4 stupid tickets at once

[Buddhacide]

They patrol 407, specifically looking for people who have their plate mounted in such a way as to avoid tolls.

Publicly funded police protecting the profits of the 407 ETR conglomerate. What an encouraging use of tax dollars.

[Torren]

Publicly funded police protecting the profits of the 407 ETR conglomerate. What an encouraging use of tax dollars.

The 407 detachment is paid for by the 407 Corporation.

[GreyGhost]

So should I go to trial or plead guilty with an explanation?

Never ever bother with guilty with an explanation. It is exactly the same as guilty but you waste time giving an explanation (although maybe it makes you feel better?). Guilty is guilty, either pay up so you don't waste time on this mess or fight them all and try to get them dropped. You may have gotten lucky this time as it seems that you may be able to get out of these tickets.

Post a pic of the plate mount, I always leave my bikes plates and lights stock(ish) to avoid these tickets, how hidden was your plate?

[Rob MacLennan]

I have got a 407 bill before but its one of those estimated trips cuz it only got me at 1 gate, and that's only cuz I was going sideways on the ramp. lol

So should I go to trial or plead guilty with an explanation?

Im hoping that if I show pics of my plate mounted all the way back and a new tire on my bike that they'll drop the charges.

The reason for the ownership ticket is that I had a photocopy of only the front and not the back. The cop was a dick and gave me the ticket.

In other words, your plate is not visible to an electronic toll device. You're boned, on that charge. You may still be able to get off the improper mounting charge though, if you can demonstrate that it's clearly visible and completely unobstructed, from the rear. Showing that you put it back in the stock location might convince The Crown to drop that charge, but it doesn't mean that you weren't guilty at the time you were stopped.

If you carry a copy of the ownership, then it must be a "true" copy. That means both sides, both halves, stickers, etc.. He wasn't being a dick, he was going by both the letter and spirit of the law. You're better off to carry the actual ownership, in order to avoid such issues.

[Rob MacLennan]

Valid charges or not....I kinda think the officer went overboard....None of the charges relate to dangerous or aggressive riding.

Coulda learned your lesson from one charge, improperly mounted plate, its common on motorcycles (not necessarily for the purpose of avoiding tolls)

Can't speak to the ownership charge, shoulda had it with you.

The purpose, of laws and penalties, is to insure that illegal behaviour is not repeated. Do you think that someone, who was hit with all applicable charges on the 407, is likely to repeat the actions?

[Brix1487]

the laws are pretty stupid and don't protect the common person. They protect the 407 conglomerate and ensure the stupid pigs generate revenue. Is it fair that I can get pulled over for no reason because Im on a sportsbike and the cop is more likely to pin something on me than on a minivan. That's like saying it's ok to search black people more because statistics show more black people commit crimes. It's profiling and it's not right. @Rob: you sound like your a brainwashed cop. They're just trained to be ******** and give tickets because it generates revenue for them. They have no common sense or education.

My plate was hidden but to ensure it didnt catch for sure I would put my hand over it when going through the 407 gate. A bill for that isn't gonna come for sure. I guess I'll just hope for the best on that one.
Ok. So I'll plead not guilty and ask to meet with the prosecutor.

Does anybody know if OPP officers get paid to go to court? Maybe I can count on him not showing up. lol
Also, will these tickets affect insurance?

[Rob MacLennan]

the laws are pretty stupid and don't protect the common person. They protect the 407 conglomerate and ensure the stupid pigs generate revenue. Is it fair that I can get pulled over for no reason because Im on a sportsbike and the cop is more likely to pin something on me than on a minivan. That's like saying it's ok to search black people more because statistics show more black people commit crimes. It's profiling and it's not right. @Rob: you sound like your a brainwashed cop. They're just trained to be ******** and give tickets because it generates revenue for them. They have no common sense or education.

My plate was hidden but to ensure it didnt catch for sure I would put my hand over it when going through the 407 gate. A bill for that isn't gonna come for sure. I guess I'll just hope for the best on that one.
Ok. So I'll plead not guilty and ask to meet with the prosecutor.

Does anybody know if OPP officers get paid to go to court? Maybe I can count on him not showing up. lol
Also, will these tickets affect insurance?

No, I'm not a cop, as has been stated far too many times on this board already. People who flout the law, think that I'm a cop. People who mindlessly think that you're guilty if charged, think that I'm a scofflaw. Like they say; if both sides don't like you, then you must be doing something right.

Not paying for a service, in this case the use of a toll highway, is theft. To extend your metaphor a bit, is it still profiling to stop and question said black person if it's 3:00am, he's wearing gang colours, has the butt of a pistol showing in his pocket, and the area is known for drug sales? By your own admission you broke the law, in an obvious fashion, and were stopped for it. Now you have to come up with a viable strategy, that will call The Crown's evidence into question.

Officers are paid, for court appearances, and these days are generally scheduled to work on such days, so that they don't receive overtime pay for appearing. My advice is to come up with a better defence strategy than hoping the cop doesn't show up.

[Brian P]

My plate was hidden but to ensure it didnt catch for sure I would put my hand over it when going through the 407 gate. A bill for that isn't gonna come for sure.

That's essentially "theft". The 407 is a toll highway and you are required to pay the toll in order to use it. The laws surrounding the use of toll highways were indeed written to protect the interests of the 407 operators (first the government, and then the private corporation that the government sold it to) ... by ensuring that all persons who use it, pay the toll or failing that, are guilty of an offense!

If you think having to pay a toll is unfair to the common person, turn this around and look at it from the government / toll-road operator's side. If it were legal to avoid paying the toll, then who would EVER pay the toll? If nobody EVER paid the toll, how would the government recoup its construction costs (before they sold it) and how much would it be worth to the organization purchasing the 407 if they knew there was no recourse against toll-evaders?

There is a COMPLETELY LEGAL method of avoiding having to pay 407 tolls and it is a method that I use absolutely religiously: Simply don't use the 407.

[Baggsy]

There are an awful lot of people on here that ride sport bikes and don't get profiled and stopped by the cops, even on the 407.

Maybe you should check and see what they are doing right, and do likewise.

[FiReSTaRT]

There are an awful lot of people on here that ride sport bikes and don't get profiled and stopped by the cops, even on the 407.

Maybe you should check and see what they are doing right, and do likewise.

I got pulled over there once.. If I was to believe the constable's claim of the pacing distance, he would have seen my red (at the time) supersport motorcycle passed by several large cargo vehicles (including a couple of cube vans and a bread truck). He still chose to ticket me for speeding. If that ain't profiling, I don't know what is

[Brix1487]

my argument isnt going to be counting on that the cop doesn't show up.

Im going to say I bought the bike the way it was 3 months earlier. Demonstrate that it was safetied that way. Show photos that I fixed all the problems. And hope that it all gets dropped.

What do you guys think my chances are?

[psycho44]

just curious if you had plates from outside of Ontario would you still be billed for the 407?

[FiReSTaRT]

just curious if you had plates from outside of Ontario would you still be billed for the 407?

Yes

[OpenGambit]

Yes

In theory yes, but i believe there are sometimes issues with other provinces releasing information about the plate owner. So my understanding is that some provinces do that and others don't. THe 407 does try tho.

[jeero]

just curious if you had plates from outside of Ontario would you still be billed for the 407?

Huge signs before some of the major ramps to the 407 state "Out-of-Province Vehicles will be billed" or something to that effect.

[Buddhacide]

The 407 detachment is paid for by the 407 Corporation.

Thanks for clarifying. I should hope so.

[Brix1487]

my argument isnt going to be counting on that the cop doesn't show up.

Im going to say I bought the bike the way it was 3 months earlier. Demonstrate that it was safetied that way. Show photos that I fixed all the problems. And hope that it all gets dropped.

So does anybody think that will work?

[OpenGambit]

the laws are pretty stupid and don't protect the common person. They protect the 407 conglomerate and ensure the stupid pigs generate revenue. Is it fair that I can get pulled over for no reason because Im on a sportsbike and the cop is more likely to pin something on me than on a minivan. That's like saying it's ok to search black people more because statistics show more black people commit crimes. It's profiling and it's not right. @Rob: you sound like your a brainwashed cop. They're just trained to be ******** and give tickets because it generates revenue for them. They have no common sense or education.

My plate was hidden but to ensure it didnt catch for sure I would put my hand over it when going through the 407 gate. A bill for that isn't gonna come for sure. I guess I'll just hope for the best on that one.
Ok. So I'll plead not guilty and ask to meet with the prosecutor.

Does anybody know if OPP officers get paid to go to court? Maybe I can count on him not showing up. lol
Also, will these tickets affect insurance?

So your point is that you are being profiled because you are riding around with a violation clearly visible for all too see? Good one, maybe you should mention that to the JP.

I like how you think that pulling you over for having a plate that you admitted was hidden amounts to a lack of common sense or education by the cop. Its even more funny that you think you got pulled over for no reason just because you are on a sport bike and he "pinned" something on you.

Cops don't have quotas on tickets, but when they see walking violations like you. I expect them to pull you over because thats their job.

[Rob MacLennan]

So does anybody think that will work?

Whether it was inspected in that condition, or not, is immaterial. How would you show that was the case? Do you have dated, verifiable pictures from prior to that date or could you get the inspecting mechanic to testify that is so? Even with that, the placement of the plate isn't part of the inspection, from what I've found in the regulations. It must merely be lit and the plate, itself, must not be damaged or illegible.

[GreyGhost]

just curious if you had plates from outside of Ontario would you still be billed for the 407?

A friend from new Brunswick has driven on the 407 10+ times/yr since it opened and he has yet to see a bill.