Street racing unconstitutional appeal time?

[RumbleMe]

It was 9 months ago since my street racing ticket was issued. I understand the unconstitutional part is being appealed, but how long will this take?

What is happening with all the tickets in the system right now?
Can I request my ticket be thrown in the mean time?
Do I have to wait and see what happens with the appeal?
If the appeal takes "forever" can I rely on the 11b charter?

[Cafe Racer]

I would not rely on the 11b charter - i would come up with a better defence then that. If not already done so i would get some legal help with this one.

[Rob MacLennan]

Agreed; you want a legal professional involved. I've heard no news regarding the appeal and don't look for it to be handled overnight. Nine months is generally seen as insufficient time for a 11b filing, unless you're in Podunk nowhere.

If you're set on defending yourself (a mistake, IMHO) and your trial date is coming up quickly, you could try citing the Napanee decision as precedent and hope the JP will toss the charge.

*EDIT* You may want to look over this recent judgment that addresses being charged for something other than the simple speed section of HTA172. The judgment discusses actus rea and mens rea, as pertains to the possible charges.

http://www.canlii.org/en/on/oncj/doc...009oncj447.pdf

[RumbleMe]

Just to clarify I do have representation and I do have a defense setup. I just want this over with already....I think they are pushing back court dates until the Appeals decision is made.

[moto22]

Just to clarify I do have representation and I do have a defense setup. I just want this over with already....I think they are pushing back court dates until the Appeals decision is made.

Then good, hope your court date goes over a year then you should be good for a 11B filling....

[RumbleMe]

Finally after 16 months I had my trial today. Apparently my 11b was waived without me knowing about it. Either way it has been a long stressful situation and I was glad to get it over with.

I was cleared of the stunting charge and was not even given a reduced ticket ( I admitted to speeding ).

The officer had me on the radar at 129kms and hour and then followed me for 10kms "pushing" me to go faster. At one point he got right on my tail end and I was forced to speed up and get out of his way. Keep in mind the speed limit is 100kms on this speedway and by the end of the 10kms I had no idea what this "driver" was doing. Yes, he was in an unmarked car and did not have his lights on until the very end. He stated that he paced me for 600meters at 170kmh yet from where I started to speed up to get away and where I was actually pulled over was a total distance of 1000meters. He stated my speed was at least 170kmh if not faster, but if you work out the math with the distance you will see that that is not possible once you add the distance it would take him to catch me and the distance for me to slow down for such a high rate of speed.

The JP seemed to have a real problem with the officers tactics of when he actually pulled me over and when he should have pulled me over. A speeding ticket turned into a stunting ticket by him making me go faster to keep a safe distance. Yes I was going faster, but I was not going anywhere near 170kmh and I am glad the JP saw this and made a proper decision.

Very happy to get this behind me and thought I would post my results since I got such good information from this site about this new ******** law.

Since I am not guilty what are the chances of me getting any money back from the impound fee and lawyer fees?

[Wheelieboy]

No chance of getting your money back.

I always see a grey unmarked crown vic using this tactic on the 410.

[apstndp]

I wonder if anyone has ever tried suing the cops and their unions for this law once they get cleared.

[Brian P]

It is theoretically possible to sue the police in cases of negligence or malicious prosecution. To this non legal professional (me), negligence wouldn't seem to apply, malicious prosecution might.

Good on the original poster for getting to this point. The police won't stop using tactics like this unless it starts hitting them in the bank account.

[GP_RZ]

well glad u got off....any stunt charge thrown out is a good thing! mine was thrown out a court in 2009.......ur 7 day admin suspension stays on your record and u will get crap from your insurance company....but its not related to a conviction so u are ok, just check out FSCO website on admin suspensions, it took me a month of fighting with primmum to get insurance...I finally threatened them about contacting an ombudsman for them trying to use the admin suspension for my risk factor...they see stunt driving and dont want to deal with u weather u were convicted or not!

[FiReSTaRT]

You might wanna start with a formal complaint to get something on the record before moving on with further legal action.

[nakkers]

Just before the stunt law became effect, I was pushed from an unmarked in my cage on the 401 near Kitchener. I increased my speed so, I could eventually move to the right lane.

The traffic was pacing 120. This unmarked was litterly on my bumper. I could have slowed down to 110 in the far left lane (unsafe for the left lane) or just kept pace at 120 but, I felt very uncomfortable to have this tail gater and the traffic was too close together to safely move over.

Once I did move over, the cop drove up beside me and wagged his finger at me in a tisk tisk motion and kept going.

I'm happy I didn't ge a ticket or have to defend myself but, I can remember this like yesterday and can't believe how this cop was driving more agressively than anything I've every encountered personally.

And this is why I don't feel they should have self discression to seize our property on site and without a trial.

[Metastable]

Wow that's crazy! I think it will be hard for you to get your money back. I think filing a formal complaint is a good idea as well. Try to sue the dude..... they will probably keep delaying and postponing the court case until it costs you even more money unless you get a lawyer helping you pro-bono.

[murf]

I like hitting the brakes in those situations

[Rob MacLennan]

I like hitting the brakes in those situations

Brake checking someone is stunting.

[FiReSTaRT]

Brake checking someone is stunting.

And even if you can convince the JP that you tapped the brakes because you saw a raccoon about to run in front of you, you are still out $1000 for towing and impound in addition to a couple of g-notes in legal fees. A more dangerous but more easily defendable action (with the same explanation) would be to REALLY slam on the brakes and then get yourself the meanest, toughest ambulance-chaser you can lay your hands on to go after the service for property damage, pain and suffering and soft tissue injuries due to the constable's reckless actions. Any time off work can be explained by the boss by saying "a cop was going crazy, without his sirens on and slammed into the back of my car." Of course, I would not do it or tell anyone to do it, but such a scenario would in most cases better for a victim of such police abuse than a brake-check scenario

[FiReSTaRT]

By the way, Rob, wouldn't slowing down to speed limit also constitute stunting?

8. Driving a motor vehicle without due care and attention, without reasonable consideration for other persons using the highway or in a manner that may endanger any person by,
.
.
.
ii. stopping or slowing down a motor vehicle in a manner that indicates the driver’s sole intention in stopping or slowing down is to interfere with the movement of another vehicle by cutting off its passage on the highway or to cause another vehicle to stop or slow down in circumstances where the other vehicle would not ordinarily do so,

[Rob MacLennan]

No, it would be slowing to comply with the speed limit, as long as it wasn't done rapidly.

My usual tactic, when being tailgated, is to hit the hazard lights. If the other driver doesn't back off, I then start to gradually slow down. Sometimes they don't notice how much they've slowed down, until they're 20 under their previous speed.

I really wish that the police forces and JPs would come down heavily on officers who pull this 'pushing' crap. Performing a dangerous act, in order to try and get innocent citizens to perform another dangerous act, isn't the sort of thing that should be condoned through inaction.

[FiReSTaRT]

I really wish that the police forces and JPs would come down heavily on officers who pull this 'pushing' crap. Performing a dangerous act, in order to try and get innocent citizens to perform another dangerous act, isn't the sort of thing that should be condoned through inaction.

And I wish for world peace and love Bottom line is that this sort of behavior is good for their bottom line, so they'll ignore it in public and pat the constable on the back in private.

[Smokeandapancake]

No, it would be slowing to comply with the speed limit, as long as it wasn't done rapidly.

My usual tactic, when being tailgated, is to hit the hazard lights. If the other driver doesn't back off, I then start to gradually slow down. Sometimes they don't notice how much they've slowed down, until they're 20 under their previous speed.

I really wish that the police forces and JPs would come down heavily on officers who pull this 'pushing' crap. Performing a dangerous act, in order to try and get innocent citizens to perform another dangerous act, isn't the sort of thing that should be condoned through inaction.

Well everyone it happens to should go make a formal complaint, not just come here and ***** about it.