First and last time I'll ever let someone else change my oil | Page 2 | GTAMotorcycle.com

First and last time I'll ever let someone else change my oil

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kiwi said:
likewise, the Nm torque setting is "hand tighten" then a bit on the spanner for me ;-) I guess I'll find out when I put the bike away in a few months how tight it will be,,
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This has been my method on both the bike and car. I put it on as tight as I can by hand, then use the wrench to give it a 1/8-1/4 turn more just to be safe. Normally comes off without much issue. Always change the oil warm (if cold, I let it run for about 5 mins), but I typically let it drain for 20-30 before I pull the filter. I also always coat the filter gasket with oil prior to installation as well.
 
Every brand new bike I've had has required a screwdriver to remove. They come from the factory like that.

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I just did an oil change a week ago. I've done everyone on my bike. I always put the filter on the same way and this time the filter was stubborn. Took a lot of monkeying to get it off. **** happens :dontknow:
 
It was tightened more than 1/2 turn past finger tight.Most people can't help but give it a little more.I use exactly 1/2 turn and then a gear clamp around it.The gear clamp gets safety wired so that it CAN'T back off.Problem solved.Sometimes i can even get them off without a wrench.
hoseclampsafety.jpg
 
Benny! said:
Every brand new bike I've had has required a screwdriver to remove. They come from the factory like that.

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I still remember the first change on my 650...thankfully I bought the socket-style filter wrench, because I actually needed a breaker bar to get it loose.
 
Wingboy said:
It was tightened more than 1/2 turn past finger tight.Most people can't help but give it a little more.I use exactly 1/2 turn and then a gear clamp around it.The gear clamp gets safety wired so that it CAN'T back off.Problem solved.Sometimes i can even get them off without a wrench.
hoseclampsafety.jpg
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That seems a bit excessive... but I guess if you have been burned.....
 
From a technician's perspective: yes most filters are over tightened. Factory installed, me installed... all of them. I have never seen someone use a torque wrench on a filter, and I am quite aware that there is a spec. I have had a heck of a time getting some filters off (including using an air hammer once). The "rule of thumb" (a term I hate) is finger tight until the o-ring seats then a 1/4 - 1/2 turn more. Personally, I encourage apprentices to give it a little extra, as I would rather struggle taking a filter off then have to explain to a customer covered in road rash what happened.

I find the K & N filters are the worst for over tightening, as people use their wrenches to put it on and round of the "nut"; oh and their o-rings are dry in the packaging. Most OEMs have some grease on them. That gear clamp idea is neat. I imagine that could be used two ways: hold the filter in place, and give a little extra purchase when breaking free.
 
LPakkala said:
From a technician's perspective: yes most filters are over tightened. Factory installed, me installed... all of them. I have never seen someone use a torque wrench on a filter, and I am quite aware that there is a spec. I have had a heck of a time getting some filters off (including using an air hammer once). The "rule of thumb" (a term I hate) is finger tight until the o-ring seats then a 1/4 - 1/2 turn more. Personally, I encourage apprentices to give it a little extra, as I would rather struggle taking a filter off then have to explain to a customer covered in road rash what happened.

I find the K & N filters are the worst for over tightening, as people use their wrenches to put it on and round of the "nut"; oh and their o-rings are dry in the packaging. Most OEMs have some grease on them. That gear clamp idea is neat. I imagine that could be used two ways: hold the filter in place, and give a little extra purchase when breaking free.
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Seeing how the factory is asking for 12 ft lbs why would you tourqe it so much? If threaded straight and properly with an oiled gasket I see no need to over tighten it. Technician or not your fear of dripping or spillage of oil seems to be a little overbearing. That's why I'll never let anyone else do it for me again. That's just my 2 cents though.

Again, there should have been no need for me to break out the locking pliers and crush my filter to get a good enough grip to take it off. That was just far too ridiculous
 
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...another technician here.... i get at least one a week. I've also had some that need the air hammer treatment.
 
Venom01 said:
Seeing how the factory is asking for 12 ft lbs why would you tourqe it so much? If threaded straight and properly with an oiled gasket I see no need to over tighten it. Technician or not your fear of dripping or spillage of oil seems to be a little overbearing. That's why I'll never let anyone else do it for me again. That's just my 2 cents though.

Again, there should have been no need for me to break out the locking pliers and crush my filter to get a good enough grip to take it off. That was just far too ridiculous
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Because your life is worth more to me than 20 minutes of frustration later. I'm not suggesting 100 ft-lbs is the answer, but if the spec is 12 ft-lbs and it gets tightened to 25.. I'm never going to reprimand an apprentice for that. If it leaks on the rear tire while driving down the QEW on the other hand...
 
LPakkala said:
Because your life is worth more to me than 20 minutes of frustration later. I'm not suggesting 100 ft-lbs is the answer, but if the spec is 12 ft-lbs and it gets tightened to 25.. I'm never going to reprimand an apprentice for that. If it leaks on the rear tire while driving down the QEW on the other hand...
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Doubt it myself, but that's why I'm not letting anyone else do it from now on.
 
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Go to You tube and search "Chris Harris Oil Filter".
Excellent video on how remove stubborn or other oil filters.
 
Wingboy said:
It was tightened more than 1/2 turn past finger tight.Most people can't help but give it a little more.I use exactly 1/2 turn and then a gear clamp around it.The gear clamp gets safety wired so that it CAN'T back off.Problem solved.Sometimes i can even get them off without a wrench.
hoseclampsafety.jpg
Click to expand...
This technique is quite common for some Guzzis that have the oil filter up in the engine/oil pan, as the twin vibrations may back them right off. IIRC they don't need the safety wire, as the worm gear drive housing will jam up against the engine to stop any spinning.

The idea of oiling the filter's o-ring seal up is so it will slide against the mating surface and won't get pulled out of the filter/groove when tightening it down, not about making removal easier.

I have always had good luck with a wide strap wrench, but first, I apply a liberal amount of electrical contact cleaner on the mating surfaces of the filter and the rubber strap, and allow them to dry to make sure they are oil free which greatly enhances grip/turning power.
 
dricked said:
I've had this happen as well, no big deal.

K+N filters are awesome for removing and lock wiring until the o-ring blows out and fills your bellypan with oil. In oem I trust, the extra $2 I will pay.
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Those K+N and Hi Flo filter filters have a very good chance of getting you killed. In the 30 years + that I've been working in the motorcycle industry, I've seen a number of accidents caused by these second rate GARBABE filters. The orings at the base of these filters are made of second rate rubber that deform when they are tightened. You should also know that they may or may not have "anti flow-back" valves which prevent your top end (including the all important cam chain plunger damper) from losing their oil. Additionally, I've seen those filters produced with scuffs and holes at their bases. These filters are cheap for a reason: they don't filter well, it's second rate quality element material....honesty, what did you think was in there? Any shop that hands you one of these filters and says that it is the same as your OEM filter has no idea what they are talking about. I've never had a problem removing or installing an OEM filter but then again I have the OEM filter wrenches (cup shaped). Do yourself a favour, buy OEM filters and use the OEM or good fitting OEM style filter wrench.
 
theassassin said:
Those K+N and Hi Flo filter filters have a very good chance of getting you killed. In the 30 years + that I've been working in the motorcycle industry, I've seen a number of accidents caused by these second rate GARBABE filters. The orings at the base of these filters are made of second rate rubber that deform when they are tightened. You should also know that they may or may not have "anti flow-back" valves which prevent your top end (including the all important cam chain plunger damper) from losing their oil. Additionally, I've seen those filters produced with scuffs and holes at their bases. These filters are cheap for a reason: they don't filter well, it's second rate quality element material....honesty, what did you think was in there? Any shop that hands you one of these filters and says that it is the same as your OEM filter has no idea what they are talking about. I've never had a problem removing or installing an OEM filter but then again I have the OEM filter wrenches (cup shaped). Do yourself a favour, buy OEM filters and use the OEM or good fitting OEM style filter wrench.
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I've heard from numerous sources the K&N Filters are absolutely atrocious as well......
 
Venom01 said:
No need for an oil filter to look like this once it's finally removed. Strap wench couldn't get a hold of it, filter wrench started to collapse the sides and slip. I had to take my 3" lock pliers to get it off and it still was a *****. Whoever the hell put this thing on needs a slap to the back of the head

PHOTO
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...with a chair.
 
Used to clamp the filter in my Guzzi V11. The only problem was you had to remove the oil pan to get at it. There was at least 20 screws holding it on - what a PITA!

twinswin said:
This technique is quite common for some Guzzis that have the oil filter up in the engine/oil pan, as the twin vibrations may back them right off. IIRC they don't need the safety wire, as the worm gear drive housing will jam up against the engine to stop any spinning.

The idea of oiling the filter's o-ring seal up is so it will slide against the mating surface and won't get pulled out of the filter/groove when tightening it down, not about making removal easier.

I have always had good luck with a wide strap wrench, but first, I apply a liberal amount of electrical contact cleaner on the mating surfaces of the filter and the rubber strap, and allow them to dry to make sure they are oil free which greatly enhances grip/turning power.
Click to expand...
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