"Countersteering"

[Grod]

Hello, i just got my m1 on tuesday and im doing the safety course this upcomming weekend. I was reading the motorcycle handbook again and came across "Countersteering". The book states that

"To make a motorcycle go in the direction you want, you must 'countersteer'. You do this by turning the handlebars in the direction opposite to where you want to go"

So their saying if you want to go to the right to turn your handlebars left?
I dont really get this concept, because on bicycles your not countersteering and on my pops motorcycle if u want to turn right then u turn ur handlebars to the right, so when do you actually use countersteering? In turns? Can anybody explain this to me?

Grod

[Gaggu P]

the "counter steer"isn't that much..its just a little push kinda thing..and you lean the way you want to turn..this isn't supposed to be done (counter steering) when your doing slow speed turns..obviously you turn the steering the way u want to go..but in higher speed turns you lean and counter steer..you dont have to counter steer much but thats what you do..you'll learn it all at the course..

[Rob MacLennan]

Think of it this way. The way that you turn on a motorcycle or bicycle that is travelling at more than a walking pace is to lean. If you want to turn, the bike has to lean. All that countersteering does is make the bike lean more quickly than just moving your weight would.

Try to picture this. You're moving along at 60 Kmh. Suddenly the wheel turns hard to the right by 45 degrees.. Which side of the bike are you going to get pitched off? It's the same principle, only less pronounced.

[RocketBoy]

After you start riding you wont even notice your countersteering.

[TheGradyTrain]

Also known as "Push Steering" Easy concept. To move right, push right. Move left, push left. By pushing in the direction of your intended travel. You have initiated the lean of the bike in that direction. Also you should be looking with your eyes and head in the same direction of travel. Push Steering only works when your speed is in excess of 25 km/h. Less than 25, you would be turning/steering in that direction of travel.

Hope this helps. At your CSC course they will expand on the above explanation for you. Have fun at your course. Remember your final exercise of the weekend is easier than all the ones before it.

After you start riding you wont even notice your countersteering.

As aprillia, mentioned. It does become second nature after awhile.

[Grod]

ok i think i understand now. So when ur taking a turn moderatly fast while leaning you countersteer a slight bit to balance yourself out and to not lowside the bike?

thanks alot guys, well at least now i wont turn into a wall while trying to go the other way, though im sure it will all be covered at the safety course.

Im at Humber this weekend. Im guessing its a good place to learn since it seems to be very popular, though i am kind of nervous too. Im not too familiar with driving manual. Should i practise on my buddies manual car to get the hang of the clutch or will i be able to learn everything at the course? Also is the M2 test hard or will i be able to get a hang of it all before the test by focusing and trying to learn as much as i can during the course?

Sorry for the barrage of questions, just trying to educate myself as much as i can.

Thanks for the serious replies too!!! Ive seen on these forums that more than half of some peoples replies are not very serious or helpful at all. Thanks again!!

Grod

Grod

[TheGradyTrain]

Also is the M2 test hard

Don't think of it as a test. Think of it as your final exercise.

It is nothing to get yourself all worked up about. As I mentioned in my earlier post. It is your final exercise of the weekend. It is also a simple one. Pay attention to your instructors. They will not lead you astray.

Each module of the final exercise is explained to you. Listen closely. Also they will demo each one for you as well. Another thing to keep in mind is, watch all the students that go before you. They too, are demo's. Maybe not of the official type. A demo noetheless.

Good luck.

[Rob MacLennan]

ok i think i understand now. So when ur taking a turn moderatly fast while leaning you countersteer a slight bit to balance yourself out and to not lowside the bike?
Grod

Nope, just to lean it and the lean makes you turn. If you've been riding, then you've been countersteering all along without realizing it. Knowing about it and using it conciously lets you get more out of it, like being able to turn faster.

[RocketBoy]

One thing I noticed about the test or final exercise is theyre mostly looking for speed. Most people fail the test because they take their time trying to make the turns and stops as smooth and perfect as possible. Each exercise is timed. You guys will have plenty of time to practise on the turns and stops that will be used for the final test. I recommend that once you get the basic idea of the exercise, practise your speed and make sure your able to do the exercise quick and easy.

[ArclightX]

Here is the best step-by-step description of countersteering that I think is out there that doesn't get bogged down with the physics/gyroscopic effect that is working behind the scenes to make it all happen that walks you through it in a easy to understand method.

Enjoy

[TheGradyTrain]

Here is the best step-by-step description of countersteering that I think is out there that doesn't get bogged down with the physics/gyroscopic effect that is working behind the scenes to make it all happen that walks you through it in a easy to understand method.

Enjoy

Excellent link.

[booenson]

An example of counter steering I like to use is when you were young, remember riding your bike at a decent speed and you all of a sudden had to swerve to the left really hard, and you'd fly off the right of the bike? Pretty much the same concept on a motorcycle, you are (on purpose, of course) making the bike lean over, it wants to "fall" in the direction of the momentum, so to say.

[topendz]

Grod....

Try riding along slowly in a straight line on a quiet road. Push gently on the bars on the side you would like to go and the bike will go in that direction. You can use this method to avoid objects in the road for example. Practice doing this avoiding man hole covers for example and use the same principle when cornering.

[rizvi]

"Countersteering is actually Push Steering. Push steering is an easier concept to grasp. To move right at any speed above 10mph PUSH on the right side of the handlebar grip. To move left at any speed above 10mph PUSH on the left side of the handlebar grip" [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countersteering]


The first time you do push steering correctly (prob. during the course) you will have a big smile on your face.

[suprPHREAK]

when riding along, you will find you do this intuitively. Its best not to think about it.

[Aminal]

A manual car is great, but it won't help with bike shifting much..... most people do worry about it, but after a few stalls you'll get the hang of it The course is to teach you these things, the test is just showing them you learned the material. Just listen and you'll do fine.
Cheers
Aminal

[Grod]

Thanks everyone, i guess i was thinking there was a lot more to countersteering. Seems to be ive been doing that all along on my bike Either way now i know and im also more confident about doing the m2 test.
Does anybody know if humber allows you to switch your course before the 3 days if you see rain in the forcast for the weekend of your course? Im supposed to be taking it this weekend but on the forecasts it says its raining so i was thinking of postponing it to the weekend after or should i just learn in the rain?

Grod

[RocketBoy]

hahah yeah, the course is rain or shine. Just bring some rain gear. You dont want to be riding when your wet.

[Silverstreak]

It's all about countersteer/push steer. People who freeze up part way through a turn are experiencing a failure to countersteer. Practise your countersteering everytime you get on the the bike because when you encounter an emergency you may forget and try to turn around it using logic (turn left by steering left).

Countersteering totally controls how far the bike leans over. You flick the bike with the handle bars. Countersteering isn't something that only happens at the beginning of a turn but all the way through. Countersteer is the only way a bike turns, all the other ***** hangin, knee dragin crap is simply an attempt to look cool. Maybe at race speeds those body movements play a role, but they still only play a supporting role. Without a really solid understanding of the gyroscopic effect and the impact it has on turning a bike, hanging your butt will do very little and in some cases may make you less stable. It's all about the handle bars and yes they do turn backwards. The sooner you get that into your head the longer you'll live.

[kelid]

Just to add, LOOK where you want to go. If you're travelling at a speed and don't know if you need to push steer or turn the wheel, just look where you want to go, and the 'force' will be with you.