My school is on strike. Driving in is a pain, and public transit takes too long. What would be the legality of pushing a motorcycle (engine off) on the sidewalk, past the picket lines? I asked one of the picketers and they said they wouldn't stop me because they can only block the road, but am I breaking any laws by doing this? I really don't want to wait 30-90 mins to get into campus, and I also don't want a cop calling me afterwards.
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Walking a motorcycle on a sidewalk
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It is legal to push your motorbike on the sidewalk.
conundrum
Well-known member
I think you're right, but talk to the ones who blockaded UTSC's lots last Thursday -- Cars had to turn around and park elsewhere (eg. illegally in other lots or on streets blocks away) since they would not let anyone through...even staff.
Yes they are allowed to block you (from what I understand). They stop each car for 5-10 mins, but if people honk/get aggressive/university makes a move that upsets them, they extend the delay. Students are reporting 30-90 min delays in the mornings. Personally, I think its ridiculous that my education is being used as a bargaining chip between CUPE and YorkU, but theres not much I can do. Here are some videos of whats actually going on at the picket line. Note that these are from the past few weeks during which only some classes had resumed... starting today (march 23rd), almost all classes are resuming, meaning thousands of people trying to cross the picket line. I decided to stay home today to avoid that cluster****.
For your entertainment:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QY8YStXEkN0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrKTl4LbLtk
It will be interesting to see how it plays out today with classes resuming.
On the bright side, looks like I can just push my bike across on the sidewalk.
DownUnder
Well-known member
It would be perfectly legal to push a bike down the footpath... however, the chances of one of the ****** bag picketers pushing your bike over as you walk past may be an unreasonable risk to take.
Seems every year in the GTA some Union is striking and screwing everyone over to get what they want. Garbage, Post, Teachers etc etc etc... A lot of the time its professions that are WAY overpaid for the little work they do in the first place.
Unions just hold the public at ransom to get what they want and protect lazy, unproductive employees. The govt should just abolish them.
Seems every year in the GTA some Union is striking and screwing everyone over to get what they want. Garbage, Post, Teachers etc etc etc... A lot of the time its professions that are WAY overpaid for the little work they do in the first place.
Unions just hold the public at ransom to get what they want and protect lazy, unproductive employees. The govt should just abolish them.
Yeah, they say they can't block the sidewalk... until you try and take your bike with you then watch things get real ugly real quick.
As for unions, they're the lesser of two evils IMO. Without them, employers have too much power and use it to make unreasonable demands on their staff. There needs to be a balance of powers between employers and employees, and with unions that balance is better but they clearly have the upper hand. There needs to be some change to even things out, but I don't know what that is.
Here's an exert about the YorkU strike and the legality of picket lines and delaying cars.
Picketing in Canada is VERY heavily regulated. If a union was designing the law, they would let strikers prevent people from coming into the business (a university, in this case) during a strike. For example, they would try to stop everyone from entering York property for any (non-emergency) reason, as it would put the maximum amount of pressure on the company. If an employer could do anything, they would make sure picketers were off their property and quiet. This would let them go about things as normally as possible, and help them keep their reputation in tact. Short delays are the balance courts have struck between these two perspectives.
Here's a recent case about delays, and here's a blog summarizing it. In this case, delays were 90 minutes to 8 hours(!). The key points (with all the references to other cases taken out):
This case also cites another case that says "absent questions of property damage or personal injury, a robust society can accommodate some inconvenience as a corollary of the right to picket in a labour dispute".
Picketing in Canada is VERY heavily regulated. If a union was designing the law, they would let strikers prevent people from coming into the business (a university, in this case) during a strike. For example, they would try to stop everyone from entering York property for any (non-emergency) reason, as it would put the maximum amount of pressure on the company. If an employer could do anything, they would make sure picketers were off their property and quiet. This would let them go about things as normally as possible, and help them keep their reputation in tact. Short delays are the balance courts have struck between these two perspectives.
Here's a recent case about delays, and here's a blog summarizing it. In this case, delays were 90 minutes to 8 hours(!). The key points (with all the references to other cases taken out):
Peaceful picketing is a form of expression, and is constitutionally protected; In the context of a lawful strike, picketing has a considerably broader objective than expression;
A strike is not a “tea party”, it is “the culmination of a failed negotiation. After a failed negotiation, emotions are often high. What ensues is an economic struggle. At the outset, each side believes it has to win the strike. From the employer’s perspective, it needs to carry on business and demonstrate that the strike is ineffective. From the union’s perspective, it must try to cause as much disruption to the employer’s business as possible. Each side hopes to eventually force concessions that will result in a more favourable agreement.”
The employer is perfectly entitled to continue to operate its business during a strike, and to hire replacement workers if it sees fit;
If the employer exercises its right to carry on business, and hires replacement workers in order to do so, the union will do what it can to impede this; (EDIT: this case wasn't about a Sobeys, not York. If there is a provision in the contract that says 'no replacement workers', it would be illegal to hire them).
“A picket line that is merely expressive, without more, will do little to cause disruption to the employer’s business. It is not surprising, therefore, that picketers were attempting to delay people who wished to cross the picket line”;
“Peaceful picketing can accomplish the objective of causing delay just as effectively as violent picketing. All that is required is that people stand in front of vehicles seeking entry or exit. This is just as effective as putting up a fence" (note: at York we've been using safety barriers, which have been okay so far).
A strike is not a “tea party”, it is “the culmination of a failed negotiation. After a failed negotiation, emotions are often high. What ensues is an economic struggle. At the outset, each side believes it has to win the strike. From the employer’s perspective, it needs to carry on business and demonstrate that the strike is ineffective. From the union’s perspective, it must try to cause as much disruption to the employer’s business as possible. Each side hopes to eventually force concessions that will result in a more favourable agreement.”
The employer is perfectly entitled to continue to operate its business during a strike, and to hire replacement workers if it sees fit;
If the employer exercises its right to carry on business, and hires replacement workers in order to do so, the union will do what it can to impede this; (EDIT: this case wasn't about a Sobeys, not York. If there is a provision in the contract that says 'no replacement workers', it would be illegal to hire them).
“A picket line that is merely expressive, without more, will do little to cause disruption to the employer’s business. It is not surprising, therefore, that picketers were attempting to delay people who wished to cross the picket line”;
“Peaceful picketing can accomplish the objective of causing delay just as effectively as violent picketing. All that is required is that people stand in front of vehicles seeking entry or exit. This is just as effective as putting up a fence" (note: at York we've been using safety barriers, which have been okay so far).
This case also cites another case that says "absent questions of property damage or personal injury, a robust society can accommodate some inconvenience as a corollary of the right to picket in a labour dispute".
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YorkU students have a choice not to cross the picket lines; once the labour disruption is over, faculty are forced to remediate missed time and reschedule examinations and labs for students.
YorkU Senate Policies protects OP from not crossing the picket line; if OP decides he wants to finish his semester on time, then that's his prerogative.
http://secretariat-policies.info.yo...isputes-or-other-causes-senate-policy-on-the/
2.2 Fairness to Students
Toronto Police are present at YorkU, I saw them at Shoreham & Pond just parked on the Rexall Centre sidewalk. They're monitoring the picket lines, but their presence seems to keep things quiet and peaceful.
Earlier when they weren't there, drivers were laying on their car horns, blocking intersection, cutting the line, yelling/shoving picketers. With TPS present, nobody so much as sounded a peep.
Why are the buses not crossing the picket lines? They're also union. Same reason why police aren't giving the picketers a hard time; unions respect each other's picket's line within bounds of reason. It's not surprising to see various union flags (ie. Steel Workers) join in solidarity with CUPE3903.
YorkU Senate Policies protects OP from not crossing the picket line; if OP decides he wants to finish his semester on time, then that's his prerogative.
http://secretariat-policies.info.yo...isputes-or-other-causes-senate-policy-on-the/
2.2 Fairness to Students
2.2.1 Students who do not participate in academic activities because:
2.2.2 Such remedies shall not alter the academic standards associated with the missed activity, nor shall it relieve the student of the responsibility for mastering materials covered.
2.2.3 The availability of a remedy under this policy does not guarantee students the same learning experience that they would have received in the absence of a Disruption.
a) they are unable to do so owing to a Disruption, or
b) they choose not to participate in academic activities owing to a strike or lock-out on campus
are entitled to immunity from penalty, to reasonable alternative access to materials covered in their absence, to reasonable extensions of deadlines and to such other remedy as Senate deems necessary and consistent with the principle of academic integrity.
b) they choose not to participate in academic activities owing to a strike or lock-out on campus
are entitled to immunity from penalty, to reasonable alternative access to materials covered in their absence, to reasonable extensions of deadlines and to such other remedy as Senate deems necessary and consistent with the principle of academic integrity.
2.2.2 Such remedies shall not alter the academic standards associated with the missed activity, nor shall it relieve the student of the responsibility for mastering materials covered.
2.2.3 The availability of a remedy under this policy does not guarantee students the same learning experience that they would have received in the absence of a Disruption.
Toronto Police are present at YorkU, I saw them at Shoreham & Pond just parked on the Rexall Centre sidewalk. They're monitoring the picket lines, but their presence seems to keep things quiet and peaceful.
Earlier when they weren't there, drivers were laying on their car horns, blocking intersection, cutting the line, yelling/shoving picketers. With TPS present, nobody so much as sounded a peep.
Why are the buses not crossing the picket lines? They're also union. Same reason why police aren't giving the picketers a hard time; unions respect each other's picket's line within bounds of reason. It's not surprising to see various union flags (ie. Steel Workers) join in solidarity with CUPE3903.
DownUnder
Well-known member
This ^^ is why all unions should be shut down.
Alternatively, you can avoid picket lines by parking at Black Creek for free by Rexall Centre. Then it's a matter of campus walk.
I believe York is all private property.
I believe York is all private property.
Good attitude; then when your employer takes advantage of you by having you work and not paying for overtime make sure you complain. This can be legally done in Ontario by your employer having you sign a documents which you average your work hours over 2 weeks; you are allowed to work any combination of 88 hours in 2 weeks without being eligible for overtime. Good luck in working for the company if you refuse to sign the document.
DownUnder
Well-known member
If my employer did that I would just tell them to shove it and move on. I dont slack off at work or give them any reason not to treat me well. Unions are there just to protect lazy people. If I believe I deserve a raise I can go to my employer and try to negotiate something better. Compulsory union membership is the biggest load of crap ive seen in this country. Cash comes out of my pay each week to pay for lawyers to help retards that dont want to follow rules or work efficiently to stay employed.
Depends on what you do. I've worked in industry for almost 30 years, and I've seen the best and worst of unions. Health and safety wise, there is no better protection. I can't be bothered to list all the good unions have brought into the workplace, but until you've been told to crawl into an unknown, smelly confined space by some ignorant twat supervisor, you can go piss up on a rope.
No, actually those lazy people get fired and go back on the job waiting list. The people who produce stay employed... nothing is perfect but i use to work two jobs up to 90 hours a week just to barely scrap up 50K, no pension, no benefits, no overtime, CPP wont be there for me when i retire. Ive been working and paying into EI since i was 15 (30 now) and i never used it.
To get into my union (IBEW 353) its a pretty lengthy process (Application, physical test, IQ test, interviews + 1 year probation) if you have no experience. Of the 1000 people that applied when I did, they only took 110 .So they are doing their part to only get the cream of the crop, the issue is that when they take in a whole company they get ****** workers and good workers. And I know some of the guys I work with are amazing and some are idiots that drag their *****(they only last a short while and get sent back to the hall when the foreman doesnt need the extra hands on site).
This is my first experience with a union, but I dont see how helping the middle class workers(WHO DRIVE THE ECONOMY) have a good wage is a bad thing. The gov is was too big ans sucks way too much money out of us these days. If they break up unions we will all be working for peanuts and the economy will slow to a halt since nobody but the few rich ones will buy anything. Those few rich cannot support the economy, they can only buy so many beds and pillows etc etc vs the millions that will be broke as ****.
That's a nice social attitude on your part. Because someone is inconveniencing you, you are going to risk damaging their body or worse kill them. Fortunately for you using a motor-vehicle as a weapon (in our society) doesn't carry (for some unexplainable reason) the same consequence as using another type of weapon.
2motors
Well-known member
They shouldn't be in the middle of the road its illegal. They are clearly stupid.. Mommy taught me to not play on the road and look both ways before crossing. Dude if i was a dick id blow thru at speed I inched my way thru ...
Fixed.
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