Working out! Fitness! Nutrition!

[dardania]

I am in the east end! Thanks recip.

u should go check out olympian martial arts they have tuesday n thursday nights martial training for adults the takewondo master is very good, i went there lastyear trained for 3 months boxin kickboxin wrestling etc... i was heaving a blast but i had to quit for 2 reasons
1 i couldnt stop smoking
2 work was gettin hard (marble-granite 200-300 pound to work with all day)
o yeah and i take my son there 4 times a week so it was to much for me


**** i forgot ellesmire and bellamy.

[knowledge]

Hungjai, if you aren't going as super serious as these guys, I would just eat food with a lot of protein in it. I used to take shakes last year. The trade off for me not drinking shakes seems to be slower healing but I get better gains and better muscle retention when I've missed up to a month at the gym. But honestly, a lot of people that that take protein take whey more than they actually need (haha...get it?). A lot of people will put like 3, 4, or 5 scoops in their drink when their body can't even use close to all of it.
-----------
& thanks for the tip on simple vs. complex carbs. I've started eating about 2 hours before my workout (so the food kicks in about halfway through my workout). Now I just have to experiment with a little more timing and different foods and I should be fine.

The only thing that sucks is that I think my metabolism's finally starting to slow down (which makes no sense, since I'm doing cardio 3-4 times a week). It's getting harder and harder to eat properly since I'm not hungry all the time like I used to be :S

[Taleb]

A quick tip. Never supplement protein bars/shakes unless you find it hard to eat and get your requirement throughout the day using real food.

Back in the day people used to say have a protein shake after a workout as this is your anabolic window for growing muscle. This has been proven false. Visit bodybuilding.com for more info. Nutrient timing does not matter. Also, the old school thought of 6-7 meals a day to keep metabolism high is also proven false. Does not matter what time or when you eat as long as you eat right.

Another myth is not to eat before bed. Also, false. Eat whenever and where ever you want. Keep in mind your goals (weight loss, muscle mass) and eat accordingly.

If you can try to make your own protein bars, the ones sold commercially are not all that good, too much simple carbs.

Would love to see where you get your proof from.

[AdRath]

Would love to see where you get your proof from.

I was wondering the exact same thing.

[Flashmonkey]

u should go check out olympian martial arts they have tuesday n thursday nights martial training for adults the takewondo master is very good, i went there lastyear trained for 3 months boxin kickboxin wrestling etc... i was heaving a blast but i had to quit for 2 reasons
1 i couldnt stop smoking
2 work was gettin hard (marble-granite 200-300 pound to work with all day)
o yeah and i take my son there 4 times a week so it was to much for me


**** i forgot ellesmire and bellamy.

Oh I pass by that place a lot. Hrmm...maybe I'll check it out....someday. Martial arts stuff is expensive haha.

[Flashmonkey]

A quick tip. Never supplement protein bars/shakes unless you find it hard to eat and get your requirement throughout the day using real food.

Back in the day people used to say have a protein shake after a workout as this is your anabolic window for growing muscle. This has been proven false. Visit bodybuilding.com for more info. Nutrient timing does not matter. Also, the old school thought of 6-7 meals a day to keep metabolism high is also proven false. Does not matter what time or when you eat as long as you eat right.

Another myth is not to eat before bed. Also, false. Eat whenever and where ever you want. Keep in mind your goals (weight loss, muscle mass) and eat accordingly.

If you can try to make your own protein bars, the ones sold commercially are not all that good, too much simple carbs.

No disrespect intended here (seriously), as I have nothing but respect for anyone brave enough to commit to the iron game, but unless you've tested these theories out yourself with tangible results, I'd suggest putting a disclaimer in there somewhere.

[Ijaz]

No disrespect intended here (seriously), as I have nothing but respect for anyone brave enough to commit to the iron game, but unless you've tested these theories out yourself with tangible results, I'd suggest putting a disclaimer in there somewhere.

No offence taken. I actually used to work for GNC and we were taught a lot of wrong information. I started getting into bodybuilding (seriously) recently. My main source is bodybuilding.com in the nutrition section. Register there and ask questions. These are things that I am doing and getting results off of, and what more and more people are becoming aware of. I didn't believe at first either because I grew up being taught differently in gym class, from friends, and from other people. Just do some research and you will see.

1 more thing I hear the most as well is that your body can only digest 30g of protein at a time. This is also a myth, there is such a thing as too much but you can eat a good amount of protein and your body will digest it over time. It's like saying a 100 pound guy can digest the same amount as a guy who weighs 200 pounds with solid muscle mass.

Also, genetics and body type has a HUGE role in how easily you can lose weight/gain muscle. Not nutrient timing. To lose weight eat 500 cals below daily requirements, to gain eat 500 more than total expenditure for the day.

[Roasted]

No disrespect intended here (seriously), as I have nothing but respect for anyone brave enough to commit to the iron game, but unless you've tested these theories out yourself with tangible results, I'd suggest putting a disclaimer in there somewhere.

Most of what he's saying is true though.

Nutrient timing and meal frequency IS mostly bs. Although I think timing carbs to morning and around workouts makes sense for the sake of having energy, not so much for strictly weight loss. I haven't had a "after workout" shake my entire cut and well....I think I look pretty good. When I mentioned this to a GNC employee they looked at me like I was crazy.

Protein bars are worthless. They are good when you "can't have a real meal" but they are no substitute for real food and I would NEVER eat a protein bar when cutting, especially for a contest. Protein shakes are alright, but people getting 100+ grams of protein a day out of shakes are doing it wrong IMHO. It's ok to supplement your diet with shakes but it shouldn't be the basis of a diet.

[Flashmonkey]

I don't have any issues with anything he's actually said, and while most of the concepts that he talks about have merits, it seems as though most of his knowledge is rooted in what he's read on the internet as opposed to what he's actually experienced out in the field. While intellectual research on the subject matter has it's place, unless he's put in the actual man-hours in the gym and in the kitchen using those concepts, then he should be hesitant in stating them as hard facts.

All I'm saying is that he needs to make sure that people understand where he's coming from so that some less experienced gym rat reading his posts don't accidentally throw out the baby with the bath water. While a lot of the old bodybuilding concepts had their errors, not all of them were stupid.

[Ijaz]

^ Agreed. But, I am speaking from my own experience as well. I have gone on and off to gym for the past few years with no real motivation to change. Starting around December of last year I have been going regularly. I am currently cutting as I have excess body fat. I used to weigh 275 pounds sitting at 6 feet. Now I weight roughly 230 pounds using what I have learned and done research on.

Also, others who have been doing weight training/bodybuilding for much longer have also been using these concepts and have gotten results. Now that's not to say that what works for me will work for you. You will need to experiment keeping in mind the basics and throwing out the old myths.

[rafiki911]

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Taleb-...57484877641015

Feel free to network

lol awesome

[fastar1]

I don't know the first thing about bodybuilding but one thing I have learned through life is that incompetence is everywhere. I mean EVERYWHERE. It's at all levels, several layers deep, fertilised with BS and energised with misconceptions and sheer stupidity. So when I read something like this;

I actually used to work for GNC and we were taught a lot of wrong information.

...then I know this guy has already cut through several layers of crap by this point and is getting a little bit closer to factual truth that he was (and a lot closer than most people will ever be).

[Ijaz]

I don't know the first thing about bodybuilding but one thing I have learned through life is that incompetence is everywhere. I mean EVERYWHERE. It's at all levels, several layers deep, fertilised with BS and energised with misconceptions and sheer stupidity. So when I read something like this;



...then I know this guy has already cut through several layers of crap by this point and is getting a little bit closer to factual truth that he was (and a lot closer than most people will ever be).

It was ridiculous the amount of B.S. we were taught and expected to feed the customers to make a sale. I actually used to work for the GNC at Eaton Center (second largest in sales volume in the world, top sales store is in Hawaii). The guys who I used to work with had to sell this BS as our jobs depended on it. A lot of the guys who didn't spew out the BS we were told were either fired or ended up getting offered jobs working for product vendors.

One more thing to look for. Most GNC employees are either women, or have never set foot inside a gym. I am not sexist by any means, but no guy should be taking advice on working out/weightlifting from women and middle aged immigrants just looking to make commission. Now that's not to say that there aren't people who know what they are doing. It's just they are far and few in between.

If anyone has any questions regarding anything. I'll do my best to answer and provide proof where necessary.

[Flashmonkey]

Haha back in the day the only reason I went into GNC was because there was this cute chick behind the counter. Whatever gets people in the stores, right?

[toshison]

It was ridiculous the amount of B.S. we were taught and expected to feed the customers to make a sale. I actually used to work for the GNC at Eaton Center (second largest in sales volume in the world, top sales store is in Hawaii). The guys who I used to work with had to sell this BS as our jobs depended on it. A lot of the guys who didn't spew out the BS we were told were either fired or ended up getting offered jobs working for product vendors.

Honestly, the supplement industry is the biggest reason why these myths continue to live on and just won't die.

You'll never hear guys like those total con-artists who work for MuscleTech saying that you should eat whole foods whenever possible and that meal timing is not important. Of course not, they will continue to tell you that you need to eat 6 times a day and that between your 3 square meals of chicken breast, brown rice and steam veges, that you need to supplement with MRPs & Protein shakes. And lets not forget the expensive cocktail of supplements would have customers subscribing to. Those silly little rules like only being able to absorb x amount of protein in a single meal. Its all a joke to me now.

I think, what also helps prevent the myths from dying off is that to a degree they still work. A lot of guys follow the 6 meals a day plan and chow on a lot of expensive supplements and achieve good success. So, it may be hard for the less informed to really see why there is a problem with this formula.

For me the problem with this formula is that I do not think it is the most efficient way to achieve the best possible results. It is a way to do it but I don't think its the best way.

I use to train 5-6 a week, eat 6 times a day, PWO shakes, I use to watch my fat consumption (esp saturated) and did what I thought was the right thing. I now train 3 times a week, eat 3 times a day consisting of eat meat/fish/eggs, tubers, veges and fruit. I also eat lots of fat. I also track my results and can see that I am much better off since making the switch. Body composition is better, Im stronger, less wear and tear on my body, my eating patterns are far easier to deal with. That is just my experience though.

[Ijaz]

^ Very true!

I am going to list some "myths" regarding bodybuilding

- Nutrient timing is not important
- Carb timing can give you that little extra boost in energy PWO, but do not expect much if you are cutting
- Eating fats plays a vital part in aiding fat loss and helps you feel satiated longer
- You do not need to eat 5-6 times a day to keep metabolism high
- There is no such thing as "toning"
- Heavy weight training burns more calories
- Your body does not automatically **** out any excess protein above 30g
- Having a mid-night snack is not bad as long as it fits into your macros
- You could lose weight eating pure carbs as long as its below maintenance (although this is not very good for bodycomp and high chances of diabetes)
- To lose weight = eat 500 cals less than maintenance (doing a drastic cut will cause more muscle loss than is desired)
- To gain weight = eat 500 cals more than maintenance
- If you are anything above 15% BF no matter how much crunches and ab exersises you do, will you see abs
- Everyone has abs. To see it = get to a low enough BF%
- You can not target weight loss to certain sections (it occurs throughout the whole body, some areas may see faster results)
- There is no such thing as an anabolic windows where you need to have protein right after a workout
- Most supplements in the market are pure BS (look for tried and tested products, ex. Muscletech's claim that you can gain 14 pounds in 21 days through Cell-Tech is pure BS)

Can't think of anymore atm. If I do I'll add it in.

[Taleb]

[QUOTE=Ijaz;1575437]^ Very true!

I am going to list some "myths" regarding bodybuilding



- You do not need to eat 5-6 times a day to keep metabolism high.

"healthy snacks" in between meals does keep your metabolism going. Doesn't speed it up but keeps it steady and avoids the risk of potential cortisol hormone release issues.

- Heavy weight training burns more calories
Yes heavy weight training does burn calories, "given" your heart rate is kept high, meaning very short breaks between sets. But for an already thin person looking to gain size "heavy weight training" will get you bigger.

- There is no such thing as an anabolic windows where you need to have protein right after a workout

Yes you do have a window after your work out as thats when your muscle cells are pumped and can intake more nutrients (protein).

Another thing you said in the past, I really did not care to comment on but I will comment on it since I'm already responding was your "its ok to eat carbs before bed" or something a long those lines.

I completely " DISAGREE". I would say that genetically lean people can get away with it yes, but to the 95% of others who have to kick there own *** to stay fit; they SHOULD NOT have carbs before bed as they have no use for it while there sleeping and it will store in there unwanted areas (as they will not be active to burn).


You sound like a mature experienced and polite individual.
I agree with some of your knowledge statements. But the above mentioned ones I disagree.

[Taleb]

^ Agreed. But, I am speaking from my own experience as well. I have gone on and off to gym for the past few years with no real motivation to change. Starting around December of last year I have been going regularly. I am currently cutting as I have excess body fat. I used to weigh 275 pounds sitting at 6 feet. Now I weight roughly 230 pounds using what I have learned and done research on.

Also, others who have been doing weight training/bodybuilding for much longer have also been using these concepts and have gotten results. Now that's not to say that what works for me will work for you. You will need to experiment keeping in mind the basics and throwing out the old myths.

45 lbs loss is a great accomplishment. Good work.

[Taleb]

lol awesome

Thank you.

[toshison]

RE: meal frequency - in case you are interested in the debate about meal frequency. Lyle MacDonald I think does a good job on the topic in this article. I think he takes an unbiased approach to it.
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/res...ch-review.html

RE: Post workout window - I for one do not think of this period as a myth. I think there is merit here so I agree with Taleb. For me, I don't do the PWO shake, instead my post workout meal is my biggest meal of the day. Calorie & protein wise its about 50% of my daily intake in one meal.... As you can imagine, its my favorite meal of the day!