Best tires for end of season track days?

[Rick CH]

Thinking of taking in a couple of track days before the end of season, including Oct 1 and TMP on Oct 29. What are the best track tires to use? Racing slicks (scrubbed) or street tires?

[murf]

Depends on the temp that day, using tire warmers, and how fast you are?

[kneedragger88]

Colder the track the softer the tire is best. If your pace is not fast enough to keep heat in a race tire then go DOT. All bets are off if raining, then its wets or street DOTs. Last Thursday I did a cool 60F day with drizzle at TMP. I had the choice of RC51, 600RR, Ducati 1000DS all on slicks. Tried the 51 first then the RR in the wet. Ended up changing the RR to a very shagged set of full wets (thanks Andrew Westbrook) in a semi dry track. They were perfect for the instructor pace In was going then went to the Duc on SC3 slicks (hard) in the PM when it drid up 90% also without issue. Oct is likely similar weather.

[caboose483]

Colder the track the softer the tire is best. If your pace is not fast enough to keep heat in a race tire then go DOT. All bets are off if raining, then its wets or street DOTs. Last Thursday I did a cool 60F day with drizzle at TMP. I had the choice of RC51, 600RR, Ducati 1000DS all on slicks. Tried the 51 first then the RR in the wet. Ended up changing the RR to a very shagged set of full wets (thanks Andrew Westbrook) in a semi dry track. They were perfect for the instructor pace In was going then went to the Duc on SC3 slicks (hard) in the PM when it drid up 90% also without issue. Oct is likely similar weather.

If riding Dunlops you'll want to do the opposite.

[Bond Chick]

If riding Dunlops you'll want to do the opposite.

Could you elaborate on that? Why would it be the opposite for Dunlops? Inquiring minds want to know.

[R1Guy]

I've ran Pirelli SC1's slicks on a cooler day and ripped the crap out of the rear tire...

[caboose483]

Could you elaborate on that? Why would it be the opposite for Dunlops? Inquiring minds want to know.

Most tires will have grip fall off if you can't keep them at or near ideal operating temperature on the track but the Dunlops are very sensitive to being outside of their ideal temp range. If it's below 20C i have a very hard time keeping a Dunlop rear over 70C.

The softer Dunlop rears will still grip well but if they are off ideal operating temp the carcass of the tire will not work properly. The carcass will remain too cold and stiff then you'll over work the surface of the tire wich leads to cold tearing and reduced tire life. If you run the 6680 (Medium+) rear in colder temps it will grip a bit less and you will slide the rear instead of tearing it. It's not like it's a hockey puck and you'll be spinning it everywhere and be sideways, but the tire does behave differently than the softer ones.... and lasts much longer.

Doing some endurance practice last October at a TMP Racer5 day I burned through an entire tank of gas in one go over 1h15m running 1:18's the whole time. I was running a 6680 rear and it held up very well.

[Bond Chick]

Depends on the temp that day, using tire warmers, and how fast you are?

Rick and I co-own the bike. No tire warmers. We have slicks and rains. We're not aggressive riders... yet. Certainly don't want to overdo it this late in the season if the tires have reduced grip. Temps will be whatever Mother Nature throws at us, but for average day temps... probably around 18C in early October and 12C by the end of October (rough estimate).

Hope that helps.

[murf]

Track/street hybrid tire, or a soft compound dot race tire.......but some of them need warmers.

[Teal]

Pirelli Compound Info
http://www.orionmotorsports.ca/2010ws/pdfs/Compound Description.pdf

[freedomfighter]

Could you elaborate on that? Why would it be the opposite for Dunlops? Inquiring minds want to know.

cause dunlop have had it way off for the passed couple of years. i had every one jumping up and down on my bike pro6,mark (perrelli) scott rueport,etc and the most i could get out of them was 8 laps at a 1 15.9 at tmp out of the rear. soo after a year of pro 6 just telling me to trow tires at the problem. now i.m on michlins i.m going faster and im getting 3 days out of them.

[caboose483]

cause dunlop have had it way off for the passed couple of years. i had every one jumping up and down on my bike pro6,mark (perrelli) scott rueport,etc and the most i could get out of them was 8 laps at a 1 15.9 at tmp out of the rear. soo after a year of pro 6 just telling me to trow tires at the problem. now i.m on michlins i.m going faster and im getting 3 days out of them.

At the last SOAR round last year in early October I ran Open Sprint and Superbike. Temps were cold, below 10C, and i was using the 7704 rear (read: not the right tire for those temps but i didnt want to buy a new rear). I used that rear for a 10 lap final at RACE Round #6 on Pro Track running 1:08's then two 12 lap finals at TMP. In Superbike i was running 1:14's and in Open Sprint the tire did start to go off but I was still in the mid 1:15's.

You get 8 laps out of a rear, i get 34.

Don't blame the tires if you don't have the bike set up properly. Both Scott and Mark are Pirelli guys.

[SunnY S]

At the last SOAR round last year in early October I ran Open Sprint and Superbike. Temps were cold, below 10C, and i was using the 7704 rear (read: not the right tire for those temps but i didnt want to buy a new rear). I used that rear for a 10 lap final at RACE Round #6 on Pro Track running 1:08's then two 12 lap finals at TMP. In Superbike i was running 1:14's and in Open Sprint the tire did start to go off but I was still in the mid 1:15's.

You get 8 laps out of a rear, i get 34.

.

Wowsers...... there were so many "I"'s in your post that a trip to the optometrist may be in order.


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[caboose483]

Wowsers...... there were so many "I"'s in your post that a trip to the optometrist may be in order..

No, it's actually an extra trip to the coffee pot that may be in order.

[john bickle]

Rick and I co-own the bike. No tire warmers.

Hope that helps.

If you are running slicks with out warmers,, you are A- wasting a ton of rubber and B- looking for a crash.
At TMP or Cayuga you WIL NOT get that tire heat soaked or even close under 15 C. You could do 100 laps and the tire will not rise to operating temp.
It takes 40 minutes at 20 C to fully heat soak ANY tire with any good warmer. Under 15 C at Cayuga you are loosing heat becasue the corners do not build heat.
Slicks and DOT track tires are designed for warmers. All you will end up doing is driving the tire guy nuts and,,that's if you don't crash.
If you do not leave pit lane at 75-80 C you will never get the tire working.

[Bond Chick]

If you are running slicks with out warmers,, you are A- wasting a ton of rubber and B- looking for a crash.
At TMP or Cayuga you WIL NOT get that tire heat soaked or even close under 15 C. You could do 100 laps and the tire will not rise to operating temp.
It takes 40 minutes at 20 C to fully heat soak ANY tire with any good warmer. Under 15 C at Cayuga you are loosing heat becasue the corners do not build heat.
Slicks and DOT track tires are designed for warmers. All you will end up doing is driving the tire guy nuts and,,that's if you don't crash.
If you do not leave pit lane at 75-80 C you will never get the tire working.

Thanks John. You're the authority. Food for thought.

What about running good street tires on the track, and not pushing. Will that increase the odds in my favour of ending the day with bike and body intact?

Also, would "good" street tires for this be Pirelli Super Corsas?


I'd rather look silly on the board by asking these Qs than look silly in a cast.

[caboose483]

Thanks John. You're the authority. Food for thought.

What about running good street tires on the track, and not pushing. Will that increase the odds in my favour of ending the day with bike and body intact?

Also, would "good" street tires for this be Pirelli Super Corsas?

I'd rather look silly on the board by asking these Qs than look silly in a cast.

No one will criticize you for asking simple questions. We were all new once.. I know a little but JB has forgotten more than I'll ever know.

The Diablo Supercorsa is the Pirelli DOT race tire so it is designed to be used with warmers. If you're looking for a good street tire then that's going to be in the Hypersport class of tire. Something that is meant for street riding but can also handle light/medium track duty.

Dunlop Q2
Pirelli Rosso Corsa
Michelin Power Pure
Bridgestone BT003RS (not the 003R, that is their DOT race tire)

Those fall into the Hyersport category.

[eastcoast_gsx]

We were all new once..

Some of you are still new... BOYAHH!!!

[caboose483]

Some of you are still new... BOYAHH!!!

I look like i know what i'm doing!

[Garyola]

What about running good street tires on the track, and not pushing. Will that increase the odds in my favour of ending the day with bike and body intact?

What I've been told by my tire guy is to give the super moto slicks or whatever they are a go on my TZ250. They warm up fast, soft and are great for cold weather racing. If I get by this concussion thingy this week, I'm going to give those tires a go at the next RACE round.

This is only good if the weather is cold.


G