Why did I get a ticket? | Page 3 | GTAMotorcycle.com

Why did I get a ticket?

I actually looked it up. It's a grey area. Some places say it's legal, others say it's illegal.



I corrected myself in a previous post.

If it's a separate lane, that cars just happen to be parked in, then it's legal. If it's just an extra wide lane with parking on the side, then it's lane splitting and illegal, except under very specific circumstances.
 
Because he said he will bring my papers to me after he cleared the accident and spoke with witnesses, I'm assuming he did not go for dinner while he had my wallet!

Well they weren't shooting the breeze and having a coffee. I guess you have experience in:

-Traffic control
-Towing two vehicles, the bike needs flat bed, maybe car too
-waiting for debris swept, absorb-all for engine fluids
-Completing a traffic report, with diagram
-taking a statement from a driver
-witnesses statements
-writing PON's

All of this would be related to your call alone. Additional time added on if the officer conducted traffic stops on way to hospital.....

I'm sure your right though, the officer was building report and making friends....
 
If under the elaw fault determination, the accident was not his fault but he still got a ticket from the police; according to insurance is it still his fault?

From my understanding insurance will only state its not your fault if you provide a transcript.
 
If under the elaw fault determination, the accident was not his fault but he still got a ticket from the police; according to insurance is it still his fault?

From my understanding insurance will only state its not your fault if you provide a transcript.

Insurance will determine fault using the Rules of Fault Determination, which can be found on the FSCO website. If a driver was ignoring a sign at the time of a collision, or exceeding the speed limit by more than 15 Kmh, then those are stated reasons why fault might be determined differently. They don't really care much about the legal implications. I was once broadsided by a driver who was traveling on the wrong side of the road and coming up behind me when he did it, which police said was reason to charge with careless, but insurance found me to be 50% at fault.
 
Well they weren't shooting the breeze and having a coffee. I guess you have experience in:

-Traffic control
-Towing two vehicles, the bike needs flat bed, maybe car too
-waiting for debris swept, absorb-all for engine fluids
-Completing a traffic report, with diagram
-taking a statement from a driver
-witnesses statements
-writing PON's

All of this would be related to your call alone. Additional time added on if the officer conducted traffic stops on way to hospital.....

I'm sure your right though, the officer was building report and making friends....

Of course I don't know that as a fact! Just that I am being totally screwed and I did not do anything wrong, unless driving straight in my lane is wrong!

What reason would be there for this cop to give me a ticket for something I did not do (passing)?

He obviously has empathy for the cager as he did not give him a careless and gave me an un warranted ticket.

Thanks for your insight
 
I was going East on Danforth in the curb lane between the parked cars and the dividing line to the inside lane.
If it's a separate lane, that cars just happen to be parked in, then it's legal. If it's just an extra wide lane with parking on the side, then it's lane splitting and illegal, except under very specific circumstances.
It seems that krakkt was riding on L2 in a defensive position, and there were vehicles on L1 in a parked position.



In terms of insurance the other left-turning party is 100% at-fault for the accident. I've seen people try due diligence defenses against red light runners and speeders and they never work. Courts want you to wait at the middle of the intersection and anticipate red light runners and speeders.

I would not worry too much about the ticket you received; you can easily fight that ticket, especially because you have a due diligence defense. I don't know why the cop complicated everyone's day, because now you and the independent witnesses have to appear in court to convict the left turning driver; and the other driver + independent witnesses will now have to appear in court to convict you for the alleged "improper pass".

I've been to court for two careless driving charges, where I was a witness; the officers never showed for both, but because I appeared the defendants all pleaded to reduced charges: "failed to turn left to avoid collision".

@krakkt can you give us a google-streetview link of where it happened? maybe use paint to show where your bike, parked cars and left turning car was?
 
Hey,

Thank you, That is exactly how it happened but the turning car ended up in my lane with me attached to the front right tire.

It happened on Danforth ave. at Hampton ave.

The camera is pointing south.

Also, I absolutely will go to court, as the cop let the guy off easy as he said not giving him a careless.

Does he need to be charged if I want to sue him for my injuries?

I'm certain the witnesses know what happened exactly as I have explained. I hope!

Any other comments are welcome.

Thanks again
 
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i would retain a personal injury lawyer ASAP! you don't pay them unless they win money for you; usually they take 20-30% of w/e they win for you; the injury firms also assist you with getting income replacement and physiotherapy coverage, when your insurance company denies it; you're definitely eligible for third-party tort claim, where you can sue the left-turn party outside of insurance

from your injuries, you're seriously looking at somewhere near the million mark from insurance and wiping the left-turn guy's assets clean.

I wouldn't get too upset about how the other driver was charged; even if he was charged Careless, the courts would have reduced it to an alternate charge like "lane change without safety"; he's guaranteed a conviction aslong as witnesses appear in court

he doesn't have to be charged for you to sue him; police opinion on the matter is negligible, they look at fault determination rules and in that respect, you're 0% at-fault

you have a very good chance to fight the ticket on your own, as a matter of fact... i'd even suggest an early-attendance meeting + officer's disclosure notes, and speaking to the prosecutor about what happened; you maybe able to get it dropped then... if the prosecutor doesn't budge, then you may have to retain a paralegal/lawyer... just make sure they're not x-copper or the plea-bargain groupies

re-opening a conviction is actually quite difficult, because your counsel has to prove that the justice of peace erred in law or that the proceedings were somehow compromised
 
As Rob has stated, insurance doesn't really care about the legal aspect of fault as they have their own fault chart system.


You can fight and win legally but, the insurance company may still find you partly at fault which can affect what coverages you can claim for and your premium at renewal. You can escalate to the insurance obudsman but, I think you are facing a bit of a long up hill battle.


The ticket certainly doesn't help so, it's worth fighting.


The vehicle making a left turn crossing into your lane needs to proceed with slow caution as they should be on the look out for moving traffic from the curb lane.

Good luck!!!!
 
油井緋色;2005657 said:
I think you are wrong.

Insurance determines fault based solely on their own fault determination rules....

If the other driver is at fault, his insurance must cover for all damages done to the OP.

It's funny how many people don't know this; It has little or nothing to do with what the cops say, it's the insurance company that decides fault. Fight the ticket anyway, it sounds like B.S. but you'll have to find out from the insurance company if they've deemed him at fault (which from your description sounds plausible). If they do, you're covered.
 
Hey,

That's great stuff, I feel better on so many levels (not the physical one though).

All the replies have been really helpful and I will take your advice.

I'll update this topic when I know something new

I'm in the middle of a lawsuit from an accident 2.5 years ago where my injuries were 10X worse, still waiting on that one.

It's here if you care to read about it.
http://www.gtamotorcycle.com/archiv...-torte-case&highlight=crap+lawyers+torte+case

My lawyer does not want to open a new case because he is saying it may have a negative impact on the first and much bigger one. I'm ok doing whatever he thinks best.

Thanks people :)
 
If you we're driving in the curb lane while there was on street parking then you were not legally in a lane. Lane "splitting," or lane "sharing" is not only illegal, but also very unsafe.
 
If you we're driving in the curb lane while there was on street parking then you were not legally in a lane. Lane "splitting," or lane "sharing" is not only illegal, but also very unsafe.

It is perfectly legal to ride in the parking lane provided there is enough space to safely do it.

Sent from my SH-02E using Tapatalk 2
 
It is perfectly legal to ride in the parking lane provided there is enough space to safely do it.

Sent from my SH-02E using Tapatalk 2

Not if it's actually a specific parking lane but if it's a lane that also happens to have cars parked in it, generally a lane that is oversized in order to accommodate the cars, then it's fine.
 
Not if it's actually a specific parking lane but if it's a lane that also happens to have cars parked in it, generally a lane that is oversized in order to accommodate the cars, then it's fine.

Ah ok, so on danforth/bloor and some parts of Eglinton I am ok?

Sent from my SH-02E using Tapatalk 2
 
It is perfectly legal to ride in the parking lane provided there is enough space to safely do it.

Sent from my SH-02E using Tapatalk 2

Wrong.

"The only time you may drive on the right shoulder of the road is to pass a vehicle turning left, and then only if the shoulder is paved. You may not pass on the left shoulder, whether it is paved or not."

MTO.gov.on.ca handbook.


Although there is no legal provision for or against lane splitting, it is strongly advised that you do not do it. If you are seen doing it, it is at the officer's discretion to decide whether you were driving safely or dangerously. Hint hint nudge nudge. What do you think they will say?
 
Ah ok, so on danforth/bloor and some parts of Eglinton I am ok?

Sent from my SH-02E using Tapatalk 2

I would say so. Also Yonge Street, north of Lawrence, where the road starts to narrow down. Just be careful of the "door prize."
 
Wrong.

"The only time you may drive on the right shoulder of the road is to pass a vehicle turning left, and then only if the shoulder is paved. You may not pass on the left shoulder, whether it is paved or not."

MTO.gov.on.ca handbook.

He wasn't talking about the shoulder.
 
HTA

Driving off roadway prohibited

(2) No driver of a motor vehicle shall overtake and pass another vehicle by driving off the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 150 (2).


Parking lanes are not part of the 'road way' as they are not "designed or ordinarily used for vehicular traffic". They're used to stop in, not drive in.
 
HTA

Driving off roadway prohibited

(2) No driver of a motor vehicle shall overtake and pass another vehicle by driving off the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 150 (2).


Parking lanes are not part of the 'road way' as they are not "designed or ordinarily used for vehicular traffic". They're used to stop in, not drive in.

Please read my posts above. Kthanksbye ;)
 

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