Innocent until proven guilty? | GTAMotorcycle.com

Innocent until proven guilty?

nakkers

Well-known member
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With all the recent reports of sexual assault from government officials to celebrities, there sure seems to be an impact to the accused while, encouragement of others to step forward and report.

In one case of the MP that was kicked out the party, it seems like Italy have been a misunderstanding.

But the damage has been done.

I'm not defending the likes of Jian or Mr Cosby but, if they are innocent, it sure seems like a hell of mess.
 
With all the recent reports of sexual assault from government officials to celebrities, there sure seems to be an impact to the accused while, encouragement of others to step forward and report.

In one case of the MP that was kicked out the party, it seems like Italy have been a misunderstanding.

But the damage has been done.

I'm not defending the likes of Jian or Mr Cosby but, if they are innocent, it sure seems like a hell of mess.

The court of public opinion doesn't have the same rules as english common law courts. Outside of where english common law rules you quite often see napoleonic law where you are guilty until proven innocent. Jian and Cosby are lucky they live in areas that have english common law.
 
The court of public opinion doesn't have the same rules as english common law courts. Outside of where english common law rules you quite often see napoleonic law where you are guilty until proven innocent. Jian and Cosby are lucky they live in areas that have english common law.

The presumption of guilt predates the Napoleonic Code, which in fact brought far more fairness and justice to the citizenry than they had previously enjoyed. It unified the legal code for the country and removed the privilege of station from the Church, nobility, and prominent citizens, and provided for legal counsel for everyone.
"Guilty until proven innocent" isn't the most prominent feature of the Napoleonic Code nor is it as simplistic as it sounds, though unfortunately it's the one most often quoted.
As for the "court of public opinion", it's more the "court-of-public-opinion-fueled-by-social-and-other-media-and-driven-by-uninformed-prejudice-and-bandwagon-jumping". Accusations of sexual assault can never be recovered from, no matter how overwhelming the evidence may be that exonerates the accused. We have somehow turned 180 degrees from years ago and now accusations are enough to ruin a career and a life, even anonymous ones. We accept statements from alleged victims as gospel, even as they refuse to identify themselves, and woe to anyone who questions their validity.
As a 'bonus', the destruction of reputations has become a circus sideshow and fodder for countless Internet forums and TV shows, as so-called experts weigh in without having any personal interest or involvement. The public hysteria builds until the accused has suffered a de facto lynching, facts and due process be damned.
Compared to all that, the "guilty until proven innocent" model of pre-Internet days, however misunderstood, seems positively benign.
 
The presumption of guilt predates the Napoleonic Code, which in fact brought far more fairness and justice to the citizenry than they had previously enjoyed. It unified the legal code for the country and removed the privilege of station from the Church, nobility, and prominent citizens, and provided for legal counsel for everyone.
"Guilty until proven innocent" isn't the most prominent feature of the Napoleonic Code nor is it as simplistic as it sounds, though unfortunately it's the one most often quoted.
As for the "court of public opinion", it's more the "court-of-public-opinion-fueled-by-social-and-other-media-and-driven-by-uninformed-prejudice-and-bandwagon-jumping". Accusations of sexual assault can never be recovered from, no matter how overwhelming the evidence may be that exonerates the accused. We have somehow turned 180 degrees from years ago and now accusations are enough to ruin a career and a life, even anonymous ones. We accept statements from alleged victims as gospel, even as they refuse to identify themselves, and woe to anyone who questions their validity.
As a 'bonus', the destruction of reputations has become a circus sideshow and fodder for countless Internet forums and TV shows, as so-called experts weigh in without having any personal interest or involvement. The public hysteria builds until the accused has suffered a de facto lynching, facts and due process be damned.
Compared to all that, the "guilty until proven innocent" model of pre-Internet days, however misunderstood, seems positively benign.

Very well put, the good old "Where's there's smoke there's fire". The other sides of the coins are the legitimate charges where the victims get treated worse by the system than by the original perpetrator.

The psychological damage in both situations is immeasurable. Very few write their memoirs, make a bundle and move on with their lives.
 
Life is not fair. Just throwing it out here.
 
Very well put, the good old "Where's there's smoke there's fire". The other sides of the coins are the legitimate charges where the victims get treated worse by the system than by the original perpetrator.

The psychological damage in both situations is immeasurable. Very few write their memoirs, make a bundle and move on with their lives.

Agreed, hence my stating we've turned 180 degrees. Neither model serves justice and both are agravated by the Internet lynch mobs and the mainstream media. One exists to feed the egos of those who would otherwise never be accorded attention and the other exists to make money.
Ideally we would have a society wherein victims could confidently accuse their assailants and the accused could defend themselves with fact and law. Unfortunately we pay heed to the chattering classes and political expediency has trumped due process. Witness Trudeau the Lesser's swift action against two of his MPs, based on anonymous accusations. In his haste to appear sensitive and proactive and on the side of the angels, two women who wished to remain anonymous are being beseiged to reveal themselves and two men have had their reputations forever tarnished and their livlihoods impacted without once having the opportunity to defend themselves. The Dauphin screwed up royaly, dissatisfying everyone involved, save the most rabid feminists who regard every man as a rapist anyway.
 
The presumption of guilt predates the Napoleonic Code, which in fact brought far more fairness and justice to the citizenry than they had previously enjoyed. It unified the legal code for the country and removed the privilege of station from the Church, nobility, and prominent citizens, and provided for legal counsel for everyone.
"Guilty until proven innocent" isn't the most prominent feature of the Napoleonic Code nor is it as simplistic as it sounds, though unfortunately it's the one most often quoted.
As for the "court of public opinion", it's more the "court-of-public-opinion-fueled-by-social-and-other-media-and-driven-by-uninformed-prejudice-and-bandwagon-jumping". Accusations of sexual assault can never be recovered from, no matter how overwhelming the evidence may be that exonerates the accused. We have somehow turned 180 degrees from years ago and now accusations are enough to ruin a career and a life, even anonymous ones. We accept statements from alleged victims as gospel, even as they refuse to identify themselves, and woe to anyone who questions their validity.
As a 'bonus', the destruction of reputations has become a circus sideshow and fodder for countless Internet forums and TV shows, as so-called experts weigh in without having any personal interest or involvement. The public hysteria builds until the accused has suffered a de facto lynching, facts and due process be damned.
Compared to all that, the "guilty until proven innocent" model of pre-Internet days, however misunderstood, seems positively benign.

Well stated.
 
People are starting to get the recognition they deserve around here. Kudos to you. Well done.
well done to you as well.

/sarcasm


Is top bad this forum isn't like redflagdeals where users can " like" another users post. I wonder how many posters would have 1000 posts and 0 likes. Lol
 
You can always proclaim your innocence by launching a ridiculous lawsuit

The POS should take a few dickslaps in the face for that alone
 
Well, you can be a rapist and still be admired later on. Mike Tyson?

So I guess is sucks for a little bit. Give it a few years and then come back and all is forgiven. No?
 
well done to you as well.

/sarcasm


Is top bad this forum isn't like redflagdeals where users can " like" another users post. I wonder how many posters would have 1000 posts and 0 likes. Lol

We briefly had a rep system, actually
 
Is top bad this forum isn't like redflagdeals where users can " like" another users post. I wonder how many posters would have 1000 posts and 0 likes. Lol

While incredibly pragmatic it would also provide oodles of entertainment. We could figure out everybodys' post/likes ratio and plot a graph. And then plot the butthurt and maybe a commentary section. That's just one idea. No pun intended.
 
While incredibly pragmatic it would also provide oodles of entertainment. We could figure out everybodys' post/likes ratio and plot a graph. And then plot the butthurt and maybe a commentary section. That's just one idea. No pun intended.


I'm dying. LMAO

33e.jpg
 
well done to you as well.

/sarcasm


Is top bad this forum isn't like redflagdeals where users can " like" another users post. I wonder how many posters would have 1000 posts and 0 likes. Lol


I'm almost there.
 

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