Parking on Islands at Fairview mall

So today I was having a beer and wings at St. Louis at Fairview, noticed a guy on a bike park just on the concrete island in front of the restaurant and run into the mall. Few minutes later as I was walking out a "Mall Security" is writing him a ticket, he was already placing it on the bike. I approach the guy and asked him why he was doing that and he started referencing some Ontario Law which i did not care about. I told him the reason I asked was because I also ride and I usually take a parking spot and find drivers dislike this because we take such a small space, and parking on the island will leave a parking spot open for another customer to access the mall, he said "this is not a parking spot and you cant park here, take the parking spot all for yourself we don't care, you are doing a good thing by taking a full parking spot".

So just a heads up this was a real ticket or it seem like a real one, so stay off the islands at Fairview mall, park at a parking spot, if you ride as a group take one parking spot each so the "Security Mall" has no excuses to tag you.

Just saying.
A

who cares what drivers like or dislike? take a spot, it's your right. if you did everything drivers liked you wouldn't be riding.

I know, I know.. I was trying to make up an excuse to see what he would say about it. I always take a parking spot and will keep on doing it rain or shine.

Mall security doesn't have the authority to issue city parking tickets so you don't have to pay them and they won't affect your license renewal... AFAIK. They can, however, send the ticket to collections to come after you. I don't know whether this would have any impact on your credit history (would be interested to know). Whether they would do this or not over a few bucks is the gamble. Doesn't stop me either.

The mall cop was likely just bored and wanted to exercise his "authority".

I've always wondered about this at Scarborough Town Center.. In front of forever 21 theres that huge island where I use to always see bikes parked before I started riding. Last time I went I didnt see any bikes there so I didnt park, just in case. Its an awesome parking spot as its close to the mall entrance and idiots in their cars cant really knock it over. It's also in a busy area so less chance of a white van pulling up.

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Originally Posted by AF4iK

Mall security doesn't have the authority to issue city parking tickets so you don't have to pay them and they won't affect your license renewal... AFAIK. They can, however, send the ticket to collections to come after you. I don't know whether this would have any impact on your credit history (would be interested to know). Whether they would do this or not over a few bucks is the gamble. Doesn't stop me either.

The mall cop was likely just bored and wanted to exercise his "authority".

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if a mall security guard is authorized by the city to do so, they can write city of toronto parking tickets.
last i heard, most mall security guards in toronto do in fact have this authority.

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Originally Posted by DOHC1

I've always wondered about this at Scarborough Town Center.. In front of forever 21 theres that huge island where I use to always see bikes parked before I started riding. Last time I went I didnt see any bikes there so I didnt park, just in case. Its an awesome parking spot as its close to the mall entrance and idiots in their cars cant really knock it over. It's also in a busy area so less chance of a white van pulling up.

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I always park there too, but as far away from the fire hydrant as possible.

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Originally Posted by BusaBob

if a mall security guard is authorized by the city to do so, they can write city of toronto parking tickets.
last i heard, most mall security guards in toronto do in fact have this authority.

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Oh, ok I stand corrected. Probably still won't stop me from parking there :D

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Originally Posted by BusaBob

if a mall security guard is authorized by the city to do so, they can write city of toronto parking tickets.
last i heard, most mall security guards in toronto do in fact have this authority.

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They can also issue trespass notices, which could be even worse to deal with.

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Originally Posted by AF4iK

Mall security doesn't have the authority to issue city parking tickets so you don't have to pay them and they won't affect your license renewal... AFAIK. They can, however, send the ticket to collections to come after you. I don't know whether this would have any impact on your credit history (would be interested to know). Whether they would do this or not over a few bucks is the gamble. Doesn't stop me either.

The mall cop was likely just bored and wanted to exercise his "authority".

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Yes they do, it is an 8 hours course in the parking enforcement HQ in don mills and York mills, it is called a tagging license and I did have one before (10 years ago). However they limit the reasons you can tag for to 2 or 3. We didn't tag citing city rules, we tagged citing the private property act IIRC. We could only tag in certified sites by the city (most malls are certified). And pke can come and tag in those sites if they wanted to, I got tagged for parking in the fire route while issuing tags myself (poetic justice I know). If it was a yellow ticket with the city of Toronto header, then you have to pay it. If it was a white ticket, you don't have to pay it but they will harass you to pay it by the collection agency.

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Originally Posted by MadPoet

Yes they do, it is an 8 hours course in the parking enforcement HQ in don mills and York mills, it is called a tagging license and I did have one before (10 years ago). However they limit the reasons you can tag for to 2 or 3. We didn't tag citing city rules, we tagged citing the private property act IIRC. We could only tag in certified sites by the city (most malls are certified). And pke can come and tag in those sites if they wanted to, I got tagged for parking in the fire route while issuing tags myself (poetic justice I know). If it was a yellow ticket with the city of Toronto header, then you have to pay it. If it was a white ticket, you don't have to pay it but they will harass you to pay it by the collection agency.

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Good to know, thanks for the info! What about parking in the lot but on those yellow striped areas that aren't really spots?

I say the guy parked on the center island so idiot drivers don't cream his bike in a regular spot.
Most malls have lots of extra space where they could put moto-specific parking, but that would mean someone would be doing their job correctly in Ontario, and that just won't do. :razz:

If you want to be a mall security guard, you have to be narrow minded, lack all logic and common sense, and be rude while trying to bully people around.
In general, they are just angry because they failed high sKool.
Most bar bouncers are more professional.

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Originally Posted by AF4iK

Good to know, thanks for the info! What about parking in the lot but on those yellow striped areas that aren't really spots?

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Striped areas are generally signed as no parking, or as fire routes. As a result you could get an even worse ticket.

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Originally Posted by Rob MacLennan

Striped areas are generally signed as no parking, or as fire routes. As a result you could get an even worse ticket.

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Even the small areas around the light posts? I park in those quite often

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Originally Posted by DOHC1

Even the small areas around the light posts? I park in those quite often

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You mean the ones that are between other parking spots? They may not be signed, but I wouldn't really want to park there either.

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Originally Posted by eljay

who cares what drivers like or dislike? take a spot, it's your right. if you did everything drivers liked you wouldn't be riding.

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sure its your right, but parking on the island harms no one and helps everyone.

remember that incident where someone with a cbr125r parked in a spot at pacific mall and people literally moved the bike out of the way?

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Originally Posted by Kuro

sure its your right, but parking on the island harms no one and helps everyone.

remember that incident where someone with a cbr125r parked in a spot at pacific mall and people literally moved the bike out of the way?

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lol agreed. In a busy lot it's just a courtesy that would be win-win if it weren't for the pointless tickets.

About the stripes, I was referring to the spots at the end of some rows. Usually when the roadway is somewhat curved and there isn't space to paint another full spot. I've never seen them signed.

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Originally Posted by Kuro

sure its your right, but parking on the island harms no one and helps everyone.

remember that incident where someone with a cbr125r parked in a spot at pacific mall and people literally moved the bike out of the way?

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They generally stop doing that when an alarm goes off.

The mall in Waterloo actually has motorcycle/scooter/ebike parking. And it's close to the entrance. It's nice I wish that they had these spots everywhere.

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Originally Posted by AF4iK

Good to know, thanks for the info! What about parking in the lot but on those yellow striped areas that aren't really spots?

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The private property act based tickets are something like "parking a vehicle on private property without consent", that makes it a multi purpose type ticket unlike "expired meter" or "invalid sticker" which are very specific tickets.

The site has to be certified in order to enforce parking regulations, most likely those spots will be labelled, signed, or otherwise not enforced. If you get a ticket challenge it if there were no signs.

I personally won't park on the shaded areas/spots.

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Originally Posted by MadPoet

The private property act based tickets are something like "parking a vehicle on private property without consent", that makes it a multi purpose type ticket unlike "expired meter" or "invalid sticker" which are very specific tickets.

The site has to be certified in order to enforce parking regulations, most likely those spots will be labelled, signed, or otherwise not enforced. If you get a ticket challenge it if there were no signs.

I personally won't park on the shaded areas/spots.

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i agree, that places were you can and can not park require proper signage

however, they don't need a sign to say motorcycles can't park on sidewalks or in a manner that would prohibit pedestrian traffic

In Brampton this is a big *** ticket item: ACCESS AISLES

those striped lines on the pavement in Brampton have set fines of $300.00 payable to the City

however, an access aisle also constitutes walkways, so anything that would interfere with the movement of people, especially with disabilities would result in that $300.00 fine

http://img848.imageshack.us/img848/8879/okays.jpg

this is an example of someone getting an obstruct access aisle ticket; all they needed to do was touch the yellow line

http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/5913/300aq.jpg

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Originally Posted by AGAVE

If you want to be a mall security guard, you have to be narrow minded, lack all logic and common sense, and be rude while trying to bully people around.
In general, they are just angry because they failed high sKool.
Most bar bouncers are more professional.

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Actually, most wouldn't give a flying **** where you shove your bike.
But the owners and shopkeepers have an image to maintain.
Motorcycles parking on the islands, isn't part of that image.
How upset do you think they'd be if they lost your business, and you parked out front of the competition, scaring away its customers?

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Originally Posted by AGAVE

I say the guy parked on the center island so idiot drivers don't cream his bike in a regular spot.
Most malls have lots of extra space where they could put moto-specific parking, but that would mean someone would be doing their job correctly in Ontario, and that just won't do. :razz:

If you want to be a mall security guard, you have to be narrow minded, lack all logic and common sense, and be rude while trying to bully people around.
In general, they are just angry because they failed high sKool.
Most bar bouncers are more professional.

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Don't get me started on mall parking...

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Originally Posted by AGAVE

I say the guy parked on the center island so idiot drivers don't cream his bike in a regular spot.
Most malls have lots of extra space where they could put moto-specific parking, but that would mean someone would be doing their job correctly in Ontario, and that just won't do. :razz:

If you want to be a mall security guard, you have to be narrow minded, lack all logic and common sense, and be rude while trying to bully people around.
In general, they are just angry because they failed high sKool.
Most bar bouncers are more professional.

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I used to think like that until I worked as a security guard in a mall for exactly 3 days. The amount of BS I dealt with in those days made me think twice about working in a mall again. From the fire and safety, to the crowd control "Christmas", to the lunch hour and high school gangs wanna be, to the shoplifters and ****** off customers and vendors. Then to get the people to leave when the mall closes, that's another ball game.

Even while issuing tags for dicks parking in the handicapped parking spots, you get spit on, told off, cursed at and all for $8-$12/hr and all you can really do is ask them to leave. Anyone who has to do that job, no matter how nice of a person you are, in due time you will start loosing patience. I don't agree that any of them should be rude under any circumstances, but sure as hell I understand why.

Isn't Fairview where this happened to a security guard?
http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/ar...-mall-shooting

Erin Mills has motorcycle specific parking as well. Not always open though.

Attachment 28438

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Originally Posted by budgetracing

Erin Mills has motorcycle specific parking as well. Not always open though.

Attachment 28438

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That figures...

The moral of this thread is, beware of the mall parking lot drivers in Ontario and don't ever take a job as a security guard. :book:

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Originally Posted by MadPoet

I used to think like that until I worked as a security guard in a mall for exactly 3 days. The amount of BS I dealt with in those days made me think twice about working in a mall again. From the fire and safety, to the crowd control "Christmas", to the lunch hour and high school gangs wanna be, to the shoplifters and ****** off customers and vendors. Then to get the people to leave when the mall closes, that's another ball game.

Even while issuing tags for dicks parking in the handicapped parking spots, you get spit on, told off, cursed at and all for $8-$12/hr and all you can really do is ask them to leave. Anyone who has to do that job, no matter how nice of a person you are, in due time you will start loosing patience. I don't agree that any of them should be rude under any circumstances, but sure as hell I understand why.

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I think they have to remember that they're only getting paid $8-$12/hr..and act accordingly. A security guard tried to "apprehend" a friend of mine and my friend knocked him out. The police were called and the guard wanted the guy charged with assault and was making all kinds of threats..the police told him to shut up or they'd let my friend hit him again! :-) My point is, for $12/hr, I'm sitting back and calling the po-po..

I agree that security guards should act accordingly and not go on power trips, but when they are issuing tickets or asking people to leave, they're just doing their job so don't hate on them or look down on them (same goes for police officers and parking enforcers IMHO). And please, don't be so judgmental.

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Originally Posted by invictus43

I think they have to remember that they're only getting paid $8-$12/hr..and act accordingly. A security guard tried to "apprehend" a friend of mine and my friend knocked him out. The police were called and the guard wanted the guy charged with assault and was making all kinds of threats..the police told him to shut up or they'd let my friend hit him again! :-) My point is, for $12/hr, I'm sitting back and calling the po-po..

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I understand that there are a lot of arrogant cops wanna be type of guards out there. But the vast majority of guards are simply doing their duties, and part of those duties is to use as much force as necessary to remove undesirables from private properties, simply asking someone to leave politely doesn't work all of the time. You can't call the police every night when trying to lock up because someone is mouthing off and refusing to leave. Most of the time people just obey and leave, and there are times where you need to throw someone out.

For your friend to get to the point of getting apprehended, either the guard was just an idiot who did not do his best to resolve it nicely or your friend is just a piece of work. From what you said the guard did not respect the presence of the police officers, and for them to tell him to shut up then he really got on their nerves. 9 out of 10 times cops are on the side of the guards if they are simply trying to do their job. Like nv_-me said, don't hate on them for doing just that.

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Originally Posted by MadPoet

I understand that there are a lot of arrogant cops wanna be type of guards out there. But the vast majority of guards are simply doing their duties, and part of those duties is to use as much force as necessary to remove undesirables from private properties, simply asking someone to leave politely doesn't work all of the time. You can't call the police every night when trying to lock up because someone is mouthing off and refusing to leave. Most of the time people just obey and leave, and there are times where you need to throw someone out.

For your friend to get to the point of getting apprehended, either the guard was just an idiot who did not do his best to resolve it nicely or your friend is just a piece of work. From what you said the guard did not respect the presence of the police officers, and for them to tell him to shut up then he really got on their nerves. 9 out of 10 times cops are on the side of the guards if they are simply trying to do their job. Like nv_-me said, don't hate on them for doing just that.

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I hear ya..I'm not hating really. But they have limited powers..they shouldn't be trying to manhandle someone without identifying themselves or at least starting a dialog. I understand they're just doing a job really..it's more about the poor pay they get and the expectations that are placed on them. It's not fair really.

Yea it's an actual ticket. I received 2 of them when I parked in in the big sidewalk next to the theatre entrance. And as for Town Centre, it's cool with them if you park in the sidewalks. I know that you can park on the side near the entrance of TD and on the side near the entrance of Scotiabank.

Fairview mall Guards are MLEO certified so they write City of Toronto tickets. Most malls owned by Oxford Properties or Cadillac Fairview Corp. have their guards certified to issue City of Toronto tickets.

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Originally Posted by afelotreyu

So today I was having a beer and wings at St. Louis at Fairview, noticed a guy on a bike park just on the concrete island in front of the restaurant and run into the mall. Few minutes later as I was walking out a "Mall Security" is writing him a ticket, he was already placing it on the bike. I approach the guy and asked him why he was doing that and he started referencing some Ontario Law which i did not care about. I told him the reason I asked was because I also ride and I usually take a parking spot and find drivers dislike this because we take such a small space, and parking on the island will leave a parking spot open for another customer to access the mall, he said "this is not a parking spot and you cant park here, take the parking spot all for yourself we don't care, you are doing a good thing by taking a full parking spot".

So just a heads up this was a real ticket or it seem like a real one, so stay off the islands at Fairview mall, park at a parking spot, if you ride as a group take one parking spot each so the "Security Mall" has no excuses to tag you.

Just saying.
A

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Originally Posted by Kuro

... parking on the island harms no one and helps everyone.

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From my experience those concrete islands are there for a reason. They are usually there to control traffic flow and for safety. Take a minute and think of the sight-line of a driver as he approaches that concrete island. He most likely will depend on the space above the concrete island to be clear in order to have an unobstructed view of cross-traffic he's merging into. That is why we can't park our motorcycles there and you can't park your Hummers/SUV there either, even if it is Boxing Day and the parking lot is 'full'.

Same goes with those yellow painted diagonal lines on the pavement they may have at the end of a row of parked cars. They are there to make sure that area is unobstructed so vehicles can easily negotiate the turn at the end of the row. Sometimes I'll drive along to the end of a row and turn, but notice the turn is extremely tight and might even require me to reverse to complete the turn. Often times I'll notice the tightness of the turn is caused by a car has decided to 'create a spot' for himself by parking on yellow painted diagonal lines, and of course that space was designed to be unobstructed for traffic control and everyone's safety.

A Friend f mine works at Cadillac Fairview and their owned Malls (Limeridge and Erinmills Town Centre) have had this problem on Motorcycles parking in/on islands and sidwalks on around their buildings. This is a Fire code or aisle, so they decided to make Parking areas for Motorcycles. I have not seen the Erinmills parking, but the one at Limeridge Mall in Hamilton has cement posts in place so no cars can use the spots, and there is a Cemnt strip for your kickstand....so it doesnt sink into the Pavement and til over. It is also security patrolled more often, and I think it might even have video on it as well.

http://www.limeridge.ca/en/centreinf...s/Parking.aspx

Although strip malls cannot do this, the bigger malls can...maybe make a suggestion to your local mall.