driving to drop off their little darlings. I'd be really curious to see of the 150 people who died on the streets over the 4 years in Ottawa, how many were killed in a school zone during school hours.

Also, Toronto passed a by-law to lower the speed to 30 kph on all local roads in old Toronto & East York. Schools zones are currently 40, but as most schools are on local roads, would go down to 30. If they start enforcing 30 with photo radar, the City's budget would be running a surplus in no time.

I drive through 4 school zones in the morning to do my drop off, and its amazing how bad these parents are when dropping off their kids. Seems like everyone is running late, so after parking right in front of the crossing to drop them off, they speed off like a bat out of hell to get to work. I actually am getting another dash cam for this exact reason. I could contribute lots of great footage to the "Bad Drivers of Ontario" thread.

Now, the school zone thing as mentioned sounds all good and dandy, but sounds like they can have a lot of wiggle room to implement this on just about any road they deem "community saftey zone".

As Face mentioned, having a visible police presence can actually more productive. Years ago when I used to commute by motorcycle, I wore a hiVis vest, and was standing on a corner waiting for someone, it was amazing how many cars hit their brakes as they approached thinking I was a cop. heh. But then again, the trend here is that the Police Don't want to be seen (ref: their new greyed out cruisers) lol.
 
Thin end of the wedge. Who can argue with saving the children. "Speed Kills" marketing works. And yes, a new revenue tool for municipalities.

No kidding. Dundas Street between Islington Avenue and Royal York Road is a "Community Safety Zone". It's a 4-lane + median arterial road. Just more clawing from the Lich of Queen's Park.

As for the whole, "no points" argument, the UK is already running hi-def speed cameras to ID the drivers: http://www.speedcamerasuk.com/truvelo.htm, so the tech is there already to make it "yes points" and involve your insurance company too. 2 kph over the limit? ZAP!
 
This is the proverbial camel's nose in the tent. It will eventually encompass all roads. I still remember photo-radar on the QEW with the BS 5km/h-over fines.
 
How about a revamp of the graduated licensing system? That might work. She's running out of ideas.
I agree there are some problem areas, but not the 4 school zones I pass on a daily at 3pm when schools out. In fact, most people are 10 under the posted limit.
Maybe only the problem areas should be enforced by police. Not million dollar cameras. Oh well.
 
Last edited:
uhm
let me take a stab at this
we have A LOT of technology today (Waze app) and ppl will get notified where the cars are located...meaning it might cost more for them to run than tickets they collect
 
Expecting the typical result of a program that costs a ton of money, underdelivers, and gets disbanded after being in place for a few years. Probably will also have the amusing effect of further crippling traffic court since presumably the total volume of cases will go up
 
...If they really wanted to improve safety in school zones, they should have officers there to manage the chaos of all the parents who insist on driving to drop off their little darlings. I'd be really curious to see of the 150 people who died on the streets over the 4 years in Ottawa, how many were killed in a school zone during school hours.

Also, Toronto passed a by-law to lower the speed to 30 kph on all local roads in old Toronto & East York. Schools zones are currently 40, but as most schools are on local roads, would go down to 30. If they start enforcing 30 with photo radar, the City's budget would be running a surplus in no time.

A couple of years ago I complained to the police about errant parking practices in front of my local school, endangering kids and other vehicles. I personally talked to one officer. Drivers seem to really like doing 3-8 point U turns in front of the school. The verdict: There are exactly 3 officers patrolling schools in my area of Scarborough, or 1 officer for 18 schools, and they have other duties. It is impossible for an officer to get to each school more than a couple of times a year, or so they told me. Once an officer is seen the behaviour stops, but returns once out of sight. The problem is intractable and rampant around Toronto.

I would welcome photo radar in school zones. Signs showing your speed have little effect. There are not enough police to solve this problem. My local school started giving out flyers in English and Chinese, to seemingly no effect.
 
Like all things there is certainly room for abuse, however it's important to keep in mind that designating an area a "community safety zone" isn't as easy as having a few city workers slap up some signs – it is governed by the highway traffic act and does require a application and designation process before beforehand.

I think it's a reasonably safe assumption that there must be a justifiable reason for the request as well.

If cities rush out to designate easy picking speed traps areas as "community safety zones" for no more reason than to allow photo radar installs, we can revisit the discussion, however until that point we are dealing with today's reality where they are (AFAIK exclusively) in areas for which there is plenty of justification. Mainly around schools.

It's a whole lot easier to prevent something like that from happening to begin with, than to reverse it after it has happened (i.e. cities manage to designate themselves "community safety zones" in their entirety).

Reference

http://www.ontla.on.ca/web/bills/bi...illID=1827&ParlSessionID=36:2&isCurrent=false

"The council of a municipality may by by-law designate a part of a highway under its jurisdiction as a community safety zone if, in the council's opinion, public safety is of special concern on that part of the highway."

What's to stop them from saying that public safety is of special concern on ALL parts of ALL highways (and remember, a "highway" means any public-access road)?

It's too vague to stop abuse by municipalities.

edit: I don't have a problem with this IF it is limited strictly to within a certain distance (200 m?) of a school on roads that the school property fronts onto or has crosswalks directly accessing the school property, and within set times (1 hour before start of classes and 2 hours after end of classes). Not at 3 AM when no one is around, and not 1 km away, and not on a road running behind the back of the school with a fence separating the school from the road ...
 
Last edited:
Expecting the typical result of a program that costs a ton of money, underdelivers, and gets disbanded after being in place for a few years. Probably will also have the amusing effect of further crippling traffic court since presumably the total volume of cases will go up

Yes, revenues generated may not cover system costs. Won't really change behaviours. One thing that may explain why this is being done is kick-backs from the tech companies selling the gear.
 

Back
Top Bottom