Let N00bs Learn the Hard Way

[Jayv]

From the bikes crashes I have seen through my life. ALL the bikes involved were 600CC and up. Not once have I seen a 500 CC or less in a crash. That's just from my observation.

You haven't been around enough.

[Geeser]

While there is a lot of appeal to the lone wolf mentality (don't tell me what to do, I won't tell you what to do, etc.), in the end we're only hurting ourselves collectively. Safer riders = fewer accidents = lower insurance + happier family members + less police harrassment. A bunch of bicyclists get organized and convince the city to shut down a lane on Jarvis for them. We can't even agree among ourselves to encourage new riders to start small. If we are not prepared to speak up when we see something that hurts our common interest, then we can't complain when we get treated like a bunch of reckless hooligans.

[needabike]

My friend bought his first bike the same time I bought mine. he bought a cbr600rr. Im riding around now, geuss what he's doing? Waiting for huis parts to come in so he can fix his bike from his crash. He wanted to cut someone off, gave too much throttle, spun his tires and wiped out in front of the car. My 500 isnt strong enough to spin its tires.
Also he's fine, a little road rash, but hes okay.

[OriginalSin]

You haven't been around enough.

+1 geez I even see vespas in accidents

[DaveP]

From the bikes crashes I have seen through my life. ALL the bikes involved were 600CC and up. Not once have I seen a 500 CC or less in a crash. That's just from my observation.

Then get out and ride some more cause your delusional!

[DaFrEnCh-TiCkLeR]

I've grown weary of seeing/telling new riders what not to buy and criticize their purchase decision. I say, let Darwin's theory sort them out and have them learn the hard way.

90% of the time they've already bought it, are too stubborn to take advice, or too cocky to take advice. Either way - they won't listen to you or me. It's the big red button theory: tell someone not to push it no matter what, and they'll push it the second you turn your back.

Tell a noob that they shouldn't buy an R1 because their a noob, mommy daddy will probably buy it because mommy or daddy doesn't know any better.

Now, this excludes those who ask "is this a good starter bike?" because clearly they don't know any better. but they asked, so they deserve every bit of advice we can give them.

But if someone has to buy a 1000rr as a new bike (a friend of mine did, first bike, doesn't even have his license, never rode before) he turned away when I gave him advice, claiming i was 'jealous' that he had a bigger supersport than I did. i've come across that attitude with a lot of new riders. I even offered to give him lessons on my old bike but he refused.

So to those who are too smug, cocky and impotent to research their motorcycle purchase and refuse to take experienced riders' advice: let them learn the hard way.


Discuss and agree or disagree with my partially-ethical opinion.

You should change your title to "Let stubborn people learn the hard way"

I would be on board for that

[mehsham]

I started on r6 as my first bike after taking suggestions from my biker friends... They told me as long as you respect the power and take it slowly you will not get into trouble... this is what i did last year when i bought my first bike.. since then i've racked up more than 30,000 kms yes 30,000 and i'm proud to say that their are few pro riders who recommended i should hit tracks because of my skill level that i developed..

But to tell you the truth, when i bought the bike i spent the frsti three weeks riding around my neighbour hood and practicing in parking lot for hours ie. emergency manuvers, stops, making a left right turn, counter steering and yaddi yaddaa.. but i took small steps at a time...

So, the question is can you start on a 600SS, yes but the learning curve will be much slower because of the power delivery but its doable..

[amp3d]

wow im on page 6 still reading and this is very interesting!

Wouldnt it be great if GTAM members were able to come together like that and catch all these people jacking bikes? I have an alarm on mine, and I encourage everyone to do the same!

With all this theft going on, don't chance it people! Make sure you can an alarm or tracking device on your bikes!

[eastcoast_gsx]

i'm proud to say that their are few pro riders who recommended i should hit tracks because of my skill level that i developed..

They are just trying to pad their spare parts supplies

[kiwi]

i, too, believe in letting darwin sort these people out, but not if they're going to cause harm to other pedestrians/drivers out there.

If people ask for advice, i'll certainly give it. But then are those people who say they're "looking for advice", and really all they want is for people to endorse their position of buying some ss as a starter. As soon as anyone tells 'em it's not such a hot idea, they're full of rationalizations and justifications as to why they're the exception. At that point....i stop bothering with them.

+1
so true!!! So true!!

[x86ect]

wow im on page 6 still reading and this is very interesting!

Wouldnt it be great if GTAM members were able to come together like that and catch all these people jacking bikes? I have an alarm on mine, and I encourage everyone to do the same!

With all this theft going on, don't chance it people! Make sure you can an alarm or tracking device on your bikes!

Whoa... dimension warp.

[kiwi]

I think you said it yourself. The point that is being made here is that you "pushed yourself" and crashed your bike. If you were experienced you wouldn't have crashed it because you would have known what you were doing.
:
:
is why i like to laugh at people with r6's making bicycle turns around corners. bonus points however for being a gino, or having a loud exhaust.

BINGO!!!

heh heh.. love the last paragraph.

[kenz]

What a dumb post this is. What are you guys the motorcycle police, or motorcycle experts just cause you have a few years on a bike? Please.

A bike is a bike, power or no power, ur on 2 wheels, ur just as likely to wipe out on a scooter if ur not careful.

The size of the bike is dependant on the person and there personality. If your likely the type of person to take chances or participate in risky behaviour, it doesn't matter how much experience you have, **** happens, and it can happen in many sports.

Riding a big bike doesn't automatically mean your asking for trouble, it just means that you have to be more cautious with how you ride it, but that goes with any bike.

I started on an R6, never rode a bike in my life, and never crashed it, until I started experimenting and pushing myself. I would have crashed regardless of the bike I was riding. I mountain bike too, ride on trails, take jumps, and have wiped out bad, broken finger and dislocated shoulder, was that because I was riding a Specialized Stump Jumper 1000cc? No it was because I decided to push myself, and would have fallen either way, even if I was riding on a lesser of a bike.

+1. riding exp does factor in. but in the end its how the rider chooses to handle the bike.

[SONIC6]

Have any of you started off on a 600 or more? If not then who are you to comment anyway? Who are you to say to someone they shouldn't just because you chose to or just didnt have the balls to start on something bigger? Keep up the good work, cause for the most part your just a bunch of followers regurgitating the same crap that you were told when you started out. Time and money wasted on some mickey mouse bike that you had to end up selling cause it sucked ***.

To each there own, tell people what ever you want just so you feel better about yourself and all that knowledgable experience you have. I'll keep telling everyone the opposite.

I've wasted enough of my time here, flame away talkers.

[vraptor65]

Interesting points on both sides.

Despite the better judgment of experienced riders, I still chose to start on a 600cc as my first bike and survived long enough to graduate to a much more powerful/heavier bike in the Triumph Sprint ST 1050cc (6 yrs/ 15K later).

Even being a responsible early-30's married male at the time, I still had a few *** puckers with my time on the 600. lack of Muscle memory, reacting/not reacting properly at a given moment, avoiding target fixation, trusting the lean, anticipating stupid cager moves, etc. were all learning experiences. Experiences that I still would have likely learned on a lesser bike..

However, I quickly learned that bigger bikes are much more sensitive to rider inputs after riding a buddy's 1k SS. Things happen quicker with less forgiveness. Too much throttle can put you fist over ***. To much brake can put you down *** over fist. These are extra variables/complexities that the majority of new riders would be better off not having to deal with until they have a few km's under their belt

All in all, I firmly believe I would have developed my skills and confidence more quickly if I started on something smaller ( a bit of regret). Certainly I would have learned to be a safe rider first as well as hone in on my spidy senses to help avoid all those cookoo cagers out there on the street trying to kill me and make my wife a widow.

[mehsham]

lolz please dont' say that.. it gives me goose bumps :P..

They are just trying to pad their spare parts supplies

[Red_Liner740]

i started off on a V-twin 1000cc

to be honest, after riding my g/f's zz250 and just seeing how much easier it is to ride, not just from the perspective of acceleration...but everything that bike did, i kinda regretted starting off on something so big

the learning curve was steep which in turn meant i had to baby the bike and probably stunted my progress...

forget about the CC size....Super Sports have a very aggressive riding position, very akward at low speeds, peaky power output, incredible brakes.....

ah we all know this already....

[Declan Gunn]

Have any of you started off on a 600 or more? If not then who are you to comment anyway? Who are you to say to someone they shouldn't just because you chose to or just didnt have the balls to start on something bigger? Keep up the good work, cause for the most part your just a bunch of followers regurgitating the same crap that you were told when you started out. Time and money wasted on some mickey mouse bike that you had to end up selling cause it sucked ***.

To each there own, tell people what ever you want just so you feel better about yourself and all that knowledgable experience you have. I'll keep telling everyone the opposite.

I've wasted enough of my time here, flame away talkers.

not all of us have to start on a bigger cc motorcycle to show how big our balls are, mine show through my pants.

I started off on an 87 600, MUCH different compared to the new 600's out there: seating position, weight, power, steering, etc... totally different. you're the one who tried to "push the limits" and ended up falling on your ***, if you had more experience and were a better rider, you would have been able to keep the shiny side up.

Bikes don't suck, riders do.

[sempire]

I think sonic6 went on to make a new thread about how wearing gear is nonsense..

[captainlol]

Have any of you started off on a 600 or more? If not then who are you to comment anyway? Who are you to say to someone they shouldn't just because you chose to or just didnt have the balls to start on something bigger? Keep up the good work, cause for the most part your just a bunch of followers regurgitating the same crap that you were told when you started out. Time and money wasted on some mickey mouse bike that you had to end up selling cause it sucked ***.

To each there own, tell people what ever you want just so you feel better about yourself and all that knowledgable experience you have. I'll keep telling everyone the opposite.

I've wasted enough of my time here, flame away talkers.

Irony, anyone?
At least you take your own advice