Reply With QuoteHockey is a contact sport ...Originally Posted by Smokeandapancake
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Well then, at what point does a hockey fight become an assault or cause disturbance?? What about a body check?? When is a slash with stick during a game, a criminal offence???
Hockey is a contact sport ...
Show me in the criminal code where it states that.
The point to this is, that unless something CRAZY, BLANTANT and DANGEROUS happens in a game or on a race track, it does not fall under the Criminal Code.
So is stock car racing.
Rubbins racin!!!
I am happy with this as a standard. I hate when people talk about police getting involved in sport incident (unless its to such a degree that it is no longer sport)
Smokey I agree with you. However there is nothing in the way the law is written to look at some of the things that happen at the race track and charging the individual with dangerous operation of a motor vehicle. I don't like it when politics/police get involved with sport. Private leagues should be self governing, unless the league asks for assistance in a severe case. However the way thing are written now, all you need is someone who is a little power happy to open a huge can of worms. THere is nothing preventing this from happening.
This phrase in the dangerous driving law protects against being charged with dangerous driving in connection with normal racing activities ON a race track.
having regard to all the circumstances, including the nature, condition and use of the place at which the motor vehicle is being operated"Sport" in Canada is still a collection of people engaging in an activity on Canadian soil. Are you suggesting that self-defined groups of people, whether they be sports leagues, gated communities, or religious groups should be somehow exempt from Canadian law?
Realistically, while there may be little or nothing keeping "someone who is a little power happy" from opening a can of worms, there are plenty enough checks and balances in the system to quickly close that can of worms if need be.
How many sports-related prosecutions have you heard of in Canada over the past several years? And how many were completely unwarranted?
Instead of whining about what "might" happen, try looking at what "does" actually happen in the normal course of affairs in the real world. Otherwise you're no different than those cringing in their cellars because they fear a meteor might fall from the sky.
Moderator
In the last 2-3 years? I can think of two in junior level hockey, with a third potentially coming in a week or two. From what I can remember both the previous charges were warranted (one in Vancouver, BC and one Southampton, Ontario).
Morally Ambiguous (submissions welcome)
"Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth." - Oscar Wilde
Dealer/Vendor
Just to add to the "what they can do argument". Last year during one of our endurance races we had an incident where a bike went down and a rider was injured. We called in a EMS from the local area. Along with them came four OPP cruisers.
The rider was boarded and loaded before the OPP even got there. We had the bike picked up, track cleared and were ready to resume.
I couldnt get the OPP to get off my track. After 20 minutes of bull$$$$ they finally removed the cruisers (then we got to clean up oil they were dripping). The Sarg asked me to come talk before they left the facility.
I was told that it was a "Crime Scene" and the track was theirs as long as they wanted and they would release it when they damn well pleased. I asked under what law was this applied. The response was that when they are called in they own the track. It was explained that in case of serious injury where death may occur it must be investigated.
I explained that this was a race and we get crashes daily and this is the way they are handled. BTW the rider while busted up some was not in any danger of expiring. I also told them that I did not request OPP. I also suggested if they were so concerned in what we were up to that maybe they shold have popped in the previous day when a rider landed a bad wheelie and slammed the concrete wall and knocked himself out.
They then threatened me with "Obstruct a police investigation" because I moved the bike before they arrived. I told them to "bring it" as I would take my chances that a judge would see how freakin rediculous this is.
Long story short if they want be aholes they can and will be. Power tripping cops can be completely unreasonable if they want best to stroke their ego's just to make them go away.
The 2 women were quite HOT! The catcalls to take out their cuffs didn't seem to have the desired affect... lol.
Would that be considered stroking of the ego??
R e a d S l o w l y ! - Children at Play.
Hold on a second, that just sets the expectations that their ego's should be stroked. I think in incidents like this complaints should be filed about them not knowing the law. Sometimes their ego's of we can do what we want when we want should be deflated.
x
Moderator
The truth is that they're right regarding their ability to investigate, even during a race weekend. What was lacking, was people skills.
Those of us who spend a significant amount of the season at Shannonville have learnt to dread the arrival of OPP at the track, not for fear of getting attitude, but for what it means regarding the people involved in a crash.
Morally Ambiguous (submissions welcome)
"Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth." - Oscar Wilde
Do they lay charges on people that crash on private property?
x
That was some serious BS! I was wondering what the story was when this was happening, and I was hoping it wasnt what I thought it was at the time....However I see now that it is exactly what I thought it was. Just a bunch of cops with nothing better to do then make themselfs feel special, by inconveniencing the good people trying to have fun...
Same old story, doesn't matter where you go, big city or small town...Makes me sick!
Last edited by JohnnyP636; 01-27-2010 at 11:38 AM.
Moderator
I've not heard of charges being laid, but they have to at least investigate in such a case. They would want to state "death due to misadventure"; in other words not do to crime or negligence.
Morally Ambiguous (submissions welcome)
"Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth." - Oscar Wilde
They can if there is a criminal degree of negligence or a wilful criminal act involved.
Regardless, whenever there is a death not due to natural causes, police must investigate to determine cause of death and the circumstances surrounding it. Their mandate also extends to investigating instances of severe or unknown injury that may result in the victim succumbing to death later. Of course once an investigation begins, they're going to finish it even if the victim later turns out to be not as seriously hurt as first suspected.
This is why highways are often closed for hours following a serious crash, even if nobody was actually pronounced dead on scene. If you don't gather all available evidence at the time and the victim later dies, you will not get another chance to gather untainted evidence. Renewed traffic will obliterate potential evidence. This is just as true for race tracks as it is for highways.
Last edited by turbodish; 01-27-2010 at 01:10 PM.
You cannot be charged under the HTA while on private property. The HTA covers the "Queen's" highways, and not private property.
http://www.police.sudbury.on.ca/traffic/rec_veh.php
Last edited by SlowNLow; 01-27-2010 at 09:14 PM.
Ohhh Gawd..... does it every stop.... pathetic whining....
Moderator
SlowNLow, you weren't there, I was. The OPP spent a whole lot of time sitting on the track doing nothing, after the rider and bike were already out of there. They were not outside their vehicles taking measurements or taking pictures, they were not taking statements from witnesses, or doing anything that couldn't have been done with their vehicles off the track surface. It was an absolutely unnecessary delay.
I've got nothing against them taking statements from witnesses etc just in case ... but even with that, those witnesses were in the paddock, not on the track. They could have cleared their vehicles off the track much earlier than they did.
Dangerous operation of a motor vehicle.
Criminal negligence in the operation of a motor vehicle.
Impaired driving.
Blow over 80.
Refuse to provide blood or breath sample.
Operate motor vehicle while disqualified.
How is that for a start? All are Criminal Code offences and apply to private property, your own home property and race tracks included.
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