Got a Ticket - cop lieng about reduction?

[2500Express]

Exactly as promac said. I would get one or two speeding tickets a year. And then a year hit when I had two from the previous year and got my second for the next... The cop who pulled me over came over with my license and the ticket looked at me and said "Your insurance has got to be insane. Get one more and theres a good chance your loosing your license." I took it as my cue to start my second chance. I really watch it now. I like going fast but it is stupid... I know that. And its not worth the risks. Honestly I think its pathetic it got to that point and it took that long for me to learn. But I am happy it was before some thing bad happened.

I've probably got around 350k km between my bike and trucks and I've never even been pulled over, and I speed all the time, you just gotta know when and where to do it. Luck will only get you so far, so I'm probably due for one soon, but I'm not gonna get a bunch in the same year!

[Golluk]

Well, I've gone through my first ticket, pretty similar to yours. First step is to either mail in the ticket with a request for trial, and make sure you wish to dispute the evidence. Safer bet if you don't mind the trip, is to go hand it in in person at the court house for where you got it.

Second part is you should get a letter in about 2-4 weeks with your trial date, this likely won't be for a good 6-9 months later. Now you want to make a disclosure request. They have cookie cutter forms in the court house, but there is more things you will want to ask for specifically, so make your own with all the information on theirs, plus a request for additional information, such as what radar the officer used, manual sections related to operation and testing procedures, typed copies of any notes the officer has, and a copy of his records for testing the radar device on that day. The clerk may give you a hard time about handing in your own, but tell them its perfectly legal, and you'll just fax one in if they don't take it. Others suggest just faxing it in regardless, keep a record of the transmission. Also don't include your phone number, just mailing address.

Once you do get your disclosure ( call the office and ask about it if you don't after a month), take a look through it for any glaring errors, they'd have to be fairly blatant errors mind you. Now would be a good time to go for a consultation with a para legal, and they'll give you a good idea if there is any good chance to win. If the para legal thinks its mostly hopeless, your down to two options.

Is the court date more than 13 months from the time of the incident, You can go the 11b route. Otherwise you can show up, see if the officer is there. If he is, go and pay your ticket, or plead guilty to the 10 over. They'll only raise the charge if you want to fight it. If the officer doesn't show, they have no evidence against you, you win.

JP is only interested in if you were speeding or not, reason doesn't matter. Defense must be solid as the officer gets the benefit of the doubt, not you.

[ZX600]

Actually you will be surprised.... I am a big fan of cruise control in my car now to help me keep from speeding. I hit 9 points.... way tooo easily....

You hit 9 points once... not so bad (well its bad but well... ya know)
Hit 9 points again... and you best get your good suit in the dry cleaning cus guess who'll be going to court to prove why you should keep your license.

I hit 9 once.... learned my lesson... If I gotta be granny in my car on the road... I'm doing it with pride... noone is gonna take my M away from me.

I have hit 9 points 3 times, have got 3 letters telling me that any more and I will be having a chat with mr judge. I always get cut on some stupid slow speed dumb move and not monkeying around up north

[rafiki911]

Lol to late, my broker is pretty chillin tho, she said its not a big deal, just if I get to more tickets I should be worried, she said if I renew next year they prob won't even pull a record on me. Because she wouldn't be telling the insurance company of my 10 overSo no insurance impact besides I got one gimmie ticket left I guess. Should I still fight this one? Pay 40, take no points and have 1 ticket on my record. Or fight it, potentially lose and have to pay the non reduced fine and money to a paralegal. I'm sick to my stomach over this situation I've never had a ticket before so I don't wanna mess up

Your going to listen to someone that gets payed to lie to you??? My dad got one 10 over ticket and his insurance went up buy a good bit... fight your tickets. Best bet is to change dates a few times so the cop wont even be there.

Oh and what Golluk said.

[bww77]

Do some reading... http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dan.../demerit.shtml

Pretty sure he's saving you the points. And the fine is what? Barrie posts fine of $2.50/km over (http://www.police.barrie.on.ca/node/78), which makes that a $25 ticket, but I'm unsure what other regions cost. So what's the issue here? I'd call myself lucky and move on from it. Parking on a boulevard is worse at $50.

Though, I am not an expert or lawyer of any sort.

Cheers!

Thanks for the link... now I know how many points I'm getting nailed for! lol

[Holmes]

I've probably got around 350k km between my bike and trucks and I've never even been pulled over, and I speed all the time, you just gotta know when and where to do it. Luck will only get you so far, so I'm probably due for one soon, but I'm not gonna get a bunch in the same year!

No man. That is luck, not skill of any kind.

[2500Express]

No man. That is luck, not skill of any kind.

Ok wise guy, so when I drive the same locations all the time and slow down for the right spots where i've seen previous traps it's all luck? I'm not saying there is no luck involved at all, but I've avoided many tickets for knowing where they've been before.

If i'm in a new area, I'll go with the flow of traffic or wait for a rabbit to tag behind.

[kiwi]

Fight it .

It's your right to go to trial, and after you realise how much bikers are picked on you will wish you had fought it.

[ThrottleThrow]

Fight it . It's your right to go to trial, and after you realise how much bikers are picked on you will wish you had fought it.

I know what its like to get picked on since march I have been pulled over 3 times for no reason at all, I watched a cop follow me for 15 km, finally pulling me over to check my insurance. His reasoning, I was a kid on a "sportbike" (he assumed I was young because I was wearing nike shoes lol, talk about discrimination)But was also pleasntly suprised by how understanding and nice the cop was, all things considered. I feel like its a slap in the face if I go fight it mayb he won't be leanient on other bikers anymore. I feel like its karma, he was nice enough to reduce it for me, but I still want to fight itI'm torn lol

[FiReSTaRT]

Fight it. Jevco will treat it as a minor whether its the full amount or the reduced amount. Otherwise you have to be careful about not getting nailed again over 3 years or your insurance rate will go up in the 10% range over a period of 3 years. You typically can't mail it, so you'll have to go to court and fill out a form (make sure you check off the option that you do wish to dispute the officer's testimony). Typically, most of the tickets that get thrown out get thrown out because of the Holy Trinity:
1) The cop doesn't show up - 20-30% possibility
2) You don't get your full disclosure package - 40-50% possibility
3) The time between the offense date and the trial date is excessive (11b) - 20-30% possibility

All told, you have about 60-70% chance of getting off scot-free without the trial drama.

[rafiki911]

I know what its like to get picked on since march I have been pulled over 3 times for no reason at all, I watched a cop follow me for 15 km, finally pulling me over to check my insurance. His reasoning, I was a kid on a "sportbike" (he assumed I was young because I was wearing nike shoes lol, talk about discrimination)But was also pleasntly suprised by how understanding and nice the cop was, all things considered. I feel like its a slap in the face if I go fight it mayb he won't be leanient on other bikers anymore. I feel like its karma, he was nice enough to reduce it for me, but I still want to fight itI'm torn lol

He wasn't being nice... being nice would have been not giving you a ticket at all.

[Rob MacLennan]

People have outlined the possible ramifications both of fighting the ticket, and not fighting it. No one, but you, can determine whether you should fight it. The one piece of advice, that I will give, is not to fight it unless you have some actual legal theory, with which to fight it. Don't just go to court, in hopes that the cop won't show. Do your research.

[nesobriquet]

Lol to late, my broker is pretty chillin tho, she said its not a big deal, just if I get to more tickets I should be worried, she said if I renew next year they prob won't even pull a record on me. Because she wouldn't be telling the insurance company of my 10 overSo no insurance impact besides I got one gimmie ticket left I guess. Should I still fight this one? Pay 40, take no points and have 1 ticket on my record. Or fight it, potentially lose and have to pay the non reduced fine and money to a paralegal. I'm sick to my stomach over this situation I've never had a ticket before so I don't wanna mess up

Sorry to hear about this ticket, especially since he chose you over the cars in front of you going even faster...but you need to slow down. Slow down with your plan of action. At 940am you asked if you should tell your broker, and at 1140 someone said NO! But you went ahead and told them before waiting for, and reading any advice. There is a wealth of information and strategy online, to help offset some of the cheap shots that all drivers fall victim to, but especially bikes it seems.

In this day and age, the cops, your insurance broker, Bell Cda, HydroOne, Rogers and even your paid financial planner, are all NOT your friends. So telling your insurance about a ticket you have not been convicted of yet, was not smart. Whether she was cool or not, her job is to save the ins co money, and you can be sure you were right then and there, put on a watch list of some sort..even if to be near the top of the pile to have an abstract done on.

I know the sick stomach feeling. It sucks, but does tend to get less and less as you get a few days behind you and after reading, and you have a more definitive plan. I hate that the cop picked you, BEHIND the faster cars. It is why I said what I said at the beginning of the paragraph above this one.

[FiReSTaRT]

People have outlined the possible ramifications both of fighting the ticket, and not fighting it. No one, but you, can determine whether you should fight it. The one piece of advice, that I will give, is not to fight it unless you have some actual legal theory, with which to fight it. Don't just go to court, in hopes that the cop won't show. Do your research.

The least you should do is apply for a court date and ask to examine the Crown's evidence (disclosure). It should give you more ammunition for your defense.

[Metastable]

I know what its like to get picked on since march I have been pulled over 3 times for no reason at all, I watched a cop follow me for 15 km, finally pulling me over to check my insurance. His reasoning, I was a kid on a "sportbike" (he assumed I was young because I was wearing nike shoes lol, talk about discrimination)But was also pleasntly suprised by how understanding and nice the cop was, all things considered. I feel like its a slap in the face if I go fight it mayb he won't be leanient on other bikers anymore. I feel like its karma, he was nice enough to reduce it for me, but I still want to fight itI'm torn lol

Why would you not fight the ticket? Because you might have to end up paying an extra $170-190? What happens if you get another ticket in the next 3 years? Hmmmm

Listen to what Golluk and company are saying. At the very LEAST what you do is you:
- Ask for a court date
- After you get that, you ask for disclosure
- If you chicken out before court because you see the cop there, just go speak with the Crown before the court session you are in starts, and ask to plea guilty to 10 over.

In reality if there were other cars around you, then there are ways to poke holes in the cops radar readings. However, you need to get disclosure to see what he has in terms of notes.

Finally -> Your insurance won't care if it is the actual speed or the reduced speed. Fight the darn thing and see where it goes. At the very least you will learn some stuff about your legal system. Oh and don't worry about offending the cop. He isn't going to go easy on other motorcyclists. I had a "nice" cop tell me to go to court and he MADE UP a speed then when I asked for disclosure, he MADE UP ANOTHER completely different speed to what we talked to on the side of the road. They're often full of bull.... some are nice, but if things happened the way you described them too, then he's probably just acting nice.

One more thing - WRITE EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENED DOWN NOW.... so it is still fresh in your head.

[toysareforboys]

Should I still fight this one?

FIGHT IT AS IF YOUR LICENSE IS ON THE LINE! One day it will be, DON'T START NOW!

Fight it to the death. TAKE NO DEALS! Nothing, especially on court day! It's either "not guilty" or "FULLY DAMN 32 OVER GUILTY!", there are no other options.

FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT.

-Jamie M.