Local Shops VS Online Dealers.....discuss.

[ronnie]

Okay, some of you know but most of you newer members have no idea that I've worked in various shops around the GTA. So yeah, i may sound a little biased but I'm just generally curious if the people who do this actually realize how douchebaggey like it is to go to your local shop and spend hours with one of the staff there trying on a million helmets, jackets, gloves, boots, etc. fully knowing that you are going to buy all that **** online anyways. Not to mention poring over all the catalogs and checking stock and prices online for you.

It's been happening for years and I guess it will always happen. People complain that they can buy certain products online for much cheaper than you can add a shop. I will not dispute that certain items are much cheaper online. will the online website spend hours and hours with you making sure that everything is a correct fit? Will the online retailer actually give you advice that may save your life someday? Will the online retailer be there when there something wrong and you need to change something that very day?

Just some food for thought here. I'm all for saving a buck when possible, but I'm also willing to pay for good service when it is valid. I am not saying that you should buy every single item knowing that you're getting gouged, I'm just saying sometimes it's okay to pay a little bit more for something because the service is good.

Anyways, I'm done ranting. I'm just wondering if the people who do this realize how uncool it can be. and for the ones to actually understand that supporting your local shop actually keeps pricing down in a long run, I salute you.

[slogan]

C'mon! Business is business - you survive or you got out of.

You cannot ask ppl to pay just to support someone's business. Local shops? Well... Why do not those "local shops" buy "my services" to support me?

I think, if "local shops" want to compete with "online" - they have to offer something, that "online" never will be able to provide. Otherwise, sorry man - the lower price is the lower price

[ronnie]

C'mon! Business is business - you survive or you got out of.

You cannot ask ppl to pay just to support someone's business. Local shops? Well... Why do not those "local shops" buy "my services" to support me?

I think, if "local shops" want to compete with "online" - they have to offer something, that "online" never will be able to provide. Otherwise, sorry man - the lower price is the lower price

you just said that if local shops want to compete they should be able to offer something that online shops can't provide? What about all those things that I listed? Like making sure everything fits, like offering advice, like actually taking an interest in you, like giving you tips, anything like that? If you can honestly tell me that you have never ever benefited from a shop before then I understand. An online shop will never ever be able to fit you in a helmets that may save your life someday in a proper way. An online shop will not provide somebody that will sit there and shoot the **** with you for as long as it takes to have you comfortable with something. An online shop will never provide a place where you can go and just chill out with other riders randomly. an online shop won't be able to help you out in a bind if you're broke down on the side of the road in the area. there are countless things that real-life local shops are good for that I am sure you have benefited from at some point. If you've never ever benefited from it and then I understand if not then my point is kind of proven.

[slogan]

you just said that if local shops want to compete they should be able to offer something that online shops can't provide? What about all those things that I listed? Like making sure everything fits, like offering advice, like actually taking an interest in you, like giving you tips, anything like that? If you can honestly tell me that you have never ever benefited from a shop before then I understand. An online shop will never ever be able to fit you in a helmets that may save your life someday in a proper way. An online shop will not provide somebody that will sit there and shoot the **** with you for as long as it takes to have you comfortable with something. An online shop will never provide a place where you can go and just chill out with other riders randomly. an online shop won't be able to help you out in a bind if you're broke down on the side of the road in the area. there are countless things that real-life local shops are good for that I am sure you have benefited from at some point. If you've never ever benefited from it and then I understand if not then my point is kind of proven.

Well, that's exactly what I am saying!
This is a market, and each seller has to "fight" for customers You cannot make someone to buy the things from you only because you can do something "extra for free" unless this "something for free" comes only after the purchase
But you can behave with a customer the way he will be really willing to buy something from YOU. I don't know... because he/she likes your smile, your opinion, your support, comfort, whatever... that's some marketing question...

A lot of sales assistance, actually, do opposite: trying to sale the stuff, they start "pushing" customer, giving thousands of standard-meaningless advices. That creates a negative reaction...

[Rob MacLennan]

C'mon! Business is business - you survive or you got out of.

You cannot ask ppl to pay just to support someone's business. Local shops? Well... Why do not those "local shops" buy "my services" to support me?

I think, if "local shops" want to compete with "online" - they have to offer something, that "online" never will be able to provide. Otherwise, sorry man - the lower price is the lower price

They do provide something, that the online shops can never provide for you; the ability to see the items you want to purchase, in person. Why else do so many people go to those brick and mortar stores, so that they can 'check out what they want to buy online'?

With that said I have stopped dealing with a store I've dealt with for decades because they no longer seem to stock anything I'm looking for any more and, when I try to order something in, it seems to take forever. When I asked them about a specific item I wanted to buy I was told that it no longer existed, but purchased directly from the manufacturer online. That didn't stop me from dealing with other shops though.

[slogan]

They do provide something, that the online shops can never provide for you; the ability to see the items you want to purchase, in person. Why else do so many people go to those brick and mortar stores, so that they can 'check out what they want to buy online'?

OK. Here is what I say:
The "services" that local shops provide to potential customers (who goes after to online) - those services do not work. Find something else...
C'mon - marketing is marketing - it's kind of RND: to find the way to get your customer have a business with you.
Everything is evaluating and progressing: the trick that did work yesterday, may not work anymore tomorrow. Then you have to find new trick and get new customers, than blame bloody customers for walking away
something like that

[ddusseld]

This is the big problem. Stock. If a local store does not stock what I want then there no incentive for me to buy from them. I can order it as easy as the shop. Like Rob, eventually I will give up on a shop if everytime I look for something they don't have it in stock.

The other "issue" local shops have is knowledge. I suspect I'm pretty much normal in that before I decide to buy I research the crap out of whatever I'm interested in on the internet. I go to a shop for advice and I likely know more about that specific item then the sales person. There is very little value added. This is not a knock on the sales person. How can they know everything about everything?

My policy has to do with supporting local business. If the price is close and the item is in stock I'll buy locally. If not, I try to order through a Canadian internet seller and if that fails I order internationally via the web.

They do provide something, that the online shops can never provide for you; the ability to see the items you want to purchase, in person. Why else do so many people go to those brick and mortar stores, so that they can 'check out what they want to buy online'?

With that said I have stopped dealing with a store I've dealt with for decades because they no longer seem to stock anything I'm looking for any more and, when I try to order something in, it seems to take forever. When I asked them about a specific item I wanted to buy I was told that it no longer existed, but purchased directly from the manufacturer online. That didn't stop me from dealing with other shops though.

[rob_96]

C'mon! Business is business - you survive or you got out of.

You cannot ask ppl to pay just to support someone's business. Local shops? Well... Why do not those "local shops" buy "my services" to support me?

I think, if "local shops" want to compete with "online" - they have to offer something, that "online" never will be able to provide. Otherwise, sorry man - the lower price is the lower price

Local shops do provide something more, or they should. Using a Local show will allow you to build a relationship with the employees there. Online yes the prices are lower, but if you use a local shop they should be more willing to help you in other ways. Price is not always the most important thing, its the extra services they offer. I try to use local when I can, and i can say that i have build many relationships and acquired many new friends. They have from time to time, tossed me free parts and extra service for free. Online wont give you this.

[slogan]

Local shops do provide something more, or they should. Using a Local show will allow you to build a relationship with the employees there. Online yes the prices are lower, but if you use a local shop they should be more willing to help you in other ways. Price is not always the most important thing, its the extra services they offer. I try to use local when I can, and i can say that i have build many relationships and acquired many new friends. They have from time to time, tossed me free parts and extra service for free. Online wont give you this.

I totally agree, on one side, but...
If this doesn't work to get more customers, you cannot blame them for it.You wanna get more customers - you have to find a way that works, instead of winning "let's support local shops" or so on...
Supporting someone local, just because it is local - has no sense.
In some countries (I do not wanna list 'em) governors put up to 50-100% import taxes on vehicle price to support local manufacturer. But local manufacturer makes crap. And then they going to say, that you HAVE TO buy local... and so on.
Free market (where you are free to choose) is based on competition.
Competition is a base of progress.
Amen!

[AF4iK]

I understand where you're coming from and I bet it gets frustrating. Totally not cool to take advantage of a business like that. Sort of like eating the free bread at a restaurant and then leaving. But here's another perspective for thought...

I buy local and online. I definitely also window shop locally for something I plan to purchase online. But when I do, I don't ask for assistance from staff except to maybe ask if they carry the item of interest. If a sales rep approaches me I usually respond with "thanks, just looking around". If they get overzealous I try to drop a hint that I don't plan on buying anything today. If they persist, well... that's their fault. Pushy sales reps don't have the right to complain IMO (not saying that you are). Owners could hang a sign on the window saying "only committed buyers may enter" or "no money, no entry" or "buy something or get the **** lost!" lol but who's gonna do that? If you open a brick n' mortar store you accept that not everyone who walks through the door is gonna buy something.

[ronnie]

I understand where you're coming from and I bet it gets frustrating. Totally not cool to take advantage of a business like that. Sort of like eating the free bread at a restaurant and then leaving. But here's another perspective for thought...

I buy local and online. I definitely also window shop locally for something I plan to purchase online. But when I do, I don't ask for assistance from staff except to maybe ask if they carry the item of interest. If a sales rep approaches me I usually respond with "thanks, just looking around". If they get overzealous I try to drop a hint that I don't plan on buying anything today. If they persist, well... that's their fault. Pushy sales reps don't have the right to complain IMO (not saying that you are). Owners could hang a sign on the window saying "only committed buyers may enter" or "no money, no entry" or "buy something or get the **** lost!" lol but who's gonna do that? If you open a brick n' mortar store you accept that not everyone who walks through the door is gonna buy something.

Thank you for your perspective. I can totally respect that and I cannot agree with you. Like I said, I'm all for saving a buck whenever I can, I'm all for getting the best value that I can for my money. I'm not rich, not many of us on this forum are rich either. I'm just saying that it's really really unrad for people to totally rape us knowing full well that they will not spend a penny with us ever.

For example, if that arai helmets is $500 online, the very same helmet at the shop is $1000, I would of course not expect you to buy the helmet at the shop. But if the shop can spend an hour sending you for that very same helmet and bring their price down to $550 only to have you still walk away just because of its $50 more expensive, that's douchebaggery foooooooshooooooooo.

[jc100]

If the store is only a little more expensive than online then that's fine, I'll buy at the store. Way more expensive then I'll ask for a best price and mention online price plus shipping. No deal then I'll walk.

[ronnie]

If the store is only a little more expensive than online then that's fine, I'll buy at the store. Way more expensive then I'll ask for a best price and mention online price plus shipping. No deal then I'll walk.

you do the same thing that I do and I work at one. Ha ha ha. Your perspective is respectable, cheers.

[RedDogDarren]

Agreed.

Build a relationship with the shop and get the best of all worlds. Win-win.

[AF4iK]

Thank you for your perspective. I can totally respect that and I cannot agree with you. Like I said, I'm all for saving a buck whenever I can, I'm all for getting the best value that I can for my money. I'm not rich, not many of us on this forum are rich either. I'm just saying that it's really really unrad for people to totally rape us knowing full well that they will not spend a penny with us ever.

For example, if that arai helmets is $500 online, the very same helmet at the shop is $1000, I would of course not expect you to buy the helmet at the shop. But if the shop can spend an hour sending you for that very same helmet and bring their price down to $550 only to have you still walk away just because of its $50 more expensive, that's douchebaggery foooooooshooooooooo.

hmm... I don't see how it "rapes" anyone if someone walks in to browse. Or were you referring to your first scenario? Even then, taking up a lot of a sales person's time might cost the business potential revenue and it might not. Far from a raping though. If someone can save even a buck buying elsewhere that's there prerogative and no one has the right to tell the customer how much their dollar is worth to them.

[coyo]

I'm starting to find that prices seem to be coming more in line with the online retailers, making it far more appealing to buy on our side of the border.

I totally agree; I'd spend A BIT MORE to buy an item in a local shop rather than online... but when I'm being robbed, I'll place the online order.

[Jampy00]

I find most "local shops" in many cases don't do anything to get or deserve to keep your business. I personally feel this is more about service and less about price. When the service lacks the price becomes the only factor to negotiate with. I can tell you 7 times out of 10 I want into a shop with the intent to buy, only to feel I am "interrupting" the staff's day. I am them forced into one of two actions, ask for service or seak another service. The fact that online shopping is so popular only goes to show the flaws we see with local businesses. It is a sad fact, I for one would love to have a local stop and shop for my needs.

[cbowman78]

Last time I used a local shop (Royal Distributing) I got the biggest run around and they got me into gear that did not fit like it should have. Jacket way to big, helmet to big. I was new at riding and didnt know any better.

I now use Riders Discount who offers me superior advice over most local shops (not all) and the price that cant be beat. I have built up quite a relationship with one of the staff members there and enjoy purchasing from them.

So, local shops are not always the best route. Lot of them just want your money like any other business and offer very little to justify the massive difference in pricing from online.

Okay, some of you know but most of you newer members have no idea that I've worked in various shops around the GTA. So yeah, i may sound a little biased but I'm just generally curious if the people who do this actually realize how douchebaggey like it is to go to your local shop and spend hours with one of the staff there trying on a million helmets, jackets, gloves, boots, etc. fully knowing that you are going to buy all that **** online anyways. Not to mention poring over all the catalogs and checking stock and prices online for you.

It's been happening for years and I guess it will always happen. People complain that they can buy certain products online for much cheaper than you can add a shop. I will not dispute that certain items are much cheaper online. will the online website spend hours and hours with you making sure that everything is a correct fit? Will the online retailer actually give you advice that may save your life someday? Will the online retailer be there when there something wrong and you need to change something that very day?

Just some food for thought here. I'm all for saving a buck when possible, but I'm also willing to pay for good service when it is valid. I am not saying that you should buy every single item knowing that you're getting gouged, I'm just saying sometimes it's okay to pay a little bit more for something because the service is good.

Anyways, I'm done ranting. I'm just wondering if the people who do this realize how uncool it can be. and for the ones to actually understand that supporting your local shop actually keeps pricing down in a long run, I salute you.

[Spiider]

I have the opposite problem....retailers that have one of each item in stock for "trying on".

I go in and figure out exactly what I want, and then they say "sorry, we have to order that"....you know what? I can order online too...I often tell them that. I go into a local store because I want it in my hand when I leave, as long as the price isn't insanely wrong I'll buy locally every single time to try and support keeping shops open.

The problem is that almost every company has become a catalog order company...the ****** accountants of the world told people not to carry inventory because it is "bad to have capital tied up"...well you also don't get my sale if you don't have it in stock.

This is where the owners of the company should put on their big boy underpants and tell the accountants to stfu and go count some beans.

[ronnie]

To be honest, I agree that there can be some really garbage shops out there. I also agree that if the service is **** then you should spend your money elsewhere. The raping terminology comes from somebody who has literally spent hours upon hours trying every single piece of equipment on knowing that they are not going to buy anything at all.

I will say though, that I have made some very good friends out of "customers" that have walked into a shop that I have worked at, some of them on this very forum. As in dude or dudette, walks in and has some questions or want to buy something, we end up going riding afterwards and we're friends. Voila!! idiggthat fo shooooooo.