Interesting: Claims experience in different regions

[Resurrection]

I appreciate any and all information related to bike and car insurance. The more information we have the better we can try to lower our rates. Understanding insurance makes paying a little more palatable, and dispels the myth that insurance is legalized robbery. While I will not move house because my location is insurance-wise high risk, I can better appreciate what my fellow bad drivers do to my insurance rate.

It's rare to get this information from a forum, much less from a fellow biker in the insurance industry. I know this info is confidential, so I appreciate the 15 point scale. It's better than getting no information at all. The GTA is statistically large enough that one company's info should be similar to all other competitors. Maybe no one person can collect such info from all insurance companies. I'll take what I can get, rather than to have a void of knowledge.

You're telling me, because he shows you some numbers, you now accept high insurance premiums. This information is used to screw us. The real numbers are not the claims by area, but who is involved in those claims. Lots of people commute to Toronto, from every where. So if 10 people from Ajax get in accidents in downtown Toronto, the stats are out of wack. People commuting are more likely to get in accidents, because of traffic frustrations, when they finally get through all the traffic and get close to work, they are more tired, more aggrivated, and more eager to get out of the car, so they would be at a higher risk for accidents, If they want to show real stas, show the stats of people that have the accidents not where they have them. It could be for every one person that lives in Toronto that has an acident, 10 from outside could have accidents in toronto. That makes the people from outside toronto worse drivers, more impatient ect.

[Resurrection]

No one has proven anything wrong. Some members have merely pointed out some minor discrepancies that they have encountered with their particular insurer, which I have already explained. Seeing that you don't give a "rats ***" about my stats, it is surprising that you subscribe and respond to every thread I post in. More than 80% of your posts are just trying to provoke an "online battle" of childhood playground proportions.

I created this thread at the request of a member, who was curious to know how different regions in Toronto compare to each other. I'm sure some people find it interesting. For those who don't find it interesting, they can click out of the thread . . . it is the Internet after all.

Funny you should mention the White Knight; I actually took the "Kingdomality" personality survey a couple of years ago, and I came out as the "White Knight":

Again you're lying. Show the stats of how many threads you have posted in, and how many I have posted in. I bet it's less than 10%. You can't give numbers and say these are true stats unless you have more to back it up. One companies stats are not a true indicator of anything. Again I say it comes down to who had the accidents, not where they had them, that is the true stats. Insurance is the second biggest scam, gas prices being number 1.

[TorontoBoy]

You're telling me, because he shows you some numbers, you now accept high insurance premiums. This information is used to screw us. The real numbers are not the claims by area, but who is involved in those claims...

I acknowledge and pay high insurance rates because I have no choice, just as I pay high gas prices to power my bike. I am a careful driver with no claims and also acknowledge that I do subsidize the claims of careless drivers. This is how all insurance works. Specific types of people get into crashes more often, but I do not believe that they are evenly distributed geographically amongst the population throughout Ontario. People who make claims are more likely to live in certain areas, such as Toronto and specifically Scarborough, so to use the driver's residence as an indicator of crash risk makes some sense. This can be easily backed up by claims statistics. Empirically I see more terrible driving in Scarborough than I do in Pickering/Ajax. To test this just ride around and see how many cages piss you off.

There are other factors that go into your insurance rate such as age, type of vehicle, distance from work, make/model of vehicle etc, so it's not solely location of residence. These other criteria are based on individual differences.

I seek and appreciate information that can better explain my world, be it the nutritional value of apples or insurance premiums in Ontario. Why would not you do the same?

[VifferFun]

You're telling me, because he shows you some numbers, you now accept high insurance premiums. This information is used to screw us. The real numbers are not the claims by area, but who is involved in those claims. Lots of people commute to Toronto, from every where. So if 10 people from Ajax get in accidents in downtown Toronto, the stats are out of wack. People commuting are more likely to get in accidents, because of traffic frustrations, when they finally get through all the traffic and get close to work, they are more tired, more aggrivated, and more eager to get out of the car, so they would be at a higher risk for accidents, If they want to show real stas, show the stats of people that have the accidents not where they have them. It could be for every one person that lives in Toronto that has an acident, 10 from outside could have accidents in toronto. That makes the people from outside toronto worse drivers, more impatient ect.

You really do think that my goal is to make GTAM members love paying insurance premiums. What have I got to gain by this? I could honestly care less whether or not you are happy. My goal here is to try and explain things to people if they care to learn. I hate paying premiums too, and I also think that they are quite high, but this is out of the control of the insurance industry (which I have already explained in other threads if you care to learn).

The claims statistics are not collected based on where the accidents occur, but by the residence location of the insured. The relativities that I have posted indicate this, just as you wanted . . . the REAL statistics. Typically, people get in accidents close to home, but there will be instances where commuters get into a crash on their way to work. This is why all insurance companies in Ontario also have a factor based on the usage of the vehicle (i.e. Personal, Commute, or Business) as well as the annual mileage.

[VifferFun]

Again you're lying. Show the stats of how many threads you have posted in, and how many I have posted in. I bet it's less than 10%. You can't give numbers and say these are true stats unless you have more to back it up. One companies stats are not a true indicator of anything. Again I say it comes down to who had the accidents, not where they had them, that is the true stats. Insurance is the second biggest scam, gas prices being number 1.

You are trying to pick a fight in many threads I posted in. I apologize if you don't understand a literary hyperbole. You have even gone so far as to copy my signature . . . but I understand that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery

The stats I have posted are indeed true stats, whether you want to believe it or not. Honestly, I could care less about risking confidential information in order to prove something to unappreciative GTAM members.

[Resurrection]

I acknowledge and pay high insurance rates because I have no choice, just as I pay high gas prices to power my bike. I am a careful driver with no claims and also acknowledge that I do subsidize the claims of careless drivers. This is how all insurance works. Specific types of people get into crashes more often, but I do not believe that they are evenly distributed geographically amongst the population throughout Ontario. People who make claims are more likely to live in certain areas, such as Toronto and specifically Scarborough, so to use the driver's residence as an indicator of crash risk makes some sense. This can be easily backed up by claims statistics. Empirically I see more terrible driving in Scarborough than I do in Pickering/Ajax. To test this just ride around and see how many cages piss you off.

There are other factors that go into your insurance rate such as age, type of vehicle, distance from work, make/model of vehicle etc, so it's not solely location of residence. These other criteria are based on individual differences.

I seek and appreciate information that can better explain my world, be it the nutritional value of apples or insurance premiums in Ontario. Why would not you do the same?

Very simple. I don't buy into the BS the insurance industry wants us to believe.I've already caught SF scamming me on my liability policy. They charged me $750 a yr more then most other insurance companies. that's huge. I called them and asked them why, their answer was We don't know why it's so much higher. I canceled it with them and went else where. My truck insureance is going soon and I'll also save 444 on that. So between my truck and my liability policies I will save almost 1200 a yr.

[Resurrection]

You are trying to pick a fight in many threads I posted in. I apologize if you don't understand a literary hyperbole. You have even gone so far as to copy my signature . . . but I understand that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery

The stats I have posted are indeed true stats, whether you want to believe it or not. Honestly, I could care less about risking confidential information in order to prove something to unappreciative GTAM members.

How am I trying to pick a fight, because I disagree with you. I didn't copy your sig, I just made it more accurate. Ahhh everyone give VifferFun a pat on the back. I appreciate information thay is helpful, not inflated. Like I said get stats from different companies and then we'll have true stats.

[VifferFun]

How am I trying to pick a fight, because I disagree with you. I didn't copy your sig, I just made it more accurate. Ahhh everyone give VifferFun a pat on the back. I appreciate information thay is helpful, not inflated. Like I said get stats from different companies and then we'll have true stats.

There is a difference between a disagreement and trying to provoke someone. I enjoy disagreements when the other person has some good arguments and suggestions for improvement. Some members on this board have made some excellent observations and I welcome the constructive criticism. Merely stating "insurance is a scam" without understanding the system or offering any suggestions is just a waste of time.

The stats that I have used are quite representative of the insurance industry as a whole. If you don't think they are, then so be it. This information is posted for the people who care.

With regards to your State Farm incident, it is completely within your right to go to the company that charges you th lowest premium. It's a very competitive market and generally the company with the lowest premium will get your business. It does pay to shop around.

Anyways, let's keep this thread on topic. If anyone has any comments and/or suggestions regarding the list I posted, please post them up.

[Resurrection]

There is a difference between a disagreement and trying to provoke someone. I enjoy disagreements when the other person has some good arguments and suggestions for improvement. Some members on this board have made some excellent observations and I welcome the constructive criticism. Merely stating "insurance is a scam" without understanding the system or offering any suggestions is just a waste of time.

The stats that I have used are quite representative of the insurance industry as a whole. If you don't think they are, then so be it. This information is posted for the people who care.

With regards to your State Farm incident, it is completely within your right to go to the company that charges you th lowest premium. It's a very competitive market and generally the company with the lowest premium will get your business. It does pay to shop around.

Anyways, let's keep this thread on topic. If anyone has any comments and/or suggestions regarding the list I posted, please post them up.

See again an assumption, and again you're wrong. I have 3 sisters that have work in the industry for well over 30 yrs, one has a ribo license, and I myself took and passed with flying colours, a few insurance course, including insurance loss control, but hey I'm not as smart as an actuary, because they are the smartest people in the world.

[Team_Green]

no north brampton/caledon?

[VifferFun]

See again an assumption, and again you're wrong. I have 3 sisters that have work in the industry for well over 30 yrs, one has a ribo license, and I myself took and passed with flying colours, a few insurance course, including insurance loss control, but hey I'm not as smart as an actuary, because they are the smartest people in the world.

I have brothers who work in the pharmaceutical and banking industries, but I don't know much about these industries myself. The course that you took does not sound mathematical/statistical in nature, but rather from a Claims Adjuster perspective. Controlling insurance losses is not the same as pricing for them.

Anyways, this useless blabber is a waste of forum space. Let people who care about the original topic post here.

[VifferFun]

no north brampton/caledon?

I will take a look into this when I can.

[[evo]]

Resurrection, I thought you were pretty funny at first but man give it up. Our rates our high and we have to deal with it. Its not nessassarily a scam just the industry could be better.

You are acting like a 12 yr old who listens to to much Art Bell with all this wah wah scam ******** you post everytime theres an insurance thread.

[Resurrection]

Resurrection, I thought you were pretty funny at first but man give it up. Our rates our high and we have to deal with it. Its not nessassarily a scam just the industry could be better.

You are acting like a 12 yr old who listens to to much Art Bell with all this wah wah scam ******** you post everytime theres an insurance thread.

I am funny. So how are you dealing with high rates, by paying the inflated costs? That's a good way to deal with it. 12 yr old, damn I was going for younger. I actually don't post every time there's an insurance thread, only when the BS is flying fast and furious. And it is definitely a scam. Look at the profits of insurance companies and you'll see it's a scam. Look back to around 2003 -2004 where the profits were in hundreds of million dollars.

[Resurrection]

I have brothers who work in the pharmaceutical and banking industries, but I don't know much about these industries myself. The course that you took does not sound mathematical/statistical in nature, but rather from a Claims Adjuster perspective. Controlling insurance losses is not the same as pricing for them.

Anyways, this useless blabber is a waste of forum space. Let people who care about the original topic post here.

Ohh I'm not an actuary now my day is ruined. lol I understand insurance very well, probably as good as you do, I just don't go around thinking I am the smartest guy in the world, I don't need a pat on the back every day. Someone must have been neglected as a child.

[DemonPig]

Did you read Post #28?

I missed that actually. It makes sense a bit more now because I'm 2 minutes away from Oakville which has lower rates than Etobicoke. I could be in the same region with my insurance company.

[VifferFun]

And it is definitely a scam. Look at the profits of insurance companies and you'll see it's a scam. Look back to around 2003 -2004 where the profits were in hundreds of million dollars.

Look at the overall profit from the last 10 years combined, and then invest your life savings in the insurance industry. I've you you why rational investors don't do this, but you never answer. No one ever does.

I won't deny that we've had some really great years, and we've also had some really poor ones. The are the cycles called the hard and soft markets, which you would understand if you know as much as you claim you do.

[VifferFun]

Ohh I'm not an actuary now my day is ruined. lol I understand insurance very well, probably as good as you do, I just don't go around thinking I am the smartest guy in the world, I don't need a pat on the back every day. Someone must have been neglected as a child.

I'm not the smartest person in the world, but I am confident in what I know. Likewise, you should be confident in your own profession, whatever that may be. Now quit hijacking my thread . . . we all understand that you hate paying for insurance and think it's a scam.

[VifferFun]

no north brampton/caledon?

The groups are based on postal code . . . let me know what yours is and I will look it up. For example, L7K is in the following group:

Bradford, Newcastle, Port Perry, Uxbridge, Orangeville: 10

[Schmedley]

I appreciate the info Viffer, but I just wish this info was more readily available from the insurance industry.

When I last moved, I inadvertently went from a '3' zone to a '15' zone and my insurance doubled in price - which pi$$ed me right off. Had I known about these zones beforehand, I would have moved to another good zone.

If this information was readily available from insurance companies - it could effect property prices (who wants to move to an area where insurance will double or triple?) - if people knew that their irresponsible driving directly effected their property values, maybe people would drive more responsibly.