Must I learn Manual To Ride?

[rfid]

Are we all forgetting to tell this guy that shifting is probably the second best thing about riding, next to leaning?

Why would you not want to learn manual to ride!

[zoomerthe1]

I disagree with this statement.

if you have experience driving a manual car and are half decent at it then you already have the basic knowledge about how to manipulate the clutch, gear shift lever and throttle.

i grew up on a farm driving tractors with manual transmissions (starting from when I was about 10) and when I got my first manual car it was a pretty natural transition. there was a bit of a learning curve, but since I already had a pretty good grasp on how to drive stick, it didn't take long to get sorted out.

+1
I wouldn't say that someone without experience with a manual transmission can't grasp the concepts, but IMHO its easier. From what I've witnessed quite a few new riders immediately dump the clutch thinking its an all or nothing effect. Having to start and hold a car on an incline is a good background. Same thing with a choke. Often they will ride away with the choke pulled out and simply forget about it.
As for the OP, if you can pick up an old Hondamatic, its fully auto. Otherwise, you're pretty well left with scooters or other strange beasts like the Ridley, CMI Vagabond.
I agree with the other poster: a large part of the fun of riding is controlling the machine & that means upshifting, downshifting, front & rear braking & engine braking. Otherwise just take the car instead.

[Aslan]

I'm going to agree. It gives them a better IDEA of friction zone, shifting in the power band, and a smooth timely release...

Agreed, though results will vary wildly based on amount variety of vehicles experienced and engine sizes.

My old CRX with I/H/E modifications was much easier to stall than the Civic I took lessons in but smoothly handled was much more fun, having more sound to work with and less weight will be closer aligned to what is experienced on a bike, in my opinion. I bet rear wheel drive could contribute too but don't have enough experience to back that up.

Comparing those older cars to say, a Sunfire or even a modern Altima and I can see how someone could get much less transferable skills out of the car, but still not none.

[Pesticide]

I have driving a manual car and recently taken up riding a motorcycle. I found understanding the mechanics of driving stick to be very usefull. The nice thing is that you already know about shifting and can pay attention to riding and what is going on around you. It all comes fairly naturally.

[bdearlove]

I avoided MC's because I had no experience with a manual transmission so stuck with scooters. I eventually took a MC course and was surprised how easy it was to learn, I have since moved to a Manual motorcycle.
I would say take the course and see if you like it or not. It is not for everyone and there are days I wish I had an automatic.

You mentioned a trike? Are you avoiding manual due to an injury or disability which makes shifting difficult? If so, there are some larger trikes which are partially automatic and of course the Spyder which to me is the best looking trike.

The Mana is fully automatic and has received good reviews. Most Aprilia shops have one in their showroom. You can also look at larger scooters also which can be great for touring or puttering around.

[teflon]

Im very surprised some of you are saying there is little relation to a standard/manual car and shifting on a bike..

I personally just started riding, been on the road for a week now. I also know how to drive stick..

The skills I have driving stick helped me a thousand times over figuring out the clutch.. it was easy.. came naturally..

They are fundamentally the exact same.. so what if they are a clutch lever, and shift lever.. like come on! they are identical..

My friend had a lot more trouble understanding the friction zone with his bike due to not knowing how to drive a standard car..

In my opinion it helpd more than anything else I can think of.

BUT! it isnt hard to learn if you cant drive stick..

Letting the clutch out SUPER slowly for a newbie with NO throttle is one of the best ways to start to understand it..

Or as another poster said, even with the engine off, and in first..

Trying to separate the two is pointless.. they are effectively the same thing..

[SweetOnion]

hehe, and here I was always thinking that DCT stood for Dual Clutch Transmission... thanks for the clarification!!

no need.
2010 VFR1200FA DCT
2010 Honda VFR 1200F (Dual Clutch Automatic Transmission)



ready to ride.

[GreyGhost]

The Mana is fully automatic and has received good reviews. Most Aprilia shops have one in their showroom. You can also look at larger scooters also which can be great for touring or puttering around.

Cycle World compared the Shiver (standard 750) to the Mana (Automatic 850) at the track. The Mana is much heavier (~90lbs) and much less powerful (~20hp). They were getting faster lap consistent lap times out of the Mana due to always being in the right gear and less to worry about. Personally I like shifting, but the automatic does have significant advantages in certain situations.

http://www.cycleworld.com/article.as...article_id=866

Boss Hoss bikes are automatic (and I am pretty sure they make trikes too).

[jolomatic]

Let's not forget about the Boss Hoss:
http://www.autotrader.ca/new_cars_Motorcycle_details/Oshawa_Ontario_2009_BOSS%2bHOSS_LS3_667150.html?sr cID=5&frnID=6981827&ms=motorcycles_atvs&cofid=2009 1110082957942&prv=Ontario&r=40

Two speed auto trans, with a (Chevy?) V8 engine! w00t! w00t!

That and some scooters and other odd balls.

So the answer to the original question is NO!

But: you should learn anyways, for many reasons.
Having driven manual cars/trucks/tractors first would make it easier, but I learned on a dirtbike, so you can easily pick it up on whatever vehicle.

[Rotten_Ronnie]

Do you need an M license to operate a trike in the province of Ontario?Is there a school that teaches to an M2 using only automatic moto's?This is what we need to know before we sell the OP a bike. :P

[elizabeth232]

even if there was a popular automatic bike, lets be honest, unless ur sitting in stop-n-go traffic, riding is just more fun bc its manual. theres alot more get up 'n go

[zoomerthe1]

Let's not forget about the Boss Hoss:
http://www.autotrader.ca/new_cars_Mo...v=Ontario&r=40

Two speed auto trans, with a (Chevy?) V8 engine! w00t! w00t!

The Boss Hoss really isn't a practical machine. I sat on some display models at the dealership that was on Weston Rd. It makes the HD Roadking feel like a rollerskate. The dealership has gone out of business, but there appears to be one in Oshawa. If you ever dropped the thing you'd need a rescue tow truck to right it.

[teflon]

The Boss Hoss really isn't a practical machine. I sat on some display models at the dealership that was on Weston Rd. It makes the HD Roadking feel like a rollerskate. The dealership has gone out of business, but there appears to be one in Oshawa. If you ever dropped the thing you'd need a rescue tow truck to right it.

that is the ugliest POS I've ever saw..

[GreyGhost]

Do you need an M license to operate a trike in the province of Ontario?Is there a school that teaches to an M2 using only automatic moto's?This is what we need to know before we sell the OP a bike. :P

The way I understood it in the past is you need an M. If you show up for your M2 exit test with a trike, your M is restricted to a trike, if you show up with a sidecar, your M is restricted to a sidecar, if you show up on a two wheeled bike, you can ride anything.

Apparently all trikes (except Piaggio MP3) require an M. I think the G2 does not require an M as you sit in it, not on it, but I could be wrong.
http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dan...ing/#tricycles

Personally I think you should not be able to ride a sidecar or trike without some kind of training or endorsement as it's completely different, but that's the way the rules work(ed?).

[Rotten_Ronnie]

The way I understood it in the past is you need an M. If you show up for your M2 exit test with a trike, your M is restricted to a trike, if you show up with a sidecar, your M is restricted to a sidecar, if you show up on a two wheeled bike, you can ride anything.

Apparently all trikes (except Piaggio MP3) require an M. I think the G2 does not require an M as you sit in it, not on it, but I could be wrong.
http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dan...ing/#tricycles

Personally I think you should not be able to ride a sidecar or trike without some kind of training or endorsement as it's completely different, but that's the way the rules work(ed?).

So you could write your M1 at a DriveTest centre, purchase an automatic vehicle and arrange to take a Ministry M1Exit Examination, then arrange to take a Ministry M2Exit examination all on your automatic trike.Does your insurance company require a motorcycle safety course?

[bobjohnson]

Do you need an M license to operate a trike in the province of Ontario?Is there a school that teaches to an M2 using only automatic moto's?This is what we need to know before we sell the OP a bike. :P

Im pretty sure RTI has scooters you can use for the testing. I could be wrong, but i dont think so. They asked during the in class training session if anyone was getting an LM2, and they had 1 scooter during the practical training which i believe is to be used if anyones only getting the LM2. Im sure they have more if they had to bring some in, but no one used it in our class.

[Fingolfin]

I disagree with this statement.

if you have experience driving a manual car and are half decent at it then you already have the basic knowledge about how to manipulate the clutch, gear shift lever and throttle.

i grew up on a farm driving tractors with manual transmissions (starting from when I was about 10) and when I got my first manual car it was a pretty natural transition. there was a bit of a learning curve, but since I already had a pretty good grasp on how to drive stick, it didn't take long to get sorted out.

you completely ignore the first part of what i wrote

the THEORY is important, all of what you've writen, the friction point on a tractor isn't going to help you determine the friction point on a motorcycle.

its the UNDERSTANDING of what a friction point is that will help you.
You don't need to know know how to drive stick to learn to ride a motorcycle, plain and simple..

[CRAZYBUBBA]

Wow, I had never imagined that I'd get so many responses.

I think I'll be registering for a course with learning curves and plan to take my M1 immediately before that. While I much prefer trikes, the experience of doing driving school on a two-wheeler will be invaluable since it'll help me become a safer, more confident driver.

I'm very much attracted to the extra space, traditional styling and stability of trikes like the Honda Goldwing and Harley Tri-glide ultra classic. I also like the extra width because alot of bonehead drivers like to pretend that bikers are invisible.

I don't think that it's possible for me to get anything similar for under $3000, even on the used motorcycle market, so I'll likely be getting a two-wheeler after my m-2.

[Brian P]

Something in your above post needs to be corrected before you go down an uninformed path. Don't be fooled; a trike is only more stable than a motorcycle when it is sitting at a standstill (or has a wheel locked up and sliding). When in motion, they have some, err, "unusual" handling characteristics. The two-wheels-in-front arrangement (Can-Am Spyder) is more stable than the single wheel in front arrangement of the typical Goldwing or Harley conversion, and even so, Bombardier saw fit to install a stability control system that can't be turned off (and from what I've heard, is quite intrusive). Trikes of the single-wheel-in-front arrangement are very prone to rolling over, and to my knowledge, none of them have any form of stability control. A couple of years back, there was a rash of fatal crashes in one year on the Deal's Gap road (google it if you don't know what it is) and most of them involved trikes rolling over, despite trikes being an extremely small percentage of the traffic there. All-terrain-vehicles of the one-wheel-in-front trike arrangement were outlawed many years ago due to excessive numbers of roll-overs.

The inherent stability issue with a two-wheeler ... that it falls over if you lock the front wheel during hard braking ... can be dealt with nowadays by other means - buy a bike that has ABS.

I'd recommend staying with two wheels and getting through the manual-transmission deal, unless there is some pressing reason to do otherwise (physical disability, etc).

The Piaggio MP3 scooter is an interesting device, that maintains most of the handling characteristics of a two-wheeler but is more stable during braking and on questionable surfaces. It is legally considered to be a two-wheeled machine because the two front wheels are closely spaced (and it leans in corners like a two-wheeler).

[SweetOnion]

^ now, that was an excellent post.