Loud Vehicle Legislation Across Canada | Page 6 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Loud Vehicle Legislation Across Canada

Forum Sponsor
Rob MacLennan said:
With large equipment you need to move a certain amount of air, which means exhaust, to generate a given amount of power. I believe that someone already commented on this, up thread, with respect to transport trucks. Same principle.
Click to expand...

That wasn't my question. I could show you a 2500kw diesel generator with a hypercritical muffler that puts out less noise than a backhoe with 1/8 the engine size and power. My question was about leaning on the manufacturers to stop selling 100+db pipes. Right now all they have done is slapped "for closed course use only" on the whole catalogue.
 
Buzzomatic said:
The easier, cheaper solution is to take these 100db pipes off the market before wasting the cops (expensive) time with enforcement.
Click to expand...

And how do you propose to do *that*?

In Europe, anything you do to your vehicle has to be accompanied by "the certificate". Every part that serves any function which is even remotely related to the vehicle's compliance with any mandatory standard. Want to change the exhaust system? The new one had better be "e-marked", and that means both noise and emissions - no catalyst removal allowed, if it came with one, it has to be there and it has to work. Want to change the turn signals? No crappy dim LEDs allowed. No "integrated" turn signals with insufficient brightness, insufficient separation between left and right signals, etc. It all has to have the applicable "e-marking" and/or the applicable documentation from the manufacturer stating that it conforms to applicable standards. And you have to bring the vehicle in for inspection every year or two to the MoT (UK) or TuV (Germany) and they check all that stuff. No forging e-markings, either - they'll ask for the documentation. Don't have it? you fail. Faked documentation? Doesn't work - you fail. "Made in China" parts with declarations of conformity worth exactly what the piece of paper that they are printed on is worth? FAIL and they'll go after anyone selling that stuff in the market. Put all your "good" parts on to pass TuV then take it off right after? The "polizei" know the difference, they'll pull you over and do a roadside inspection. Fail.

This does have the effect of keeping a lot of aftermarket garbage off the market, but it is a hassle, and it certainly limits one's freedom of expression when it comes to customizing your bike. There is a presumption that the vehicle's original manufacturer knows best - you're not even allowed to use tire sizes different from what the manufacturer prescribes. All of the motorcycles that I saw on the road in Germany were completely stock.

I don't think you want to go down that road. I sure don't.
 
Buzzomatic said:
That wasn't my question. I could show you a 2500kw diesel generator with a hypercritical muffler that puts out less noise than a backhoe with 1/8 the engine size and power. My question was about leaning on the manufacturers to stop selling 100+db pipes. Right now all they have done is slapped "for closed course use only" on the whole catalogue.
Click to expand...

A meaningless comparison. Show me two pieces of equipment that are meant for the same task, that have the same specifications, but one puts out a fraction of the noise.

And if the product in question is actually meant for closed course use? Manufacturers of vehicles already need to meet certain standards. It falls to the purchaser to not modify them in a way that no longer meets those standards.
 
Brian P said:
And how do you propose to do *that*?

In Europe, anything you do to your vehicle has to be accompanied by "the certificate". Every part that serves any function which is even remotely related to the vehicle's compliance with any mandatory standard. Want to change the exhaust system? The new one had better be "e-marked", and that means both noise and emissions - no catalyst removal allowed, if it came with one, it has to be there and it has to work. Want to change the turn signals? No crappy dim LEDs allowed. No "integrated" turn signals with insufficient brightness, insufficient separation between left and right signals, etc. It all has to have the applicable "e-marking" and/or the applicable documentation from the manufacturer stating that it conforms to applicable standards. And you have to bring the vehicle in for inspection every year or two to the MoT (UK) or TuV (Germany) and they check all that stuff. No forging e-markings, either - they'll ask for the documentation. Don't have it? you fail. Faked documentation? Doesn't work - you fail. "Made in China" parts with declarations of conformity worth exactly what the piece of paper that they are printed on is worth? FAIL and they'll go after anyone selling that stuff in the market. Put all your "good" parts on to pass TuV then take it off right after? The "polizei" know the difference, they'll pull you over and do a roadside inspection. Fail.

This does have the effect of keeping a lot of aftermarket garbage off the market, but it is a hassle, and it certainly limits one's freedom of expression when it comes to customizing your bike. There is a presumption that the vehicle's original manufacturer knows best - you're not even allowed to use tire sizes different from what the manufacturer prescribes. All of the motorcycles that I saw on the road in Germany were completely stock.

I don't think you want to go down that road. I sure don't.
Click to expand...

Whoa, you got pretty far down that road in a hurry, friend. Does drive clean test your headlights for lumen output? Your tire size? I think a measured response is possible here in Canada without going off the deep end. Is that what they did in California, the home of the free :)
 
Last edited:
Rob MacLennan said:
A meaningless comparison. Show me two pieces of equipment that are meant for the same task, that have the same specifications, but one puts out a fraction of the noise.

And if the product in question is actually meant for closed course use? Manufacturers of vehicles already need to meet certain standards. It falls to the purchaser to not modify them in a way that no longer meets those standards.
Click to expand...

If you knew more about it, you wouldn't say that. The sound ratings mandated by the MOE are what forced the Caterpillar's of the world to produce these quiet Gen-sets for use in populated areas of the province (most often hospitals). That never would have happened without gov intervention. It's all about money.
 
Buzzomatic said:
My exhaust is stock but I'm glad your "regular folk" now and not everyone. Too bad you can't see the big picture. The easier, cheaper solution is to take these 100db pipes off the market before wasting the cops (expensive) time with enforcement.
Click to expand...

No luck finding that M4 slip on? Maybe bump your WTB thingy again.
 
I think most of us on here Love the sound of a nascar coming out of the pits jamming thru the gears, or a corvette taking off from the lights. That's a good sound to me. A good set up with upgrades to the engine, as well as intake and exhaust sounds great on any bike. Its all on the individual rider and how he handles what he has. Its the guys who are too cheap to do things correctly and take the baffles out of the pipes or modify their ricers to sound like a 45hp sewing machine warming up. I live off of 15 SR and every sunny day I am home I can hear bikers having fun on this lovely stretch of road. The majority of what I hear is the high screaming sport bikes that are coming out of the S-turns winding them up. I do hear the odd HD without baffles but not many. Its the higher frequency sounds of sport bikes that travel further and louder then the deeper sounding "Cruiser" type of bike. I am not saying its any one type of rider who is to blame. What I am saying is that its the ones who at idle are twisting their wrist to impress anyone within range. These are the ones that are ruining it for all of us. These are the ones that should be dealt with accordingly.
 
Buzzomatic said:
Ahhh, life in the black and white vacuum. As I stated in another post. I have a stock exhaust. I also never said loud pipes were acceptable. Read my posts again. I said I think this is the wrong solution. To bring up other sources of noise pollution is perfectly valid to show that motorcycles may be getting more attention than is fair. If you can't consider a wider argument that is your failing. The topic reads "Loud Vehicle Legislation Across Canada". I don't drive a truck but Two close friends do and they tell me the average rig could be putting out half the db's they currently do and engine braking is almost always a cost saving measure. I am an engineer and I can confidently tell you large construction equipment can produce far less noise with currently available technology. What is your pinion of trying to curb the problem at the manufacturer level first?
Click to expand...

I can only respond to the highlighted part: I have three tractors myself, and have been at it for 20 years...the new equipment IS much, much quieter and cleaner than the old, as per legislation. In fact, diesel refrigeration units and jake brakes are also drastically more quiet nowadays, and have been legislated as such. Very few (percentage wise) modify their diesels to be noisier, and it is usually very expensive and cost-prohibitive to do it. Jake-braking in Ontario is largely useless, so I'd agree that truckers could use a slap for being ignorant about its use. Most of these clowns would never need it on our roads if they ever learned how to operate their equipment properly, but that's for another topic. There is no measurable cost-saving for using an engine exhaust brake.
 
Buzzomatic said:
If you knew more about it, you wouldn't say that. The sound ratings mandated by the MOE are what forced the Caterpillar's of the world to produce these quiet Gen-sets for use in populated areas of the province (most often hospitals). That never would have happened without gov intervention. It's all about money.
Click to expand...

So what you're saying is that government mandated noise standards and then enforced them. How is this different from the current situation with motorcycles? I'll tell you how; because motorcyclists choose to make their equipment annoyingly loud, as I previously stated, in contravention of regulations. Those who cannot self regulate, will be regulated.
 
CafeRay said:
Those guys on the SS bikes fall of that same cloverleaf at night. You can hear the redline shifts, then the sound of scraping plastic, next morning the roadside is littered with scraped "ONDA" and "MAHA" and "UKI" and "ASAKI" plastics. I should start a tree of shame, like TOTD.

The slightly smarter hooligans have figured out they can get way with more with quiet pipes.
Click to expand...

Nicely put together :lmao:
How come no "CATI" or "RILIA" pieces ever found?
 
AL3RT said:
Nicely put together :lmao:
How come no "CATI" or "RILIA" pieces ever found?
Click to expand...

You kidding me? With how much those cost, I'm picking up all the pieces! lol
 
CafeRay said:
The number of these bikes I see dumped on the 403W/Linc on/off-ramps every weekend is pretty comical. Hamilton's Tail of the Gecko.
Click to expand...

Hahahah best comment that here in ages. Lmao! Tail of the gecko hehheh
 
Gary64 said:
+1. You draw way less negative attention to hooligan riding with quiet pipes.
Click to expand...

And a vanilla paint job and hard cases give additional 15-20km/h grace.
 
I never bothered to replace the stock pipe, looks ugly but kinda like the quiet inline 4 sound until I listened to the orchestra of Ape V4 engine. Boy that bike sounds loud in a beautiful way, no inline 4 with after market pipe can beat that.
Forum Sponsor
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom