Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
Sounds a bit light, but at least it was time.
Sounds a bit light, but at least it was time.
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Quebec Trial - Car Stops to help ducks, Motorcycle hits car (fatality)
- Thread starter DECIMIS
- Start date
VT1100
Well-known member
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
The more important part of that sentence is that she will be prohibited from driving for the next 10 years.
I agree with that whole-heartedly.
The more important part of that sentence is that she will be prohibited from driving for the next 10 years.
I agree with that whole-heartedly.
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
I haven't seen that. Do you have a reference?
*EDIT* Nevermind. Found it in The Sun. They say banned from driving for SIX years, not 10. I wonder if any of these "news outlets" have the actual story?
I haven't seen that. Do you have a reference?
*EDIT* Nevermind. Found it in The Sun. They say banned from driving for SIX years, not 10. I wonder if any of these "news outlets" have the actual story?
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VT1100
Well-known member
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
Post, CP24 and the star all say 10 years, 240 hours of community service and 90 day. Now I'm wondering who published the real story lol
Post, CP24 and the star all say 10 years, 240 hours of community service and 90 day. Now I'm wondering who published the real story lol
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
There are so many contributing factors to the deaths of the motorcycle riders, making this such a sad story. To me what makes this story even more sad is the belief of the driver of the stopped car that she didn't do anything wrong. She truly is an idiot and for that she really should be banned from driving for life!!!
There are so many contributing factors to the deaths of the motorcycle riders, making this such a sad story. To me what makes this story even more sad is the belief of the driver of the stopped car that she didn't do anything wrong. She truly is an idiot and for that she really should be banned from driving for life!!!
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
CBC article quotes her as wanting to say she is sorry and that she made a mistake. The elements of remorse and of acknowledging the mistake are there. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/emma-czornobaj-says-prison-is-not-where-she-belongs-1.2709133
A lifetime driving ban is too much for this simple act of stupidity which she will most probably never repeat again if permitted to drive again.
CBC article quotes her as wanting to say she is sorry and that she made a mistake. The elements of remorse and of acknowledging the mistake are there. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/emma-czornobaj-says-prison-is-not-where-she-belongs-1.2709133
A lifetime driving ban is too much for this simple act of stupidity which she will most probably never repeat again if permitted to drive again.
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Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
From what she states and how she states it in the article it seems that she feels that it wasn't a mistake to stop on the roadway. It wasn't an accident, she stopped on purpose. She may not have intended for people to die, but they did. Accept the responsibility of your actions and maybe I will believe that she learned something from this tragedy and that she won't repeat the mistake.
Driving is a privilege not a right. Why should she be able to drive in the future?
From what she states and how she states it in the article it seems that she feels that it wasn't a mistake to stop on the roadway. It wasn't an accident, she stopped on purpose. She may not have intended for people to die, but they did. Accept the responsibility of your actions and maybe I will believe that she learned something from this tragedy and that she won't repeat the mistake.
Driving is a privilege not a right. Why should she be able to drive in the future?
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Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
She acknowledges her mistake several times in the long interview video. Should she be making like Opus Dei and be scourging herself while she says it so you might believe her?
Punishment is supposed to serve multiple roles of punishment, denunciation, and both specific and general deterrence.
She has been roundly denounced. Her life has effectively been put in shambles for the last 4 years while the matter worked its way through the courts. Her life will continue to be severely affected and limited by her notoriety as a stupid person and by now having a criminal record. On top of that punishment comes a 90-day jail term, a multi-year license suspension, and the equivalent of 6 full work-weeks of community service .
How much more would you pile on to a young person with no prior criminal record and a clean driving record up to that point, for an act that while stupid was at least motivated out of well-meaning and not reckless adventure.
That was punishment. Some will say that 2 people died and you can't punish her enough for that. Those people will not be satisfied no matter what she gets. The thing I would be more interested in when determining the length of a driving ban is is, is she likely to do the same thing again? I don't think she would. If so, a lifetime driving ban is pointless and provides no protective effect for society.
She acknowledges her mistake several times in the long interview video. Should she be making like Opus Dei and be scourging herself while she says it so you might believe her?
Punishment is supposed to serve multiple roles of punishment, denunciation, and both specific and general deterrence.
She has been roundly denounced. Her life has effectively been put in shambles for the last 4 years while the matter worked its way through the courts. Her life will continue to be severely affected and limited by her notoriety as a stupid person and by now having a criminal record. On top of that punishment comes a 90-day jail term, a multi-year license suspension, and the equivalent of 6 full work-weeks of community service .
How much more would you pile on to a young person with no prior criminal record and a clean driving record up to that point, for an act that while stupid was at least motivated out of well-meaning and not reckless adventure.
That was punishment. Some will say that 2 people died and you can't punish her enough for that. Those people will not be satisfied no matter what she gets. The thing I would be more interested in when determining the length of a driving ban is is, is she likely to do the same thing again? I don't think she would. If so, a lifetime driving ban is pointless and provides no protective effect for society.
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
Kill her twice. Fair is fair.
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
She was found guilty of a criminal act. This is her punishment and given that 'dangerous operation of a vehicle causing death' can result in a a life sentence, I would say that she got off fairly light. Instead of spending the rest of her life in prison she just needs to find alternate transportation, spend a little time in a jail rather than prison, and do some community service. She is also appealing the sentence and might receive a new trial, in which there is a possibility of a much worse sentence if she's convicted again.
She was found guilty of a criminal act. This is her punishment and given that 'dangerous operation of a vehicle causing death' can result in a a life sentence, I would say that she got off fairly light. Instead of spending the rest of her life in prison she just needs to find alternate transportation, spend a little time in a jail rather than prison, and do some community service. She is also appealing the sentence and might receive a new trial, in which there is a possibility of a much worse sentence if she's convicted again.
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
Yes, she is appealing. The Crown had asked for a 5-year driving ban at the original sentencing. That and the rest of what she was sentenced to would have been adequate for an act of passive stupidity. Save the harsher punishments for those who arrive by their convictions through more overt acts of reckless personal adventurism.
Yes, she is appealing. The Crown had asked for a 5-year driving ban at the original sentencing. That and the rest of what she was sentenced to would have been adequate for an act of passive stupidity. Save the harsher punishments for those who arrive by their convictions through more overt acts of reckless personal adventurism.
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
Given the results of the incident and the charge that she was found guilty of, I disagree. It's not 'passive stupidity', it's active negligence.
Given the results of the incident and the charge that she was found guilty of, I disagree. It's not 'passive stupidity', it's active negligence.
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
In this province and country where life without a car is not a small problem (it will most likely severely impact her future jobs ....), she would have been wise to negotiate a short real jail time in exchange for much shorter driving ban with some mandatory re-training for x amount of years. I wonder whether the crown knew what they were doing, insisting on the driving ban ...
In my opinion, the driving is the most significant part of the sentencing, even if she got a light jail time.
Why they don't punish repeated drunks this way, is what keeps me wondering? Never heard of lifetime ban imposed on anyone before ....
In this province and country where life without a car is not a small problem (it will most likely severely impact her future jobs ....), she would have been wise to negotiate a short real jail time in exchange for much shorter driving ban with some mandatory re-training for x amount of years. I wonder whether the crown knew what they were doing, insisting on the driving ban ...
In my opinion, the driving is the most significant part of the sentencing, even if she got a light jail time.
Why they don't punish repeated drunks this way, is what keeps me wondering? Never heard of lifetime ban imposed on anyone before ....
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
Yep, there's a reason they hand out licenses like candy; we need them to get jobs and be productive, pay taxes and maintain the lavish lifestyles of our benevolent overlords (OK that last bit was a little over the top).
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
Off the top of my head I can think of one case in which someone who was a repeat impaired driver, not a Canadian citizen, and was fighting a deportation order was under a lifetime driving ban.
And the case we're talking about happened in Quebec. Are you in Quebec?
Off the top of my head I can think of one case in which someone who was a repeat impaired driver, not a Canadian citizen, and was fighting a deportation order was under a lifetime driving ban.
And the case we're talking about happened in Quebec. Are you in Quebec?
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Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
I wonder what percentage of the Canadian population is of the same mind set of Duck Lady, suffering from a form of target fixation. See a situation and react without thinking about the consequences.
Denial seems to run in the family. DL's mother says there is something wrong with the law because her daughter was charged. I wonder if her opinion would be different if it was her daughter in the coffin.
Doing a little soul searching I wonder if each of us has a Target fixation trigger that would cause us to make a similarly hazardous decision.
The texter sitting at a green light oblivious to the light change.
Swerving to avoid someone doing a fast lane change without first doing a safety check.
If a hot babe flashed her boobs how many guys would ignore the road and for how long?
Someone reads the billboards along the Gardiner.
I fear that we are, as a population, far too assumptive.
The chances of DL killing another person while stopping for ducks is highly unlikely but she will find another way of doing it through her assumptive attitude. How do we force people to think proactively?
I wonder what percentage of the Canadian population is of the same mind set of Duck Lady, suffering from a form of target fixation. See a situation and react without thinking about the consequences.
Denial seems to run in the family. DL's mother says there is something wrong with the law because her daughter was charged. I wonder if her opinion would be different if it was her daughter in the coffin.
Doing a little soul searching I wonder if each of us has a Target fixation trigger that would cause us to make a similarly hazardous decision.
The texter sitting at a green light oblivious to the light change.
Swerving to avoid someone doing a fast lane change without first doing a safety check.
If a hot babe flashed her boobs how many guys would ignore the road and for how long?
Someone reads the billboards along the Gardiner.
I fear that we are, as a population, far too assumptive.
The chances of DL killing another person while stopping for ducks is highly unlikely but she will find another way of doing it through her assumptive attitude. How do we force people to think proactively?
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
Maybe enough people being appropriately penalized for doing negligent things, that result in injury and death, will finally make people wake up and pay appropriate attention to the two tonne missiles that they're navigating?
Maybe enough people being appropriately penalized for doing negligent things, that result in injury and death, will finally make people wake up and pay appropriate attention to the two tonne missiles that they're navigating?
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
That's more reactive.
Proactively, better MANDATORY driver training or better (read; Harder) driving tests. All easier said than done, and has to get past the bean counters, but until something changes from the beginning, it won't help in the long haul.
That's more reactive.
Proactively, better MANDATORY driver training or better (read; Harder) driving tests. All easier said than done, and has to get past the bean counters, but until something changes from the beginning, it won't help in the long haul.
Re: I belive there should be no mitigating factors as a 16yr girl is dead
Or the 1/4 ton missile.
Or the 1/4 ton missile.
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