Failing to stop | GTAMotorcycle.com

Failing to stop

Bike Cop

Bike Cop

Well-known member
Forum Sponsor
I was going to post this on one of the other threads, but I thought it would be better if it had it's own.

From what I've seen, if a motorcyclist wants to run from the police, they will, and they will get away. They are faster than anything the police have, except for a radio, but we don't always have another car waiting ahead. If a rider is 100% committed to running, they are gone.

Last year I tried to stop a young man on an R6 who was cornered on a dead end road. We squared off and he rode right past me to get back to the highway, where he promptly took off at high speed. I didn't follow. Since I had some other investigative leads, I was able to show up at his house and the matter ended in criminal charges. One month later, he was followed by a police helicopter doing the same thing, and was arrested again, this time held for bail. He wasn't a bad kid but definitely made some bad choices. I would tend to think that most officers see someone that runs as someone who has a real reason to run, ie. stolen bike, wanted person, etc. The real danger that I'm seeing is that motorcyclists are running for much smaller reasons, and are either risking their own safety or other people's, in their escape.

Can we blame 172 for all of this? Would those that chose to run for a 172 charge run for a plate infraction? Would you run because your insurance slip was out of date? Where is the line in the sand that makes you decide not to stop for police?
 
I think this issue is a matter of brain development. In males, the Prefrontal Cortex does not finish developing on average until mid-twenties.

"This brain region has been implicated in planning complex cognitive behavior, personality expression, decision making, and moderating social behavior.The basic activity of this brain region is considered to be orchestration of thoughts and actions in accordance with internal goals.

The most typical psychological term for functions carried out by the prefrontal cortex area is executive function. Executive function relates to abilities to differentiate among conflicting thoughts, determine good and bad, better and best, same and different, future consequences of current activities, working toward a defined goal, prediction of outcomes, expectation based on actions, and social "control" (the ability to suppress urges that, if not suppressed, could lead to socially unacceptable outcomes)."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prefrontal_cortex
 
Bike Cop said:
I was going to post this on one of the other threads, but I thought it would be better if it had it's own.

From what I've seen, if a motorcyclist wants to run from the police, they will, and they will get away. They are faster than anything the police have, except for a radio, but we don't always have another car waiting ahead. If a rider is 100% committed to running, they are gone.

Last year I tried to stop a young man on an R6 who was cornered on a dead end road. We squared off and he rode right past me to get back to the highway, where he promptly took off at high speed. I didn't follow. Since I had some other investigative leads, I was able to show up at his house and the matter ended in criminal charges. One month later, he was followed by a police helicopter doing the same thing, and was arrested again, this time held for bail. He wasn't a bad kid but definitely made some bad choices. I would tend to think that most officers see someone that runs as someone who has a real reason to run, ie. stolen bike, wanted person, etc. The real danger that I'm seeing is that motorcyclists are running for much smaller reasons, and are either risking their own safety or other people's, in their escape.

Can we blame 172 for all of this? Would those that chose to run for a 172 charge run for a plate infraction? Would you run because your insurance slip was out of date? Where is the line in the sand that makes you decide not to stop for police?
Click to expand...



There will always be idiots out there my friend. Either on foot or motorcycle. If they run, they put their lives and others in their hands.
I have no sympathy for them. Feel free to take them off the road to make it safer for all us other responsible riders.

D
 
I'm a bit of an expert on the topic, I've seen almost every episode of COPS. When asked why they ran, the usual answer is "I was scared".
 
DECIMIS said:
I think this issue is a matter of brain development. In males, the Prefrontal Cortex does not finish developing on average until mid-twenties.

"This brain region has been implicated in planning complex cognitive behavior, personality expression, decision making, and moderating social behavior.The basic activity of this brain region is considered to be orchestration of thoughts and actions in accordance with internal goals.

The most typical psychological term for functions carried out by the prefrontal cortex area is executive function. Executive function relates to abilities to differentiate among conflicting thoughts, determine good and bad, better and best, same and different, future consequences of current activities, working toward a defined goal, prediction of outcomes, expectation based on actions, and social "control" (the ability to suppress urges that, if not suppressed, could lead to socially unacceptable outcomes)."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prefrontal_cortex
Click to expand...

Yep. Which is why crime rates peaked with the demographic bump of 18 to 25 year old in the 70s.

from a neurological standpoint, letting people drive at all below 25 makes no sense.
 
mikbusa said:
I'm a bit of an expert on the topic, I've seen almost every episode of COPS.
Click to expand...

CafeRay said:
Yep. Which is why crime rates peaked with the demographic bump of 18 to 25 year old in the 70s.

from a neurological standpoint, letting people drive at all below 25 makes no sense.
Click to expand...

That's why major life decisions like getting tats or whether or not to wear a shirt on a crime spree should be put off. It's not like making babies which can be done at any time.
 
Bike Cop said:
Can we blame 172 for all of this? Would those that chose to run for a 172 charge run for a plate infraction? Would you run because your insurance slip was out of date? Where is the line in the sand that makes you decide not to stop for police?
Click to expand...

The "stunt driving" law - and the observed/perceived tendency for cops to trump up charges in the case of those "smaller reasons" - is certainly not all of what's behind running from the cops, but it has to be a substantial portion.

Excessive insurance premiums is the other big factor; that's likely why riders took off prior to "stunt driving", then that law just compounded matters.

When penalties become excessive, to the point of being seriously life-altering - "If I'm going to go down, I'm going down fighting". To someone older, or maybe to the rich lawyers who wrote that legislation, the prospect of this situation costing $2000 - $10,000 might be manageable, but to a young person on a $12 per hour job who is paying $1000 a month in rent, nevermind what the bike and the insurance cost - it is seriously life-altering. That there is a cost because of the towing and impound that is unrecoverable even if the case is dismissed in court is the part that really burns me up about that law.

I know of people my age (shall we say, "mature", and leave it at that) who have evaded the cops because they were concerned that the situation could be a stunt-driving charge. We are not talking about young kids here ... we could be talking about the fathers of those young kids.

I won't answer your last question, but I think you are smart enough to connect the dots.
 
First of all there are people who will run for anything. They can, have, and it's cheaper to get a way with it. We really can't discuss those people.
Bike Cop said:
I would tend to think that most officers see someone that runs as someone who has a real reason to run, ie. stolen bike, wanted person, etc. The real danger that I'm seeing is that motorcyclists are running for much smaller reasons...
Click to expand...
can you see the disconnect, between officer and civilian?
cops see a runner and think stolen, robbery, murder, drugs, etc.
civilians see cherries and think, 172, i'll loose my job,i'll loose money,i'll loose custody of my kids, i'll be homeless, etc.

In my situation, if I loose my license, i can't work. Buses don't go to the places where i work. Taxis are too expensive to use everyday. Although an e-bike would be a solution (very time consuming).


Bike Cop said:
Where is the line in the sand that makes you decide not to stop for police?
Click to expand...
I have never run before. I've never been in a position to have to choose, but i think for me, it would be 172.

'Did i do anything that could qualify for 172?' (excessive lane changes,impression of speed,did my wheel come off the ground recently?, did my tire make a sequel noise recently?, did i go over a pot hole and stand on the pegs to help absorb the shock?, etc,etc)
no = pull over
yes = do the runner checklist [area knowledge, bike hp, traffic (more the better believe it or not ie: lane splitting), rider focus (ie:calm/controlled), my mood for the day (angry,chill,bored, etc) ]

And that's a lot to go over in my head before the cop has time to record my license plate. Also which police region i'm in comes into play. (halton cops = safe / windsor cops = run for your life / opp = 50/50)

I think the "line" would depend person to person. It would depend on their personal history.
 
Last edited:
Under 172, the "line" is wherever the officer says it is--a legal carte blanche. The officer and their discretion cannot be known prior to pulling over. This is the best case scenario for a mature, trained and insured rider. Think about that.
 
Last edited:
Bike Cop said:
...... Since I had some other investigative leads, I was able to show up at his house and the matter ended in criminal charges. ......
Click to expand...

Well exactly. Sometimes that just means you saw his plate long before trying to stop him. Then it doesn't matter how fast he runs.
 
johnp said:
Well exactly. Sometimes that just means you saw his plate long before trying to stop him. Then it doesn't matter how fast he runs.
Click to expand...


If he says has other means no reason not to beleive, man look at all the technology out there...
 
Sooo what ever happened to sgt maury bauer (if thats how you spell his name).

The corrupt cop who teamed up with tow trucks for some extra $$$ by slapping people with false HTA172's?

Seemed to have disappeared from google. Or maybe I spelled his name wrong (correct me if I'm wrong).
 
Last edited:
PLau said:
Sooo what ever happened to sgt maury bauer (if thats how you spell his name).

The corrupt cop who teamed up with tow trucks for some extra $$$ by slapping people with false HTA172's?

Seemed to have disappeared from google.
Click to expand...


We had a over aggessive tow truck driver in my area once, he was found one day with a few black eyes to say the least, a few of his victims got fed up with his sleazy tactics and taught him a lesson, before that people were being rippoffed by his aggressive and criminal tactics.
 
Last edited:
Elwoodpdowd said:
We had a over aggessive tow truck driver in my area once, he was found one day with a few black eyes to say the least, a few of his vitems got fed up with his tactics.....
Click to expand...

What does that have to do with what I said? lol
 
Bike Cop said:
From what I've seen, if a motorcyclist wants to run from the police, they will, and they will get away. They are faster than anything the police have, except for a radio, but we don't always have another car waiting ahead. If a rider is 100% committed to running, they are gone.
Click to expand...

Being one to not pay much attention to these matters I was actually shocked when receiving my last ticket. The young officer thanked and rewarded me for not running. He seemed quite serious about it. Seems, try as I might, I can't get a ticket more than 15km/h over. Altho couple weeks ago, save for flashing headlights, I'm sure my goose woulda been cooked.
 
Brian P said:
The "stunt driving" law - and the observed/perceived tendency for cops to trump up charges in the case of those "smaller reasons" - is certainly not all of what's behind running from the cops, but it has to be a substantial portion.

Excessive insurance premiums is the other big factor; that's likely why riders took off prior to "stunt driving", then that law just compounded matters.

When penalties become excessive, to the point of being seriously life-altering - "If I'm going to go down, I'm going down fighting". To someone older, or maybe to the rich lawyers who wrote that legislation, the prospect of this situation costing $2000 - $10,000 might be manageable, but to a young person on a $12 per hour job who is paying $1000 a month in rent, nevermind what the bike and the insurance cost - it is seriously life-altering. That there is a cost because of the towing and impound that is unrecoverable even if the case is dismissed in court is the part that really burns me up about that law.

I know of people my age (shall we say, "mature", and leave it at that) who have evaded the cops because they were concerned that the situation could be a stunt-driving charge. We are not talking about young kids here ... we could be talking about the fathers of those young kids.

I won't answer your last question, but I think you are smart enough to connect the dots.
Click to expand...

this is right on. Due to police pressure, the speeding laws are excessively criminalized, with a fine structure that exists not as a deterrent, but a justification for excessive police budgets.

The most dangerous behavior on Ontario roads is not policed. Any rider figures this out quickly and is left with little respect for traffic police.
 
inreb said:
I'm sure my goose woulda been cooked.
Click to expand...



While most wild ducks enjoy a good reputation, geese are undeservedly maligned as greasy, livery and tough. Yes, they can be all these things, but properly done, a wild goose (or a domestic, for that matter) is essentially a large duck. A normal wild goose, such as a Canada, Snow or Whitefront will feed four, while a small goose (Cackler, Aleutian or Ross’) will serve two heartily. A domestic goose or a Giant Canada (really any Canada larger than 10 pounds) can serve as many as six.
 
Last edited:
I would run if I knew my plate was either False(stolen) or able to hide before the cop was behind me. There is ZERO point in running if you know they saw your plate unless your wanted already just pull over. They will just as you did show up at the house.
Forum Sponsor
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom