Rider Training Institute (RTI) Excessively Detailed Review, plus tips that helped me

[viper84737]

So I just completed my M2 this past weekend at RTI in Toronto down. I must say I had a very positive experience with them and that I would recommend them to others. I chose them because I heard great things about them, mostly from here, and because they were located conveniently for my particular commute to them. Their main office is at 30 Duncan in downtown Toronto where their class was held and their practical training arena at 20 Polson down by the docks.

I had never ridden a bike beyond a human-powered bicycle, and was about as fresh to motorcycling as anyone could have been. I did know how a clutch worked intimately, however, and have driven manual transmission cars in the past, and I will say that it helped a lot with clutch control on a motorcycle (it's identical). If you have friends who have manual transmission cars and can persuade them to take you to a parking lot to help you learn, you'll be ahead of the game for sure.

The instructors were diverse in how they approached teaching, while maintaining exceptional professionalism the entire time. I got the feeling that they wanted you to learn what they had to teach you, which was in excess of their final M1 exit test requirements. It's overkill, but that's exactly the way I like it, personally. Their feedback was only constructive and served only to make you a better and safer rider, nothing more. If one approaches these practical lessons with a blank slated and open mind and listen carefully to the details therein, learning any lesson therein becomes exceedingly simple.

The learning started the prior Thursday in class, where some basic concepts were taught from an academic standpoint. No notebooks are necessary, just pay attention. I learn very quickly but I felt it might have been a little rushed for a general audience. There wasn't anything revolutionary or earth-shattering in the class, so I can see why they went through them rather quickly. In the practical session over the weekend, their teaching methodology was to take a much slower ground-up approach. They assume everyone in the class has zero riding experience of any kind, and step-wise introduce them to concepts that advance them through the process until the end of the weekend, at which point the test is conducted in the same parking lot.

My fellow classmates were mostly new riders, some had ridden a little on bikes they had purchased by having their M1s, and I think one guy had ridden years ago but stopped for over a decade and wanted to refresh things, but everyone pretty much started with a similar background -- zero, or almost zero. Out of about 20, there were a mix of 16 males and 4 females, and the ages of the students ranged from as low as 22 to as high as mid-50s. Nobody seemed judgmental, or egotistical, or there to prove a point of any kind, though most people had the usual shyness I witness pretty much everywhere I go. On the whole, everyone was there to learn and pass that M1 exit test at the end of the weekend. I presume every class will likely be similar to my own experiences.

As for the test at the end of the weekend itself, this is how it works at RTI: The parking lot they use is equipped with a lot of pylons which are in use throughout the weekend as temporary road/lane markers, and the drills you perform throughout the two days are what you are tested on in the identical configurations you learned on. You learn mostly motorcycle operation basics on the first day, and learn the stuff you're going to be tested on, on the second day. Prior to the test, we had 45 minutes to practise each of the drills we learned. I felt this was a little short, given there were long lineups at the more challenging drills and the detailed feedback being given to struggling riders did eat up a bit more of that time than I was fully happy with.

There are 8 tested sections and each test section is timed. The timings for some of the sections are limited to as little as 1.3 seconds, but this shouldn't worry a prospective student, because in those sections you already have momentum and have to get through 2 sets of pylons at speed, ensuring that you meet a minimum speed requirement before actually performing that specific test. So for example, you start off from a full stop, get up to speed, pass the first set of pylons, the timer starts, then you pass the second set of pylons and the timer stops, and THEN you perform the task, such as braking on a curve, or an emergency swerve, etc. It's mostly like this, there are some variations, but the point I'm trying to make is that you have a very reasonable time to complete each test section if you've assertively accelerated all weekend long, which I recommend you do. Not doing so makes you more prone to stalling and makes you overall less confident with balance and minimum times.

The testing involves starting off with zero demerit points. You are allowed to accumulate 11 points. 12 or more and you're asked to come back for a retest, which I can only presume is the following weekend, at the earliest, as you're not allowed to be retested on the same day. You can accumulate demerit points in a variety of ways -- exceeding the lines, exceeding the maximum allocated times, failing to stop within the box, etc, etc, and not every infraction gets you the same points. Some are worth more than 1, I presume. I wouldn't be able to tell you what's worth what, and they say you shouldn't even be worrying about it anyway, and I agree. Just focus on doing what you're asked to do.

Tips: Given that I entered with zero riding experience and literally aced my M1 exit test while I watched others not fare so well, I will tell you things that helped me along the way in the hopes that they will help you, too.

1) Listen carefully and pay attention to details.

2) Don't be afraid of making a mistake, as it will cause you to second-guess yourself and that's terrible. Hands-on learning involves a lot of trial-and-error. Just be sure to learn from the mistake, and don't chastise yourself when you do make them, as making a mistake does not make a statement about your validity as a person. It's ok to make mistakes, even more than once, just as long as you're making progress in learning from them.

3) Don't be afraid of asking questions in front of others. Nobody's there to judge you and everyone else is a giant noob just like you. Several times I had to ask questions on behalf of other people, and had I not done so, they would not have received their answers. Be brave! If you don't hear the answer, ask again! If you don't hear the answer a second time, ASK AGAIN.

4) When you accelerate, do so assertively and with purpose, get some speed, you'll need it to not be too slow in timed sections of the test. The brakes and tire grip on these machines will exceed your expectations, too.

5) Don't fear the test! It's natural to get nervous when you're being evaluated, especially since this is an objective competence test (in that it's not subjective at all). Pretty much everyone all weekend long had sufficient riding skills to pass, but they all got nervous at test time. One girl was riding quite proficiently but on the hardest test section stalled the bike and her nerves were shot from that point. She broke down in tears on the track and it was a psychological battle from her from that point on. The instructors rushed in to try to keep her spirits up and to encourage her to continue, and she did continue with the rest of the test sections, though I believe she was asked to come back for a retest because her errors only compounded from that point on, since her spirit was broken. She absolutely had the skills to pass the test all weekend long, though. Point is, don't be afraid to fail. There's a free retest next weekend anyway!

6) Have fun. It's a lot of fun all weekend long. One of the instructors described it as the most fun you can have in a parking lot with your clothes on, and he was right.

That's it, hope this helps!

[ekzeL]

That...was a long read. Good on you and congratulations. I also did my M1X @ RTI except in the North York location.

[rafiki911]

RTI was great, I did my inclass at duncan and the riding portion in King City. So much fun!!!

[LDSouza]

I just completed the Riding Basics course with RTI and passed the M2 test. There were 20 people (13 men, 7 women) in our class on only 11 passed (10 men, 1 woman). I was a little surprised with this given how clear and easy-to-follow the instructors were and how straightforward the Ministry test was. I would be interested to hear whether this is a typical pass rate.

I had never ridden a motorcycle before and can say that RTI gave me the basic skills and confidence I needed in a day and a half. One small bit of advice is to not be afraid to use the throttle. For the test we were only in first and second gear and it took only a minimal amout of effort to keep the bike within the courses at that speed. I'll go back to RTI for the M2 Exit exam.

[Mateo]

Just passed the M2 test with RTI at the north york location. Out of 19 people 19 people passed... They're good. I recommend it to everyone!!!

[sundancekid]

So I just completed my M2 this past weekend at RTI in Toronto down. I must say I had a very positive experience with them and that I would recommend them to others. I chose them because I heard great things about them, mostly from here, and because they were located conveniently for my particular commute to them. Their main office is at 30 Duncan in downtown Toronto where their class was held and their practical training arena at 20 Polson down by the docks.

I had never ridden a bike beyond a human-powered bicycle, and was about as fresh to motorcycling as anyone could have been. I did know how a clutch worked intimately, however, and have driven manual transmission cars in the past, and I will say that it helped a lot with clutch control on a motorcycle (it's identical). If you have friends who have manual transmission cars and can persuade them to take you to a parking lot to help you learn, you'll be ahead of the game for sure.

The instructors were diverse in how they approached teaching, while maintaining exceptional professionalism the entire time. I got the feeling that they wanted you to learn what they had to teach you, which was in excess of their final M1 exit test requirements. It's overkill, but that's exactly the way I like it, personally. Their feedback was only constructive and served only to make you a better and safer rider, nothing more. If one approaches these practical lessons with a blank slated and open mind and listen carefully to the details therein, learning any lesson therein becomes exceedingly simple.

The learning started the prior Thursday in class, where some basic concepts were taught from an academic standpoint. No notebooks are necessary, just pay attention. I learn very quickly but I felt it might have been a little rushed for a general audience. There wasn't anything revolutionary or earth-shattering in the class, so I can see why they went through them rather quickly. In the practical session over the weekend, their teaching methodology was to take a much slower ground-up approach. They assume everyone in the class has zero riding experience of any kind, and step-wise introduce them to concepts that advance them through the process until the end of the weekend, at which point the test is conducted in the same parking lot.

My fellow classmates were mostly new riders, some had ridden a little on bikes they had purchased by having their M1s, and I think one guy had ridden years ago but stopped for over a decade and wanted to refresh things, but everyone pretty much started with a similar background -- zero, or almost zero. Out of about 20, there were a mix of 16 males and 4 females, and the ages of the students ranged from as low as 22 to as high as mid-50s. Nobody seemed judgmental, or egotistical, or there to prove a point of any kind, though most people had the usual shyness I witness pretty much everywhere I go. On the whole, everyone was there to learn and pass that M1 exit test at the end of the weekend. I presume every class will likely be similar to my own experiences.

As for the test at the end of the weekend itself, this is how it works at RTI: The parking lot they use is equipped with a lot of pylons which are in use throughout the weekend as temporary road/lane markers, and the drills you perform throughout the two days are what you are tested on in the identical configurations you learned on. You learn mostly motorcycle operation basics on the first day, and learn the stuff you're going to be tested on, on the second day. Prior to the test, we had 45 minutes to practise each of the drills we learned. I felt this was a little short, given there were long lineups at the more challenging drills and the detailed feedback being given to struggling riders did eat up a bit more of that time than I was fully happy with.

There are 8 tested sections and each test section is timed. The timings for some of the sections are limited to as little as 1.3 seconds, but this shouldn't worry a prospective student, because in those sections you already have momentum and have to get through 2 sets of pylons at speed, ensuring that you meet a minimum speed requirement before actually performing that specific test. So for example, you start off from a full stop, get up to speed, pass the first set of pylons, the timer starts, then you pass the second set of pylons and the timer stops, and THEN you perform the task, such as braking on a curve, or an emergency swerve, etc. It's mostly like this, there are some variations, but the point I'm trying to make is that you have a very reasonable time to complete each test section if you've assertively accelerated all weekend long, which I recommend you do. Not doing so makes you more prone to stalling and makes you overall less confident with balance and minimum times.

The testing involves starting off with zero demerit points. You are allowed to accumulate 11 points. 12 or more and you're asked to come back for a retest, which I can only presume is the following weekend, at the earliest, as you're not allowed to be retested on the same day. You can accumulate demerit points in a variety of ways -- exceeding the lines, exceeding the maximum allocated times, failing to stop within the box, etc, etc, and not every infraction gets you the same points. Some are worth more than 1, I presume. I wouldn't be able to tell you what's worth what, and they say you shouldn't even be worrying about it anyway, and I agree. Just focus on doing what you're asked to do.

Tips: Given that I entered with zero riding experience and literally aced my M1 exit test while I watched others not fare so well, I will tell you things that helped me along the way in the hopes that they will help you, too.

1) Listen carefully and pay attention to details.

2) Don't be afraid of making a mistake, as it will cause you to second-guess yourself and that's terrible. Hands-on learning involves a lot of trial-and-error. Just be sure to learn from the mistake, and don't chastise yourself when you do make them, as making a mistake does not make a statement about your validity as a person. It's ok to make mistakes, even more than once, just as long as you're making progress in learning from them.

3) Don't be afraid of asking questions in front of others. Nobody's there to judge you and everyone else is a giant noob just like you. Several times I had to ask questions on behalf of other people, and had I not done so, they would not have received their answers. Be brave! If you don't hear the answer, ask again! If you don't hear the answer a second time, ASK AGAIN.

4) When you accelerate, do so assertively and with purpose, get some speed, you'll need it to not be too slow in timed sections of the test. The brakes and tire grip on these machines will exceed your expectations, too.

5) Don't fear the test! It's natural to get nervous when you're being evaluated, especially since this is an objective competence test (in that it's not subjective at all). Pretty much everyone all weekend long had sufficient riding skills to pass, but they all got nervous at test time. One girl was riding quite proficiently but on the hardest test section stalled the bike and her nerves were shot from that point. She broke down in tears on the track and it was a psychological battle from her from that point on. The instructors rushed in to try to keep her spirits up and to encourage her to continue, and she did continue with the rest of the test sections, though I believe she was asked to come back for a retest because her errors only compounded from that point on, since her spirit was broken. She absolutely had the skills to pass the test all weekend long, though. Point is, don't be afraid to fail. There's a free retest next weekend anyway!

6) Have fun. It's a lot of fun all weekend long. One of the instructors described it as the most fun you can have in a parking lot with your clothes on, and he was right.

That's it, hope this helps!

I did my RTI course at the Seneca King campus in 2009. We had 1 female and 3 male instructors. Two of the male instructors were absolutely terrific! They were patient and they gave feedback that was constructive and respectful. Unfortunately the female and the 3rd male instructor (the male had the MTO signing authority) were not so nice.

They often yelled and made sarcastic or smarta$$ comments at the students for making mistakes; it reminded me of the ***** they said to me when I was enlisted in the military! It upset me a lot that I paid several hundred dollars to RTI only to be verbally abused all weekend by 2 of their staff. I waited until I turned in my paper work to the MTO before I expressed my concerns to RTI about the conduct of their instructors, in case they decided to revoke my papers because they didn't like what I said.

Another observation I made was at several points in the day each instructor (even the ones I liked) spent 5-10 minutes texting or e-mailing when they should have been observing, evaluating and supervising the students. When the instructors are distracted other students and instructors could be put in danger. Before you think, "they were in a parking lot, what could really go wrong?". The answer is a lot! On the first day in 1st gear a student crashed one of the bikes and injured or broke his leg. Instead of getting his M2 he got crutches; I know this because he showed up on day 2 to spectate.

One last note, before you go saying "well that's just your opinion about those instructors", it really isn't. I even mentioned the fact that I didn't care much for the female and other male instructor, he (the instructor I liked) basically said he had told them in the past that they need to improve the way they treat the students. If he admitted that to me, a student he didn't know from Adam, that's saying something!

If you are thinking about signing up for a course you may want to mention to the person booking it that you only want instructors who will act professionally and treat you with respect. I'm sure the answer will be "All of our instructors are nice." But the very fact that you made such a statement hopefully is a subtle reminder that the best way to have a reputation Good or Bad is by word of mouth.

"And that's the w0rd!" (Colbert)

[toekneekey]

Just passed the M2 test with RTI at the north york location. Out of 19 people 19 people passed... They're good. I recommend it to everyone!!!

I was working in that area that day, was wondering which motorcycle course it was from, found out it was RTI. You might've seen a random security guard staring at you guys from the roof, cuz that was me

[hc7]

i did my m1exit course with rti in guelph in 2009. i was the youngest there at 18 and with no riding/manual transmission experience, just decent on a bicycle and no driving experience other than with driving instructors, it all seemed a bit overwhelming at first. i was one of the few with zero experience there. its funny, i was so young i needed a parental consent form, but my parents don't live in canada so one of the older guys there signed as my guardian. lol.

i thought the instructors were fantastic. they were super helpful, offered only constructive criticism and support and made sure each person got some feedback. i remember i dropped the bike when i used too much front brake and did a stoppie...did NOT expect anything like that and it caught me COMPLETELY off guard. even then, they gave me good feedback and were extremely positive. i still remember what they said and now that i've got a bike i try to be as smooth as i can whenever i brake.

if i remember correctly, pretty much everyone passed. just one or two students had to be retested. we also had someone drop in on the sunday just for a retest.

gona be doing my m2exit with rti in downtown toronto in may. figured i'd go again since i had such a good experience and will probably get some great feedback and guidance.

[haisam10]

Did mine at Oakville. Great experience and I felt I learned a lot.

[Katatonic]

i did my m1exit course with rti in guelph in 2009. i was the youngest there at 18 and with no riding/manual transmission experience, just decent on a bicycle and no driving experience other than with driving instructors, it all seemed a bit overwhelming at first. i was one of the few with zero experience there. its funny, i was so young i needed a parental consent form, but my parents don't live in canada so one of the older guys there signed as my guardian. lol.

i thought the instructors were fantastic. they were super helpful, offered only constructive criticism and support and made sure each person got some feedback. i remember i dropped the bike when i used too much front brake and did a stoppie...did NOT expect anything like that and it caught me COMPLETELY off guard. even then, they gave me good feedback and were extremely positive. i still remember what they said and now that i've got a bike i try to be as smooth as i can whenever i brake.

if i remember correctly, pretty much everyone passed. just one or two students had to be retested. we also had someone drop in on the sunday just for a retest.

gona be doing my m2exit with rti in downtown toronto in may. figured i'd go again since i had such a good experience and will probably get some great feedback and guidance.

Why don't you do the M2 exit with RTI in Guelph? No need to go into Toronto for that. I'll be taking my M2X with RTI in Guelph in June.

[hc7]

Why don't you do the M2 exit with RTI in Guelph? No need to go into Toronto for that. I'll be taking my M2X with RTI in Guelph in June.

may's the best time i can do it and they don't start the course until june in guelph. plus, i'm gona be out in downtown toronto for a good part of may so its close by.

[StunnaV]

How long before the course date did you actually register for the class? I'm looking to register at RTI (M2 course) for the May 14th-15th weekend and im just hoping im not put on some waiting list or anything.

[Vox]

How long before the course date did you actually register for the class? I'm looking to register at RTI (M2 course) for the May 14th-15th weekend and im just hoping im not put on some waiting list or anything.

You should book right away as they fill up fast! My course is coming up May 23rd & 24th down in T.O. and I remember the girl telling me that weekends were full in Toronto and North York, I booked early/mid April.... I cant wait! Had to pick the Monday, Tuesday as weekends are bad for me.

I noticed this is an old thread but still being contributed to. Can anyone tell me what bikes they use?

[meme]

cruisers - elimiators and mauraderers (sp?)
sporty - cbr 125s
dirt - TW200s
few standard bikes, titan 150s and a few 250 hyo comets still around.

[bboySushi]

I just completed the M1 exit course with RTI this past weekend and let me go through my experience a little bit.

First of all, my instructors were Luca, Stephen, Kenny and Dave. They were all great and fun, but especially I found Kenny and Dave to be extremely helpful.

The 3 hour class was standard stuff, it actually went by pretty fast.

Now, the actual riding days! The first two hours I hopped on a cbr125 and let me tell you, I was totally discouraged. After two hours of riding I was probably the worst in the class, I couldn't do a sharp left-right turn after a stop or ride slowly in circles. It was embarrassing to say the least. I've had minimal experience on a cbr125 before, but not doing slow speed maneuvers, just getting into first/second and making right turns. After the 15 minute break all the cbrs were taken so I hopped onto a Titan150. Since then though, I felt the throttle control a little easier and I got the hang of it. The only downside was that it was carbureted and you had to be in neutral to start the bike (which was a bit tricky sometimes). Magically by the end of the day I was really comfortable doing push steering, and the second day was similar. My confidence went from "omg I suck!" to "This is totally awesome and fun" and I ended up passing with no faults.

For those who want to get a heads up on the tests, well you'll get time to practise them for an hour anyways but here's the lowdown:

Tests 1&2: Starting from a stop, make a quick right turn, accelerate into mid second gear on slight curve, brake inside a box.

Tests 3&4: The reverse of tests 1&2, you do it backwards.

Test 5: Accelerate into mid second and make a left turn at speed.

Test 6: Accelerate into mid second and emergency stop.

Test 7: Accelerate into mid second and swerve either left/right (an instructor will give a signal)

Test 8: Accelerate into mid second and brake in a curve.

There were about 20 people, 3 of them girls and all but two people passed. One failure was from a fall on Test 6 (it was rainy), and the other failure was from going too slow on the tests (They must be done mid second gear).

So, my experience was great nobody is kidding when they say by the end of it you will learn a lot. By the end of the first day, clutching, riding friction zone, braking and all that stuff will become second nature.

I wholeheartedly encourage anyone getting their M2 to go to RTI. The start of riding may be daunting but don't get discouraged, you WILL get the hang of it!! I speak from experience!