Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Hey guys,
I'm looking to park in the alleyway outside my work. I can definitely get permission from building management, so my concerns are fire and parking violations.
Could someone cite how far I have to be from an entrance/doorway/etc or any hydrant outlets that may be on the wall?
My second question is about parking in the alleyway: There aren't any "no parking" signs, but cars/delivery vans that park there quickly still end up getting tickets. What's the deal with this seemingly grey area?
I'm planning to leave a note on the bike when I park it saying it isn't in violation of blah blah blah & I have permission from building management & I'm wondering if that would even work
Thanks in advance,
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Hard to say, without knowing the specific location. The alley could be zoned as city property, in which case it doesn't matter whose permission you get; you aren't getting it from the city. Some 'alleys' are actually assumed roads, like Okeefe Lane running along the side of Ryerson University's Jorgenson Hall. That means all of the normal on-street parking rules apply.
Read the section titled "Parking offences that do not require signs": http://www.toronto.ca/transportation...egulations.htm
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Private alleys are real grey areas in terms of what works, legal or not. I've had many vehicles ticketed in a private alley by police parking enforcement. Strictly speaking, there should be signage, but any officer I called in was game to see if it stuck without. Property owners can have a private lane included on a patrol route, according to a supervisor I spoke with a few years ago. Blocking doors or other access points will REALLY ruffle feathers and rules be damned. Expect vandalism at that stage.
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob MacLennan
The alley could be zoned as city property, in which case it doesn't matter whose permission you get; you aren't getting it from the city.
Zoning is unrelated to ownership generally. If it's a pulic roadway it can have parking regs applied as per the owner's (City presumably) direction via by-law. If it's a private laneway, the parking regulations are entirely up to the owner(s) of the laneway, access for fire purposes etc. as per your link notwithstanding. OP really needs to find out who owns the laneway.
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Quote:
Originally Posted by
invictus43
Zoning is unrelated to ownership generally. If it's a pulic roadway it can have parking regs applied as per the owner's (City presumably) direction via by-law. If it's a private laneway, the parking regulations are entirely up to the owner(s) of the laneway, access for fire purposes etc. as per your link notwithstanding. OP really needs to find out who owns the laneway.
That could be the case if a single business occupied the laneway but, in Toronto, the majority of such lanes are used by multiple business and, as such, the city governs their use. One occupant cannot be permitted to block access to all.
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob MacLennan
That could be the case if a single business occupied the laneway but, in Toronto, the majority of such lanes are used by multiple business and, as such, the city governs their use. One occupant cannot be permitted to block access to all.
Do you have any reference to this control by the City? Unless they've done a by-law for that laneway in particular, I don't see how they have any legal right to issue tickets. Not saying you're wrong, but if it's private property, I don't think they can issue tickets unless the landowners have given them that right or they've written a by-law to make it happen.
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Quote:
Originally Posted by
invictus43
Do you have any reference to this control by the City? Unless they've done a by-law for that laneway in particular, I don't see how they have any legal right to issue tickets. Not saying you're wrong, but if it's private property, I don't think they can issue tickets unless the landowners have given them that right or they've written a by-law to make it happen.
Presumably they do, as they specifically list "obstruct laneway" as an offence not requiring a sign, but the bylaw search on the Toronto website is crap.
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob MacLennan
Presumably they do, as they specifically list "obstruct laneway" as an offence not requiring a sign, but the bylaw search on the Toronto website is crap.
I've seen the by-law number listed sometimes on No Parking signs in laneways. I don't know how those get issued. I would guess they'd have to have some policy or something that went to council and they'd have to define which laneways it's in effect for. I wonder if it's a blanket by-law? Or are they applied specifically? Interesting.
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Quote:
Originally Posted by
invictus43
I've seen the by-law number listed sometimes on No Parking signs in laneways. I don't know how those get issued. I would guess they'd have to have some policy or something that went to council and they'd have to define which laneways it's in effect for. I wonder if it's a blanket by-law? Or are they applied specifically? Interesting.
If there's a sign, with a bylaw number on it, then that might well be private property or a fire route.
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
As others have said you have to find out who actually owns the lane. The city assumes the top foot of many lanes (pavement and granular base) around buildings as part of development deals. Technically they then own the surface of the lane and the air above it and the developer owns the underground part which may be part of a basement or parking garage.
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Quote:
Originally Posted by
skip
As others have said you have to find out who actually owns the lane. The city assumes the top foot of many lanes (pavement and granular base) around buildings as part of development deals. Technically they then own the surface of the lane and the air above it and the developer owns the underground part which may be part of a basement or parking garage.
Excuse my ignorance, but where would I begin searching like that? I'd imagine it's a city number, but I've no clue where to start/what to google for this sort of thing.
TBH, I was just gonna get permission from the business owner & hope that the taggers didn't call my bluff :laughing8:
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Planning office or the Clerks office should be able to answer you. I would start with planning and a simply inquiry if the lane way is City Property or private.
Re: Legality of Parking in an alleyway
Or call 311 and get directed, as required.
