Bill 45 - An Auto Insurance Amendment Act

[jay-d]

I think this is great!

Jagmeet is a good friend of mine and I think this is something everyone in Ontario should be supporting, not just the Indian community in Brampton!

https://www.facebook.com/events/244255419005722/

[VifferFun]

It's not at all surprising that Brampton MPP would be requesting the elimination of territory rating, since this would entirely be to their benefit. Brampton pays higher insurance rates because the people who live there claim MUCH more than anywhere else in Ontario. If you eliminate territory rating, then the people who live in places where claims are very low will see premium hikes in order to subsidize the high-claim territories. If high-risk territories are going to see premium decreases, then low-risk territories will see premium increases.

[jay-d]

So it's a lose-lose

I'm in Mississauga and I pay a ridiculous premium.. sigh.

[VifferFun]

So it's a lose-lose

I'm in Mississauga and I pay a ridiculous premium.. sigh.

Mississauga tends to be higher as well. Basically, if a region is paying higher-than-average insurance rates it is because they are making higher-than-average claims. I would be pretty angry as a resident of a safe driving and non-litigious region if I had to subsidize the bad driving habits and lawyer-happy characteristics of another region. As an example, the average person in Brampton claims three times as much as the average person in a low-risk region, but if MPP Jagmeet gets his way then the low-risk drivers will see some hefty increases.

Rather than offloading Brampton's problems on other regions, they should try and deal with THEIR problem themselves. The insurance companies aren't out to get Brampton residents, but just charging the premium required to cover the risk. Why are people claiming so much in Brampton? Is fraud rampant? Do Brampton residents suck at driving or perhaps have no consideration of others? I can tell you from experience that driving in a low-risk region is much different than driving in a high-risk region. I won't even ride my bike in the high-risk regions for fear of being killed by the stupidity of others.

Now, since Jagmeet represents the interests of Brampton residents, it makes perfect sense why he would want other regions to essentially give money to the residents of his region. The truth is that most MPPs who would be on the losing end of this deal are too stupid to even know that such a bill would be to the detriment of their residents and will probably not put up much of a fuss. I don't really blame him -- if I were the MPP of Brampton, I would probably try for the same thing since if the bill is passed, it is surely to win him another seat in his riding in the next provincial election

[Kedo]

It is hard to be honest and politically correct at the same time so I will leave the answer as Viffer stated since claims is his game, he knows it best.

Sorry I tried and can't do it. Brampton is higher because of all the BS claims along with people who shouldnt be driving and have questionable licences to match. If you recall there were examiners that were paid for issuing passes that were not warranted.
That is the nicest way I can say it.

[DOHC1]

I understand that high claim = higher premiums.. If I were in business I would do the same thing. However, since fraud is playing a major role in driving up rates, why should I have to pick up the tab? The onus is on the INSURANCE company to combat the fraud. If you cannot operate a business without people scamming you left right and center.. then if you can't take the heat get out the kitchen. I'm FORCED by law to purchase auto insurance, and the way its being run is a joke. Government forces me to give a private company my money, and since the company sucks and keeps getting scammed, I have to pay more than I should?
Just because I live next to a bunch of scammers doesnt give the insurance companies the right to bundle me in with them and jack my rates. Government needs to step in here and partner up with the insurance industry to combat insurance fraud. Add possible jail time and fine of $100,000 to those convicted of insurance fraud and see how quickly people like RAGU go away. Legit accidents should be rated to the AREA, however the cost of fraudulant claims should be distributed across the province, as it is a failure on the COMPANY'S part, NOT a "failure" of the area beign rated.

Insurance is a game of assesing how much risk someone is, and then creating a figure to cover said risk. Fraud works the same way. If I see the risk of getting caught+consequences are not that high, and the possible payouts are in the tens of thousands, I'm much more likely to commit fraud. Risk vs Return

Just my 2 cents..

[VifferFun]

I understand that high claim = higher premiums.. If I were in business I would do the same thing. However, since fraud is playing a major role in driving up rates, why should I have to pick up the tab? The onus is on the INSURANCE company to combat the fraud. If you cannot operate a business without people scamming you left right and center.. then if you can't take the heat get out the kitchen. I'm FORCED by law to purchase auto insurance, and the way its being run is a joke. Government forces me to give a private company my money, and since the company sucks and keeps getting scammed, I have to pay more than I should?
Just because I live next to a bunch of scammers doesnt give the insurance companies the right to bundle me in with them and jack my rates. Government needs to step in here and partner up with the insurance industry to combat insurance fraud. Add possible jail time and fine of $100,000 to those convicted of insurance fraud and see how quickly people like RAGU go away. Legit accidents should be rated to the AREA, however the cost of fraudulant claims should be distributed across the province, as it is a failure on the COMPANY'S part, NOT a "failure" of the area beign rated.

Insurance is a game of assesing how much risk someone is, and then creating a figure to cover said risk. Fraud works the same way. If I see the risk of getting caught+consequences are not that high, and the possible payouts are in the tens of thousands, I'm much more likely to commit fraud. Risk vs Money

Just my 2 cents..

Good points, but I wasn't saying that fraud was the reason for Brampton being terrible -- it's just one possibility. The biggest factor driving rate increases these days is the frequency and severity of claims. It is quite possible (and likely) that residents in Brampton attempt to sue much faster than in other regions. This isn't illegal, but it's certainly a burden to the system. In the low-risk areas (usually rural), people rarely think about taking legal action, where as it is the first thing on people's minds in many high-risk areas. For the smallest of injuries, some people will hire a lawyer and shoot for the stars and try to milk thousands from their insurance company (and hence, everyone else who contributes to the insurance pool).

I think it is also a pretty well-known fact that Brampton drivers tend to be more careless than drivers in other parts of the city.

[jay-d]

These are all excellent points and I will bring them up at the meeting!

Now, since Jagmeet represents the interests of Brampton residents, it makes perfect sense why he would want other regions to essentially give money to the residents of his region. The truth is that most MPPs who would be on the losing end of this deal are too stupid to even know that such a bill would be to the detriment of their residents and will probably not put up much of a fuss. I don't really blame him -- if I were the MPP of Brampton, I would probably try for the same thing since if the bill is passed, it is surely to win him another seat in his riding in the next provincial election

I've known Jagmeet for quite a few years and in all that time he's been one of the truest and honest people I've known.. I hope politics doesn't change that and it becomes all about numbers.

[conundrum]

I somewhat agree with this, however I do think things maybe should stay as they are -- When I moved from Courtice to Scarborough, my rates went through the roof, but I knew this would happen and was ready for it.

On the side of paying 1 rate, it does make some sense as why should my rates go up so dramatically when I'm the same driver, my car sits in same lot for the entire day (work), then I actually only commute 7km home now vs 40km before (so I am on the road a lot less, for a lot shorter of a time). I'd even argue my car is more secure sitting in a monitored underground parking structure (condo) vs in an open driveway when I lived back at home.

The con obviously is insurance companies would more than 'take it out' on everyone who is paying a lower rate, likely netting them more money/revenue. As I said, when I moved to Scarborough, I knew what was going to happen to my rates and could accept it -- if I was still in Courtice and got a letter in the mail saying now that Brampton (or elsewhere) is paying less I'm paying more -- that would be a MUCH different story (one is a choice I actively made, the other is one someone else is forcing me into without a choice).

[nobbie48]

These are all excellent points and I will bring them up at the meeting!



I've known Jagmeet for quite a few years and in all that time he's been one of the truest and honest people I've known.. I hope politics doesn't change that and it becomes all about numbers.

He may be true and honest but that doesn't stop him from ignoring the truth that Brampton is a burden on the insurance companies.

Instead of putting in real work to resolve the real problem and make people responsible for their own actions, even as a group. He wants to make things worse by relieving Brampton drivers of their insurance responsibilities.

"If you screw up you pay up" is reality. This bill is another con game. Getting someone else pay your bills equates to them accepting responsibility for your or your community's bad driving.

[slowbird]

Hmmmm....interesting.

As a resident of Brampton with ZERO claims and very high insurance premiums, this bill would be nice.

On the other hand, there are alot accidents here.

The insurance companies shouldn't rate premiums on where you live, but on your driving history.

I'm planning on moving out of Brampton (even though I work in Brampton too) due to the high premiums.